Having Trouble Resisting Kobe

Hey Big Ticket,

Much thanks for the comment — and for the analysis you laid out on the Kobe for Ray-PP thread. You mentioned in the forums that you’re a West Coast guy, and it sounds like you’ve been able to watch Kobe from a much closer proximity than I have. That said, I’m curious to know what you mean when you say you “know what type of person he is.” Is this simply related to the issues that the national media has jumped on (i.e. much of what I mentioned in the piece), or is there even more that those outside the local area don’t know?

That talent/player distinction you drew is incredibly important with Kobe, and I have felt similarly for a long time, though I have started to waver on that.

-sw

Who,

I don’t criticize what Kobe did on the floor once Shaq was gone. Wholly agreed that, on those teams, he had to take the shots he did. But it comes down an issue of you and I disagreeing on the reasons behind the split of the dynasty team. Truth is, I have long canonized Shaq and put almost the entirety of blame on Bryant’s selfishness, admittedly probably to an unfair extent. All the same, I still believe Kobe largely responsible and that it is the alpha dog player who should get the benefit of the doubt in those situations.

I still have some questions about him personally beyond just the Shaq issue. Again, the incident in Eagle didn’t do his image any favors, and the repeated public trade demands and back-and-forth game with the Lakers certainly doesn’t shine a great light on his character or any sort of “team player” nature.

All that said, as you’ll come to find as you read me, I’m generally as big on character-over-physical-talent as anyone, sometimes to a nauseating extent. And I have plenty of anecdotal character evidence built up against Kobe Bryant, yet I’m still having trouble completely turning myself off to him. That is a huge testament in my eyes to what the man can do.

-sw

“The selfishness, the ego, it’s all nonsense. All the great players have that streak (Bird did, Russell did, Jordan did). Kobe is the same. Give him the pieces to work with and he’ll do magic with them.”

I couldn’t agree with this comment more. In my opinion, I think the Kobe situation is the epitome of “a lose-lose situation.” If he defers, people say he’s lost his fire. If he doesn’t defer, people say he’s spoiled and egotistical. Personally, I enjoy watching his pure will, even if it’s taken a while for him to get past his stubborn petulance (read: when he refuses to take a single shot in the second half of a game because someone told him he shot too much.)

It’s hard for me to sit there and give Kobe crap for his outburst this summer, or his thinly veiled complaints of the past few years. First off, nobody in the real world would stay quiet if they were forced to work with a surrounding cast like Kobe had. The more I think of his situation, in fact, the more I can’t help but feel like the best comparison would be to the staff in the movie “Office Space.” Any sane person would have flipped out years before, especially when they’re blamed for the failures of their group the way Kobe is. Second, last year’s team was arguably the best team Kobe had had since Shaq left, and who was on there really? Lamar Odom may be an interesting talent, but the truth is that he’s a ‘tweener between the 3 and the 4. I like Luke Walton, but he’s a bench player on most of the other teams in the league. Jordan Farmar had flashes of brilliance, but he was a rookie. Everyone else was roster filler at best. Paul Pierce had a team even better than that (since he had Jefferson, a legitimate post threat, and Wally World, who could at least score and hit the open 3 when he was healthy), and he was arguably more selfish than Kobe was when he was healthy. Yet, because Pierce lost, nobody outside of Boston cared; because Kobe won, suddenly the fact that he IS such a transcendent player that he can win DESPITE his supporting cast becomes “Well, why can’t you win with them instead of in spite of them?”

But I think what REALLY bugs me about the Kobe discussion — and this isn’t a knock on you, Steve — is that people inevitably play the morals card. That isn’t to minimize the rape issue by any means; I’d never do that. But that was one incident; that aside, what else has Kobe done besides being singularly possessed with a will to be the best? Compare that to other players who have, in my opinion, done many more negative things than Kobe. Jason Kidd was just accused of groping and threatening a woman at a nightclub two weeks ago, and who can forget his spousal abuse? When I was in Boston, people talked about it all the time; now that I’m in Milwaukee, the papers don’t even mention it. And why? I don’t know for certain; I’d hate to play the race card when I can’t be sure such is the case, though I can’t help but feel like that has a little to do with it. But perhaps there’s an even simpler reason: Because Kidd is a point guard and passes the ball. That’s not a good reason, mind you, but it’s the best I can come up with.

Look, it took Jordan until he was almost 30 to learn how to balance imposing his will with making his teammates better. Kobe may or may not be the classic example of why an NBA age limit can hurt pro basketball, but he’s unquestionably the classic example of how giving a teenager that kind of money and success and press will stunt his emotional development. He’s showing signs of finally understanding how to balance everything at the same time as the Laker front office is finally starting to grasp how to build this team around him. Now, as a Celtics fan, I have no problem with the Lakers being stuck in mediocrity for the next couple of decades. However, I think the jury should remain out on Kobe for at least the next 2 or 3 years. Let’s see if he can translate these brief signs of success into something more consistent.

BUTerrier,

A passionate and insightful response; much thanks for writing in.

Regarding the issues with Kobe in the summer and his trade demands, I’ll agree that under normal circumstances, it would be absurd to expect anyone to work in the situations that he has. However, as I discussed above, it has always been my too-strongly held contention that these circumstances aren’t normalized, courtesy of the situation in which Shaquille O’Neal left Los Angeles. That said, if you don’t fault Kobe for what happened there at the end of the 2003-04 season, then absolutely, I certainly buy the viability of your assessment regarding his attitude there. I think the viewpoints on that will always come down to a matter of approach — did Kobe put himself in that situation, or was he a victim in that regard?

Your comment about moralizing is well received; no harm done. I find Kobe’s character frustrating through the incident in Eagle and because I think I view his tenure in Los Angeles through a very different prism than you do. As I conceded in the column, I have always at least leaned toward the anti-Kobe side of the spectrum, and that is something I’m reconciling now. That said, I find him overall to be far more refreshing than many of his colleagues, and I hope it didn’t come off as a comparison with those of his co-workers who are breaking laws with abandon and generally misbehaving themselves. Kobe speaks very well and certainly appears to be personable enough at times, but the summer of 2003 did leave an indelible mark on him.

Frankly, the most poignant part of your commentary for me was the bringing up of the Jason Kidd issue. Sadly enough, your analysis strikes me as dead-on, as I have long grappled with the same issue. From everything I’ve read, this guy has been one vicious dude in his private life. Yet he is one of the premier symbols of team play and leadership and as a result, general good-guy-ness across basketball culture. And I think that, yes, until we find a better explanation, it does come from the fact that his game on the floor is unselfish and we presume that this reflects in his character. Simply put, that hasn’t been the case. Fixing those perceptions we hold as a populous of basketball fans is a journey, and I’m not sure how to assess where we are in that regard at this point. Either way, I think you brought up a very intriguing point here, and it is one that merits more discussion.

Finally, it’s your last point that hits the spot I was really looking for with this piece (back to Kobe): The jury is still out. It hadn’t been out for me for some time, perhaps unfairly, and perhaps equally unfairly, it hadn’t been out for some of Kobe’s unabashed supporters. We do need to wait and see.

But we can certainly enjoy the show while we do.

Thanks again for writing in, and I’m looking forward to hearing more from you. Your voice is more than welcome.

-sw

Big Ticket, I feel the urge to respond to your points:

1.) Again, I don’t want to minimize the rape, but it was one incident. What other actual criminal acts has he done? How many players have gotten a free pass for their indiscretions? Kidd beat his wife and is accused of groping a clubgoer. Gary Payton and Sam Cassell were charged with assault at a Toronto nightclub. Hell, DeShawn Stevenson committed statutory rape of a child, and no one condemns him for it. A lot of players break the law. I’m not trying to rate one over the other, but it’s not like Kobe is a serial rapist.

2.) Are you offended by the cost of the ring or the fact that he did it? If it’s the latter, I’d point you to the millions of men worldwide, myself included, who have at one point or another bribed our significant others with goods in a vain attempt to restore the peace :-) If it’s the former . . . well, come on. He should be able to spend what he wants on his wife. If that’s what he thought it would take to get her to forgive him, then so be it. If you’re going to wave a finger at somebody for that, shouldn’t it be the wife for taking him back?

3.) The fact that a woman SAID it happened doesn’t mean it DID happen. It doesn’t even mean it was LIKELY to happen. Kobe wouldn’t be the first NBA player to have those kind of allegations hanging over his head, and he certainly won’t be the last. With fame comes the desire of others to take shots at you. All I’m saying is that she could have still gone to the cops, and charges could have been filed for attempted rape, but she didn’t. Why is that?

4.) I can give you half a dozen examples of athletes doing that in the NBA alone. The list explodes when you include the NHL, NFL, and MLB. It’s free enterprise; in an era where a team can cast aside a player quickly, where fan loyalty almost never extends beyond the jersey that you wear (ex: “We love Gomes!” to “Oh, he’s not worth a plug nickel” post-trade by most Celtics fans), why on earth shouldn’t he try to get the best offer? Put another way, have you or anyone you known received multiple job offers that you’ve considered at once? Have you ever shopped around for a car, a mattress, a can of soup? How is that really different than what Kobe did?

5.) See, I believe Kobe had a part in Shaq leaving, but I don’t believe it was as blatant as everyone makes it. Yes, Kobe and Shaq had been at each other’s throats, and, yes, it was clear one of them had to go. But are you honestly telling me that if you were a GM and had to choose one of the two (because, seriously, there was no way they were going to coexist on that team), you’d choose the aging overweight center over the young SG who was even then getting comparisons to Jordan? It’s not like Shaq suddenly broke down after the trade; this was coming for some time now, and the Lakers knew it. They got quite a solid package for a guy in Shaq’s shape, in my opinion.

6.) I’ll grant you that was classless, but, again, he’s not the first to do so, and he certainly won’t be the last. Plus, a reasonable argument can be made that Pierce did the same thing and was forgiven as “just being frustrated at his crappy team.” Or do we quickly forget the thinly veiled ultimatum he gave Danny Ainge shortly before the Allen and KG trades went down?

7.) Again, the video was a TERRIBLE PR move. But the number of people who could have possibly foreseen that Bynum was going to improve as drastically as he did is minute. Simply put, the kid didn’t get it until this season. And, frankly, I’ll be the first to admit that I think the Lakers were fools for not having traded Bynum in a package to get KG. They’re 18-10 now; imagine what they’d have been with Garnett and Kobe on the same team?

(part 2)

8.) I’ll buy this the day ANYONE calls Pierce out for doing the same thing over the last 3 or 4 years. He looks prophetic now because we got Allen and KG, but had we whiffed on them, Pierce would be doing the same thing, except he’d be doing it far louder and it would have been picked up by every newspaper in the MA/RI/CT area.

9.) When you have a team like Kobe’s, you need to take that many shots. Again, he’s so good that he keeps them in games. If he had been anything less than transcendent, that team would have been blown out of every game they played and people wouldn’t be blaming Kobe for the failures of the Lakers. Who should he have passed to on that team? Lamar Odom, who’s never been good in the triangle? Caron Butler, who was at least a year or two away from putting it all together? Vlade Divac, who was barely a serviceable center at that point? Perhaps you’d have rather the immortal Tierre Brown was the one taking shots?

10.) Bill Russell was the most notoriously terrible teammate in that manner in the history of the NBA. The guy was friends with Auerbach, Wilt Chamberlain, and MAYBE Cousy, and that was it. He was cold, unwilling to sign signatures, unwilling to even acknowledge rookies at times, etc. Yet we get the warm fuzzies about him because he’s OUR lovable curmudgeon. Hell, KG has made teammates cry, yet we sugar-coat him because he’s the savior who’s going to bring us Banner # 17. You don’t have to bond with your team to be a good team player. Again, notice that Kobe passes more now that his teammates can make shots. When Kobe knows the guy can hit the open jumper, he’ll get him the ball. When he doesn’t know, he doesn’t share. Simple as that.

11.) During the three-point shooting contest on All-Star Weekend 1986, Bird entered the locker room, looked around without saying a word, then finally said, “I’m just looking around to see who’s gonna finish up second”. He won the shooting contest, famously walking away with his finger up in the air as soon as he let go of the last shot (which, for the record, he needed to sink to win.) Shaq was so notoriously arrogant during his heyday that he crafted ridiculous nicknames for himself such as “The Big Aristotle.” What you describe of Kobe isn’t humility; it’s accountability. I’ve seen Kobe interviews where he owns up to his mistakes. I’ve seen ones where he blames his teammates. Quite frankly, in many of the ones I’ve seen of the latter format, he’s been right. Listen, the guy is ruthlessly flawless in his execution. He simply doesn’t do many things wrong. Why should he be forced to constantly take the blame for a crappy team?

I’m not a Kobe apologist. What I am, however, is a pragmatist. I have no problem with someone saying “Kobe is one of many NBA players who are horrible people.” What I DO have a problem with is demonizing Kobe while ignoring the transgressions of other players. He’s not a thug; he’s anti-social. It’s not a crime. I don’t need my NBA players to be lovable quotable people; they get paid to win, and Kobe does it better than anyone. The day he talks trash and can’t deliver on it, then maybe I’ll concede some more of your points. But it’s hard to argue with a guy who tells you how he’s going to kick your a** and then does it to the letter. At least, it’s hard to do it on a forum that glorifies Larry Bird for doing the exact same thing.