Gerald: Part Two

Great timing !!!

GG = Future Allstar

  So what is it that Gerald does not do that the other members of the Celtics do? Since you pretty much summed everything Gerald does not do well with “as does everyone on the team”..
  I do agree with the intensity on man to man D not being there but most people with Geralds type game aren’t that way. Look at Tracy and Ray Allen there not in your face defenders. And i think that is what Gerald models his game after. Just my two cents!

Im of the opinion that the offensive explosion by GG in the Cleveland game was due to you first Green article. Keep up the good work.

i didnt even read this one, you completley lost my respect by proclaiming gerald to be the laziest celtic in that last article of yours. gerald has worked so damn hard to improve as much as he has since the beginning of his rookie year, its a terrible insult to even use the word lazy in the same sentence as his name. i guess gerald cant please everyone tho.

"Why he doesn’t get in his man’s shirt is simply a matter of desire to me. "

Neither does Telfair. I’ve written a post on the old board about his horrendous habits, how he slags off his man to help others even when they don’t need it. Maybe it’s a system thing.

i agree w/ both articles (reading beyond the headline)….maybe the best point you made is the whole team is “lazy” on defense.

i wonder if G$ read the article before the game?…he did seem to attack the glass w/ more enthusiasm.

Have you considered that possibly you were just wrong? Have you considered that many Celtics’ fans appreciate the hard work Gerald Green has put in, and the resistance Green has overcome to earn his minutes?

You want respect for your opinions? Then think before you submit, not after everybody has responded with outrage.

Did you watch GG on Lebron? He was up in him and playing great D. Green17 – I’m sorry but the points you are making, must be supported. Who is your favorite player? I’ll guess it’s West:

“West doesn’t hustle enough in on the ball defense. He doesn’t get up in his man’s shirt enough. He makes lazy entry passes (see the two turnovers in the first half against CLE) and then makes out of control plays to try and make up for it (for example the "block” against Denver and the layup that got stuffed against CLE.) If Delonte West wasn’t so lazy – he could be so good, but that’s true for everyone on the team.

See how that works? You could replace GG with most any player and maybe tweak it a bit, and your article wouldn’t change (re: Defense).

The offesnive criticism is more apt, but I think within this offense, GG is told to camp out behind the three point line. For now he needs to either shoot the thre – or take it right to the hole. Since the defense is usually collapsed in the paint when the ball is kicked out, he should shoot most of those. Once he forces the defenses to play his shot it will open up his dribble drive (Lebron was guarding the shot which is why GG blew by him.) In fact the biggest problem the entire team has on offense is not taking their shots when open.

Just because a lot of the celtics play terrible on man defends, doesnt mean Gerald Green couldnt play better…that logic just isnt applicable.

Didnt see the Cleveland game though, did he really play well on Lebron?

If Gerald can shoot close to 50 percent on threes then he should take as many as possible. I actually get frustrated at him for passing up some open shots.

IndeedProceed,

Yes he did a good job on Lebron. My point is – just because the Celtics play bad defense – doesn’t mean that GG is lazy. Since there is some real good objective evidence that he hustles and since subjectively a lot of readers disagree with Green17’s assement that GG is lazy: Green17 should have provided an article with support for his assertion.

Backtracking from the title of his firts article and then pushing forward some very vague criticisms (leaving out the three point criticism which I think is incorrect): is not “aggressive”, doesn’t “hustle” on the ball, “off the ball struggles”. Really? How so? Explain to me examples of what he does that support these. Otherwsie the logic of the argument goes like this:

assertion 1 (not aggressive) & assertion 2 (lacks hustle) & assertion 3 (struggles off ball) THERFORE lazy (or whatever you want to say)

But where is the empirical proof? Statistically MikeDfromNP refuted some of these stats with things like rebound, steal, block rate. Anecdotally I provided evidence of hustle plays and disagreed with Green17 analysis of the plays he cited in article 1. If this article was just to condense his argument from article 1, then it’s fairly condescending – because essentially he’s saying that we were disagreeing with him due to our own misunderstanding. I for one understood (as I think MikeDfronNP did) that Green17’s criticisms were just what he clarified them to be. I still don’t think he’s provided enough support for them.

“So Gerald, great first half. What was the difference that gave you all those points?” – Greg Dickerson at halftime of the Cleveland game.

“Well coach decided to run a play or two for me when I first got in there.” – Gerald.

THAT right there is the big difference in his offensive explosion last night. I also concur on his aggressive defense on Lebron last night, which was great to see. Honestly the Cavs looked pretty lazy. Damn I hope Doc gives him minutes AND plays again.

Perhaps someone is confusing grace and fluidity of motion on the court with laziness. Gerald makes it look easy when he strips, steals, rebounds, drives, and dunks.

Green17,
 you know my feelings on the topic. Watching the game last night made me laugh. To think you were probably going into it hoping he would play lazy ball to prove the point of your article was valid. Glad that worked out for you.

I must admit your first article definetely got under my skin. I remember thinking why would someone take the time to write all this negative stuff about a kid who when given the oppurtunity has shown nothing but improvement in all areas and determination to be very good. Every article I have ever read has always said what a hard worker the kid is and what a great attitude he has. Every game I have seen this year I was amazed to see the support Green showed from the bench for his teammates. The kid has talent oozing out his pores and I could not be happier with his progress. To write that first article and then a second one where you dont even admit your wrong is just sad. And by the way, Gerald is much more lanky and longer than Allen so you will never see him playing defense in the manner Tony does by being right up in someone’s chest. That defense only Allen can play which is why people always talk about his defense. Its not a matter of desire. If I were you I’d just let this die down now because Gerald is about to blow up and you dont want to be known for this article.

Good point Worcester. Almost everything Gerald does on the court looks, atleast to me, very fluid and smooth, especially his jump shot. This is just my own observation but it appears that most of his mistakes come when he rushes – for instance the first 3 he took from the top of the key that he missed he clearly didn’t set himself and still had some momentum moving to his left which caused the shot to be off. Now this could just be an issue with confidence and him not being able to keep his composure at certain points in the game which should improve with experience. He’s obviously got enough talent to be effective slashing to the hoop but right now I have no problem with him taking 3’s if he’s open. I’d love to see Doc run some more plays for him if that was what sparked him last night. Hopefully Doc keeps giving him solid minutes to get his experience and confidence up. On a side note, that alley oop where he beat Lebron to the hoop was the best dunk I’ve seen at the Garden all year.

You write this article to defend your other article while citing cases that demonstrate your original article was incorrect.

Makes sense to me

NOT

Who is GMoney? He is an equivalent Sophmore in College and he scores 21 points in 19 minutes without any real sets for him last night.

Just look at the last six games he has played FGA 67 FGM 32 FG% 48. Not too bad!!! Compare that to TMac & J O’Neil at this same stage in their career. They never even got to see the court. At least this kid is producing BIG TIME. Oh by the way Wally during the last 5 games GMA 65 FGM 17 GG% 26. Ya I know he’s injured but point is he is not producing and the kid is.
Too much expectations for GMoney.

I severely doubt that Green17 wants to see Gerald fail, just to be vindicated. It takes guts to write one of these articles, and G17 took a stand about an issue that he perceived. I disagreed with his original stance, but again, I think the vast, vast majority of posters on this board want to see the team and each individual player do well.[/i]

I never said he wanted him to fail, i said he probably wanted him to play “lazy”. Obviously nobody [i]wants him to fail. I just enjoyed watching him bust his ass up and down the court with the hands down most hustle out of every player on either team. I definately think he read the article because he was even up in Lebron’s jersey. If that is actually true than Thank you G17 for lighting a fire under G$.

Who cares how many 3s Gerald is taking?

Is he taking Vince Carter “I’m 35ft out” 3s? Is he taking highly contested 3s?

The answer to both is NO.

Generally Gerald is taking 3s when he’s open, so what is there to complain about? Would we rather he went into Tony Allen mode and passed up wide open 3s, to go crashing into defenders to pick up charges?

Look all Cs fans want Gerald to have a complete game, but you also have to take what the defense is giving you, and at this point it’s largely 3s which Gerald is making them pay.

I have been a fan of Gerald Green since we drafted him. I believe that Gerald does not ‘bring it’ every time he steps on the court. I do not condemn him, but I will be the first to point it out. This is nothing more than a sign of his developing maturity and basketball IQ. I think his minutes(yes, behind Wally still) should be managed to reflect his consistency. I do not beleive the answer with high school players is to let them play until they get it. I think someone did T-Mac and Ray Allen a disservice by allowing them not to play defense, when they clearly had the ability. I also agree Gerald does not want it bad enough at times. I think this is again a reflection of his lack of experience. He is fighting the urge to stand back and watch the game, letting other people do the dirty work at times. He is working and progressing and I think that he is going to be a great Celtic for many years, but is still a work in progress at his point in time.

I commend you Green17 for the guts to stand up and point out his shortcomings. He did have a nice game against Cleveland, and if memory serves he had a similar ‘explosion’ against Charlotte when he got fired up while playing Morrison. obviously Gerald has the ability, just a matter of getting focused for every game. 8)

Gerald Green is growing up in the NBA in front of our eyes. his every move is disected as if each is a clue to his progress or regress depending on the point of view. The fact of the matter is he is a second year player right out of high school and is making tremendous strides to becoming a super star in the NBA. From Time to time he performs as a rookie and at other times as an NBA veteran. one must judge him from his whole body of works and not play by play or even game by game. Gerald wil be a celtic for a very long time from all and I do mean all indications. His Game is made for us in the tradition of larry bird and the other great Celtics before him. It is stupid to think that any player responds to blogs from game to game. its the coach whom they listen. its the coach and not bloggers like us that gives minutes and substitue players. that is whom the players listen.

Green 17, your assessment of GG is right on.

He needs to be more aggressive, especially on defense. He could earn more minutes simply by being more tenacious on defense. Like most of the C’s, he needs to play with more energy on defense.

Offensively, I think GG doesn’t quite know how he fits in on this team. Similar to Telfair, he tries to play unselfishly a lot instead of using his quickness and athleticism to dominate opposing defenders. A lot of his 3’s are a result of the shot clock winding down and there being no options left. I’d rather see GG drive to the basket more. His quickness, jumping ability and shooting touch makes him very tough to defend. I honestly think he could score 20 – 24 a game easily if given the minutes and made a more vital piece of the offense.

Which brings me to my last point. It’s obvious GG is still not completely comfortable at this level and shows a lack of confidence at times. This will improve through experience, but he must play to get significantly better. Doc cannot play yo-yo with his minutes. This team is not good enough to afford sitting GG a lot. He’s the future.