I Crave Anonymity

Jeff, I thought the Bucks game is on wednesday-tomorrow? Man, I’ll be pulling for a win in a big way!! There’s no way I want to see the C’s in the books for the most losses in a row ever. :(

I think a big problem we’re having now is that teams are playing us with increased intensity, cause they don’t want to be that team that the C’s beat to end their streak. Like getting up to play the leagues best, only in reverse. Basically, we’re not sneaking up on anybody!!
Against Minny, Blount and Ricky were playing out of their minds with the revenge factor.
And, oh, Perk! Pity the poor guy next time they play Minny after saying that KG is overrated!!!!!!!! Some guys just don’t know when to keep their mouths shut!!

Jeff, don’t go bonkers but I am in London and when I got in last night CNN International was doing a feature on Guess Who’s losing streak. I watched the sickening lowlights of the Minny game again. I must say that I am admiring Doc more not less for his attitude through the streak. He put his faith in Delonte at the end of the game and his man executed poorly. This has probably been batted around in other posts but Delonte left Foye so open that he had an uncontested layup if Pierce didn’t slide down. Delonte didn’t have the brains to pop out to Ricky and game over. Doc can only be blamed for his faith in D.West (which I don’t share as far as point guard). By the way, the bloggers that kill Doc seem to love Delonte. Some moments are so crushing that you’ve got to adjust and D.West blowing the last offensive play and then blowing his coverage should force a change in thinking. No excuses about youth. Foye is a rookie. Delonte is a nice 2 guard with a good heart but no brains for the point. And I don’t want to beat up Danny when he’s got to be down too but I thought Foye looked good as a point guard.

I want them to set the record, and then have “25 straght” tatooed on Doc Rivers’ forehead. The game on the 20th against Sactown may also be difficult to lose, but I have faith.

Any gm who wants to trade for players who belong to a team on a 18 game losing streak needs to be shot.

C’s are going to ruin the Bucks anyway. 20 point victory. We all know they brought PP back just to end the streak to save face.

Pete

Judging by quotes from Perk, Paul and Jeff in today’s Herald, if the Celts don’t win on Wednesday, the record is all but guaranteed.

No, I think they brought Pierce back to showcase him for a possible trade before the 22nd. And I think that the player in Danny Ainge’s sights is Jason Kidd. It would be Kidd and fodder for Pierce, Ratliff and Telfair.

I don’t mind the losing streak. We are who we are. I worry far more about the future. We are being handed a top lottery pick, but we need to land him in a franchise with better management and coaching, and better leadership on the court. My 3 step plan will be painful, but these steps must be taken RIGHT NOW! The longer we wait, the further we sink.

1) Replace Danny
2) Replace Doc
3) Acquire a veteran point guard who can run an offense

I agree Thick, but I’d give Danny more time. The reason: I thought he had assembled a decent team that could be built on/tweaked in the 04-05 season (before the trade), but he made a dumb trade to appease Doc because Doc wanted “nice” guys to coach instead of talented guys that might be a bit high maintenance (players which Doc has no clue how to manage). Give Danny a coach with some balls and maybe he can assemble a team of talented players (whether some are high maintenance or not).

I’m torn. Would be nice to stop the streak, but maybe breaking the record is what it’ll take to dissuade the team from bringing Doc back next year? It’s also looking like Paul would flip out to be playing again—and still have them lose enough for the Oden Stakes.

I also wanted to mention that I do realize that it was Danny’s mistake that brought Doc the loser here in the first place.

I still have a hard time getting over that Danny hired a career loser as a coach for this team. :-\…

Winning does cure a lot of evils and I fully expect us to win tomorrow but in some ways I wish the young guys had won one without Pierce. that’s what disappoints me the most. I can handle the losing but the fact that delonte, Jefferson etc couldn’t win one game without Pierce, well that tells me that our young guys aren’t good enough and that’s a bitter pill to swallow.

They won without Pierce twice (Portland and Memphis). But they couldn’t win without Tony Allen.

I haven’t kept statistics, but I can’t remember the last time they got a defensive stop when they needed one in the 4th quarter of a close game, excluding stops where an opposing player missed a wide open shot.

trade pierce for kidd? that doesnt makes sense.. it makes more sense to trade pierce for 07 draft picks and/or some good rookies…

i agree with jeff.. lets beat the bucks then get straight back to loosing

Kidd’s contract is shorter. Also, think of how much better players like Al Jefferson, Green and Gomes would be with Kidd running the offense. We might even see a fast break once in awhile. And I bet you won’t see Rivers screaming at Kidd on every damn play.

Makes sense for Jersey too. Marcus Williams is ready to play 35 minutes. Vince Carter is on his way out and the Nets need a replacement. It also allows the Nets to use Carter in a trade to get frontcourt help, either this year or next year (if Carter exercises his player option). Telfair would put fannies in the seats playing in his hometown.

Who do I cheer for Wednesday? I’m confused. Why am I watching these games? That’s a good question. This can’t be good for the soul, rooting for your team to lose. But it’s like giving awful-tasting medicine to a child because you know that’s the only way they’ll get healthy. I see Brian Scalabrine as a big bottle of Cod Liver Oil.

What still is troubling me is the reckless approach that was taken with PP on Sunday . Obviously if a player can’t sit because his injury will stiffen up and not allow him to return clearly signals that there is a problem. Yet, the "braintrust " threw him out there risking further injury in what was a meaningless game. Look no further than Kevin Mc Hale and Larry Bird to see what playing hurt does to you.

When Doc is introduced tomorrow, I hope he gets a standing round of boos lasting several minutes. Season ticket holders need to become vocal.

Trade Paul Pierce. This all goes away if you trade Paul Pierce and Kendrick Perkins to Memphis for their #1 and Rudy Gay. Then if things work out, you’ve got a starting five of:

C: Greg Oden
PF: Kevin Durant/Al Jefferson
SF: Rudy Gay
SG: Gerald Green
PG: Rajon Rondo

Ouch. That lineup is sizzling-hot. Playoffs here we come.

I ejoyed Jeff’s article but I don’t agree with it. As any publicist will tell you, bad publicity is better than no publicity at all. I want ESPN to run daily pictures of Rivers looking frustrated or of Grousbeck sitting there with his head in his hands. I loved the feature they did yesterday on the “Curse of Red” with a picture of the Celtics’ cheerleaders.

Most of all, I’d love the game on Februry 28th against the Knicks (which will be the 25th consecutive loss, breaking the old multi-season record) to be on national TV, so that everyone can see the dumb mistakes that Rivers makes and the disorganized mess of a team that he has helped create.

I might even buy a ticket to that game to see Rivers go into the record books. If they lose tomorrow, folks who want to be a part of history better act fact, because that game is going to be the Celtics’ last real sellout for a long, long time.

sorry for the typos. I meant “enjoyed” in the first sentence and “act fast” in the last.

Were all losing touch with Reality here now!

Sometimes it’s best to stay away from here to clear our heads and come back with thoughtful insights about this team.

I for one would like this team to win but win just enough that we don’t lose the race for the 1st or 2nd pick in this years draft.

Doc has to realize now that this team is about development periold!

He should be playing all the young guys,

Rondo
Perkins
Gomes
Jefferson
West
Powe
Telfair
Green

more than ever. Enough of Wally, Scal, and Pierce.

Realize what the development of the youngs kids are and figure out the pieces going into next season.

Hey Jeff, nice CS Lewis quote. Do you read him much?

Sure, Garnett and Perkins both play basketball.

The Beatles and the Monkees were both rock bands, too.

The PG position has often been considered the second most important position on a successful team (a dominant center being the most important). What happens when we have neither a dominant center nor a dominant PG?

Perk appears to be a career back-up center. Jefferson is developing as a center but he’s undersized and lacks a true defensive presence. Scal has the high I.Q at center but lacks athleticism, is offensively limited and is undersized. Powe is a spot sub who has the zeal but not the body to be dominant.

So we’re lacking at the most critical position, center. Then let’s look at the PG position. Delonte, like Perkins, has played like a career back-up PG. He has offensive skills but comes up short on decision-making. He lacks great handles, has only average speed and is defensively vulnerable. His back-up, Rondo, has the instincts of a true PG, has great speed, exceptional handles yet is offensively challenged beyond 12 feet. Rondo’s lack of an outside offensive threat compromises the inside game because his man can play off him. His defensive prowess is exceptional.

Jefferson has been charachterized as a potential star due to his double/double achievements early in his career. He will perhaps become an All Star but he will remain a “tweener” at center and never give us the level of dominance needed for #17.

Rondo has the ability to be truly special because of his world-class athleticism, true PG instincts, defensive prowess and desire but it remains to be seen whether he can develop a complementary offensive game.

If there is a 3rd most valuable position in a starting 5, perhaps a dominant PF would be listed next in importance. But alas, we come up short here also.

It’s hard to choose between the 4th potentially most valuable position but in our case the decision seems ease because of the presence of Paul Pierce. But what should Paul’s true position be? Because of his strength and all-around game Paul has effectively played at PF, SF and SG. In an ideal world, considering his size etc., Paul might be best suited playing at SG. Does that mean that because of our lack of good complementary players, Paul has spent much of his career playing out of position? It seems that we have one true star in Paul Pierce because of his versatility but how much more effective could Paul be if we allowed him to play his best position because we had strength elsewhere?

Tony Allen appears best suited as a defensive specialist who comes off the bench and adds an offensive threat as well. Gomes seems like an excellent 6th man.

We have seeming great potential at the SF position if Green ever achieves the stardom mantle. Alas, that likelihood is far from reality at present.

Wally could become a valuable bench player but his lack of athleticism makes him a major liability (on some nights depending on match-ups) as a starter.

Given our present player profile and lack of player and team balance our only hope is the future and the necessity to take major “lumps” in order to secure top echelon talent.

You need the horses to run a good race and our record (assisted by a rash of injuries) is reflective of the fact that we are playing bench players against everyone’s starters.

Could we gain a game on ..say.. Sacramento instead of Milwaukee?…Milwakee’ record is too close to ours. I would hate to gain a game on them…..

The Bucks are 3-15 since Redd got injured, and have to play Dallas at home the night before coming to Boston. Their PG, Mo Williams, has a bum shoulder that needs padding for him to play, although he’s averaged 24 and 6 in the eight games since he returned from the injury. Little Earl Boykins has a badly sprained thumb, but is still playing.

That said, the Bucks have a mobile center, in Bogut, scrappy forwards that always seem to give the Cs trouble, in Ruben Patterson and Charlie Bell, a talented scorer in Charlie Villaneuva, and a banger off the bench who always seems to kill the Cs, in Dan Gadzuric.

If the Cs lose this game, I can see Doc not surviving, especially if the Bucks come in here and win convincingly after getting blown out at home by Dallas.

“I agree Thick, but I’d give Danny more time. The reason: I thought he had assembled a decent team that could be built on/tweaked in the 04-05 season (before the trade), but he made a dumb trade to appease Doc because Doc wanted "nice” guys to coach instead of talented guys that might be a bit high maintenance (players which Doc has no clue how to manage). Give Danny a coach with some balls and maybe he can assemble a team of talented players (whether some are high maintenance or not)."

So now Danny is not only not responsible for hiring Doc, but it really has been Doc forcing Danny into bad decisions all this time? Wow.

Just win this game, baby, then I can fantank in peace.

I’m so sure the Celtics will win tomorrow night, I’m looking for a bookie. This is one of those games that you just KNOW you can make money on.

But we NEED a win? I don’t. Not so much because I want Oden or Durant. I think people who see them as saviors overlook that we are where we are because of mismanagement and poor coaching. Getting new leaders (and possibly new owners) for the Celtics would do much more for the team than drafting any one player could. Doubt it? Talk to folks in Cleveland. Or Minnesota. Or Houston. Do we really believe Oden and Durant will be better than LeBron, Yao, or Garnett?

No, I don’t NEED a win because the season’s already over. Dead man walking. Win. Don’t win. Top pick. No top pick. Trade. No Trade. WhatEVER. This season needs to pass like a kidney stone (and about as much fun). Let’s just MOVE ON.

Sean P. You didn’t read my follow-up post where I acknowledged that Danny hired Doc the loser. I stand by what I said when I said Doc forced Danny to make the trade. I didn’t mean he MADE him do it, but Danny did it to make life easier for Doc because he didn’t want to fire Doc and pay him $15M owed. If the Cs didn’t owe Doc so much money, I believe he would have been fired and the trade for ‘nice’ guys who Doc could handle/coach may not have been made.

What is the all time nba losing streak record?

A quote to remember:

“Rockne wanted nothing but "bad losers.” Good losers get into the habit of losing."

    - George E. Allen

most concerning to me is the breaking point when this team turns on itself.
no one wants that

without giving up pierce, does anybody feel that it may be possible for the celtics to work a deal with nets for jason kidd?

Ok, so it’s not looking good. In fact, its horrific. Watching watching the lowlights on ESPN makes me cringe in the morning. But here’s something that the Boston Celtic organization knows how to do right. CHEERLEADERS!!!! Sooooo HOTTT!

As “SAD” as we all are……..

I wonder this time next year if we have Oden and are in 1st place what will we be saying?

This one goes out to all of you MORONS who were saying that Rondo was a better pick than Marcus Williams:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/recap?gameId=270210017

…and don’t try to tell me anything different! Marcus Williams is a GAMER who creates offense – exactly what we need right now!

“when I said Doc forced Danny to make the trade. I didn’t mean he MADE him do it”

Don’t know how I misinterpreted that one.

It’s a little too early to make a final decision about the relative value of Marcus Williams versus Rondo. If Rondo continues to develop a shooting touch there will be little doubt who has the greater upside.

Don’t know if anyone else has already made this analogy (too lazy to read all the prior posts) but I liken our situation to the Detroit Tigers of a few seasons ago. They pitched all these rookies, a couple of whom lost 20 games. I think they finished with over 100 losses for the year. A few years later, they compete in the World Series, mostly because their young pitchers got alot better through experience. I hope that this season will work that way for our younger players.

To SmarterThanEwe: Don’t underestimate the negative impact of having Doc as your coach. Who knows what Rondo would be doing with Frank as his coach? My guess is he wouldn’t be afraid to make mistakes for fear of never seeing the court again. Who knows? We won’t find out until Doc resigns. Imagine if Al had never gotten hurt last year? We never would’ve found out that Ryan Gomes can actually play in the NBA. So please, stop comparing our guys to guys who have the benefit of real coaching.

   There won’t be any trades now. Its way too late for the Celtics to make a difference, and nobody on our team is a missing piece for anyone. It would nice to let these guys play for the next couple months and even give Powe some minutes.Obviously, this summer nobody if off the table when you are 12-40 or whatever it is. And that includes Pierce. he’s not the problem, but he might not be the solution.

The only trade I can see happening is Wally and [Gomes,West,Telfair] can be moved for a second round pick and a contract that expires next year instead of in 2008/9.

EXCELLENT ARTICLE BY SI.COM KELLY DWYER

The Best of the Worst, he states:

“So yuk it up all you want with these C’s, because they deserved it. Few recent teams have looked this clueless, though you can hardly say they’ve looked listless. There is promise here, and players who should only improve once the weight of expectations are placed on their shoulders. It may not be the most enviable of choices, but if I’m Durant or Oden, I know what team I’d rather join”.

And excellent observation considering that many players being eligible for the draft look at teams and which would you rather join and who has the potential improvement?

Let’s face it; the worst teams end up with the lottery picks, but how many lottery teams really end up moving fast up the ladder. I would say Cleveland comes to mind. So if youâ€â"¢re Durant or Oden and youâ€â"¢re looking at the Celtics, Grizzles, Sixer’s, Hawks, or Charlotte who would you rather join?

Knowing the history of the Celtics and the injuries to Paul Pierce and others, you’d have to say Boston would be your first choice!

I know we are all in the dumps, but I needed to say this to get us out of it!!!!!!!

I could care less about the media and so called experts, I do care about the kids that play for the team and hope they get the win.

Be careful what you wish for…. Doc and 3 more wins, he will looking for an extension :D

AINGE IS SMOKING CRACK FOR NOT FIRING DOC STILL. It’s almost like comedy. Ainge must be blind and can’t see that doc isn’t the right fit for a running system.

There is no such thing as negative press. Who cares if everyone is deriding the Celtics – we deserve it right now. It will make us more newsworthy around the draft, and (knock on wood) we draft Greg Oden – next year we’re going to really be all over the news.

I’ll take the lumps now.. it’s all worth it. I can take the criticism and negative press… I actually think it’s going to be beneficial to our guys in the long run, and not just because of better draft position. You don’t forget something like this if you’re a player, and the guys are never going to want this again. I suspect it’s going to make them very, very hungry next year.

I hope our players don’t read this blog. Hell, some of the posts here are down right discouraging. The players and Doc are keeping their heads up through all this and playing hard every game. The team certainly is not tanking and they’re not pointing fingers in these hard times probably because they know there will come a day when they will reek sweet revenge on all these teams that are beating them now.

I wonder if the posters who are saying that Danny and Doc have to go are old enough to remember all the great coaches and GMs we had before Danny came along. When Danny came aboard he saw that the team we had had gone about as far as it was going to go and would only get older and begin to slide before long. We had twenty years of trying to get back to a championship team. Twenty years of band aid approaches.

The first thing I noticed when Danny came aboard was the action, like we had never seen before. Some things worked out some didn’t but he seems to be pretty good at getting rid of his mistakes. If being a GM and building a championship team was as easy as some of you seem to think – just get rid of this guy, trade that guy and get this guy and we’ll be on our way – why aren’t all the other GMs doing it? I believe that biulding a championship team takes a solid plan but also a lot of just plain old luck.

There’s a real good article on this blog entitled “Tommy Hates Delonte” about how much more goes into building a champioship team than evidently some of you understand. Maybe some of you should read it or re-read it.

Jeff said:

 I love Lewis, though I admit some of his non-fiction is over my head

I love Brickowski, he’s made me laugh hard three times today, my wife and kids are wondering what the heck I’m doing. Good stuff folks, the suns always shining somewhere.

I also love Lewis, and encourage you lift up your head tackle the hard stuff to be blessed.

Lewis wass the bomb. Few people think life out as much as he did. Nice quote, nice article.

I guess I’m in the minority about Ainge. I think he’s done alright except for the coach deal. I hope he lets Doc walk because we definitely need something new on the coaching front.