Pierce Wants To Trade The Pick

He is right. But if we do land a pick in the top 2, he is wrong. Maybe we should make a trade and just protect the pick for the top 2.

I think it makes perfect sense to wait until the draft to determine if the C’s want to trade the pick or not. I don’t agree with those that think, over time the pick comes less appealing. The only way for the pick to become drastically less appealing, would be if the C’s somehow got red hot and won 60% of their remaining games, and that is highly unlikely. The GM’s of the other teams, understand that until the lottery, nobody’s pick is determined. They are just as aware of the statistical probabilities of the C’s landing a top pick as we are. It just doesn’t make logical sense for another GM to overvalue the C’s pick right now. Another team isn’t going to make a trade for the C’s first round pick with the assumption that its a top 2 pick. It would be foolish for a team to think along those lines.

with a unknown slot the pick won’t get you enough in return…we roll the dice on lottery day and field offers from there…with 30 games left you do NOT forfiet a chance at the top pick…never

To win in the NBA you need more than one player with top level talent. The Spurs have three – Duncan, Parker and Ginobili. The Mavericks have three – Nowitzki, Terry and Howard. The Suns have three – Stoudemire, Nash and Marion. The Celtics have one – Pierce. They need a big man that can play with the big boys. Maybe that could be Al Jefferson, though I am still not convinced he’ll be anything more than a good player.

I think there’s more top level big man talent in the draft that than Oden and Durant. I wouldn’t even think about giving up this pick unless it drops to 7th or lower, which with Pierce coming back it may.

Assuming Pau Gasol goes to the Bulls if he is traded at all, where does Pierce think the Celtics are going to get veteran big man help in the trade market? KG may or may not come on the market but there will be a whole bunch of teams bidding for his services with the Lakers the likely landing place. Even if you can make that deal, the roster would be gutted.

People talk about how the Clippers were bad for years trying to build through the draft and how the Bulls stunk for a long time after Jordan and Pippen left. The Clippers made some bad picks and also didn’t keep their young talent. The Bulls made one horrendous trade (Elton Brand for Tyson Chandler) but now are reaping the rewards of building with young players (Hinrich, Deng, Gordon, Nocioni).

Let’s say Ainge backs the truck up for KG. The Celtics go into next season with no draft pick and a lineup that consists of:

Pierce / Gomes
Garnett / Scalabrine
Perkins /Olowakandi
Rondo / Telfair
Allen / Ray

Jefferson, Green, West, Ratliff and the pick go to the T-Wolves. The team that’s left may well be a playoff team but it’s not that good and it’s built for a couple years and has no bench.

 I totally disagree with this for the simple fact that bringing another veteran will not help this team. Veterans they have brought in in recent years have done nothing to make this team a legitimate contender. Pierce wants to be competitive while I would like a championship.

Aren’t championship teams competitive? I would agree to trade the pick if it is not a top 1 or 2. Wait until we know what the pick is.

This team needs a Veteran, but who is willing to give you that talented Veteran?

The only one would be Minnesota.

Name me another team looking in giving up a talented Veteran for a draft pick and a couple of young players?

Why would a team do that that would mean they would be going into a rebuilding process themselves?

Sorry as much as intriguing as trading a high draft pick and players to bring a quality veteran, you would have to think the other team is either nuts or decided to go in a different direction.

Look across the league and realitisically from the top 20 guys other than Garnet who else is available?

So in essence trading the pick would only make sense if we received an all-star caliber player without giving up the store.

I say we keep the pick and continue our rebuilding process with our youths…..eventually down the road they will become Veteran players and leaders…..

It just takes time to develop

Veteran signings, Blount, Scal, Dickau. Trades Raef, Sebastian, Theo, Walker, Atkins, Davis, etc. I don’t know about any of you but I have no faith in Danny making any deal, unless he’s selecting from the draft.

Jason Kidd could be had. I would not give up our pick for him (34) but Rod Thorn is twice the GM Danny is.

Pierce is hearing time’s winged chariot at his back. A trade request will be next.

I think people should also keep in mind, how far down at the bottom the C’s are. Boston and Memphis are tied with a league low of 12 wins apiece. In third place is philly with 15 wins. After that you’ve got 5 teams with 17-19 wins. The celtics would have to make up a lot of ground on several teams to fall out of the top 5 worst records in the league.

Last post, 34 years old.

Funny this topic comes up. I have read other posts that say, possibly trade this pick, but after the lottery. unless we can land one of the top two, then I’m for dealing the pick for a Jermaine O’Neal type player.

top talent,JO,KG,Gasol etc etc won’t be available until the pick is set….now guys like Allen,Bibby,Lewis etc could be had but do you want to give up a chance at Oden or Durant to get these type guys???

Everyone in here should read Bill Simmons articls from ESPN.

That hit home!

Emotionally, like fans and players think, you trade the pick for a vet. For GM’s, who think rationally, you don’t even think about trading the pick right now. Insane. It reminds me of when T-Mac wanted the Magic to trade the pick that became Dwight Howard. or Vince wanting to trade the pick that became Chris Bosh. Who would you want right now if you were a Magic or Raptor fan? Check your ego PP, and realize the pick is best..

Ah yes, ThumPOlina strikes again!

very well put JHTruth,

Look at Toronto now, with Bosh and Bargnani, and Toronto is 2.5 Million under the Cap

Let’s trade the pick for a vet like we did with JJ for Rodney Rogers…better yet – we’re not in teh position to make it to the playoffs, so it would make even less sense. Better yet – we’re in position to snag a cornerstone player…good idea Paul.

Let’s sit Paul for the season and get a legit young talent at the top of the draft and be happy going forward.

Sorry…I’m a little jaded today.

Frankly I’d trade Pierce before I would trade this pick, and I’m afraid that is what this is all coming to.

Pierce is saying that this team needs to start hedging some of their bets/investments with more conservative investments.

Maybe the better way is to redesign the portfolio – moving some of the other riskier investments (green, allen, perkins, jefferson) for more conservative pieces with a more consistent year in returns.

He wants to start cashing in some of the potential for some players who can ball (but with lower ceilings or on downsides of their careers). It has to be frustrating to him, though none of us are privy to the discussions btw him and ainge. He may have signed up for this bumpy road… and now is having regrets. Or ainge may have sold him on a lie…

Either way, I agree waiting to the off season is the best thing for this team. I think Gasol is a monster on the offense, but is a shaky defender. For the record I am not a NOAH fan (with a top 3 pick), but his presence would certainly make this team more formidable on the defensive end, never mind what Oden would bring…

How about Okafor? Would anybody trade the #1 thru #3 pick in the draft for Emeka (certianly if our position was lower than #3 we would jump on this type of deal)? How about the pick and GG? Certainly Emekas ceiling is lower than odens, but he is more of a proven commodity.

I would love a front line of Okafor, Jefferson and Pierce complimented by a healthy TA and Rondo and that may be a team that can score and defend…

My stomache doesn’t have a taste for over priced veteran bigs, either on the downside OR with not much defensive game. It certainly has no taste for a pick less than #2. If I had to decide which made me less sick — it would be the opportunity to get a big who potentially be that defender/scorer we need. BUT I would mitigate my risk now and explore the opportunity to land Emeka…

… by “opportunity” I mean the chance at the draft

Emmeka might be a reach, but one talent that I love is Gerald Wallace(Bobcats). He is way over-looked. You pair him on the wing with PP and you are done with the wings for long-term. He is good defender, really good slasher(like TA) and decent scorer. I wonder If we could offer GG some incentives for him. We keep the draft pick though.

I would think if Gasol is obtainable (with our talent) then okafor would be too. Granted he is paid more (but okafor is elgible for payday next yr), but the league seems to value gasol alot more.

I like gerald wallace — and GG / gerald deal would benefit the C’s I just don’t see why charolette would move on that. I am not completly sure that GG’s potential is enough to move for a commodity alone…

Headline writers should be shot.
I read that entire article and I never once saw him say he wanted to trade the pick. I did read him say that you can’t put all you faith in winning the lottery (true!). We can’t continue to get younger every year (true!) That no team has ever turned around on draft picks alone (true). And that the Celtics needed to sit down and make some tuff decisions this summer (true).
 

Whose to say you can’t make a trade for a vet and keep a top 5 pick. A trade of Theo, a #1 (from minny), Green and Perkins could possibly land Gasol and we would keep our pick. If Gasol isn’t moved by the deadline I think we can make a run at him and still draft a guy in the top 5. With a front court of Gasol, Jefferson and Pierce we could make some noise. A top 5 pick could be a guy like Julian Wright (or maybe you draft Noah and have him as your first big off the bench). The point is why can’t we keep the pick and bring in a vet who could help us. Building a team takes several steps. The first is always to fix the cap and stockpile young talent. The second is to decide what talent to keep and what talent to trade for a vet to help build the team. There is no need to panic and do something stupid like trade this years pick.

I agree with Brickowski that it might be better to trade Pierce than the pick. Can Gomes play the 3 if we trade Pierce for a 4 or 5 or picks?

Brick’s quoting Marvell and Po’s quoting Carroll…That’s what I like about this place…What’s nice to see is that we seem to be leaning towards “Hold” on everything…God knows, we’ve seen nothing yet this season of chemistry or coherence…The rest of the season should prove the anvil upon which to temper our hammer, or some such BS…
My thoughts, the trading deadline will come and go with nary a move in any Major direction. We still don’t know what we’ve got for a team…We just plain don’t…and, as I stated in an earlier post, the draft is becoming intriguing and that’s a nice way to avoid illimitable and clinical depression during a season such as the one we’re experiencing…More will be revealed by the 23rd…
PS…My Ex-wife-errant told me of two movies that I would enjoy very much, “What the Bleep do we Know”, and, in keeping with Po’s allusion, “Down the Rabbit Hole”…Hey!, Why not?

I like what Pierce said. The bottom line is that he does not want to sit around hoping for losses and hoping for a savior in the draft. This pick is bad Karma. I would love to just swap it with someone like Phili or Atlanta and then all the “is it better to lose” talk can stop. Trading the pick, with protections or not, for a vet is great but I am not sure we can get KG, PG, or JO, maybe AK. But we could target a lesser player on a non-play off team and make a deal that involves swaping picks. LeBron was the last “big” #1 but Miami got Wade with #5. Would it really have been worth losing to try and have the worst record. I say it could potentially affect the “spirit” of the franchise for years if you do that and still end up the the 3rd or 4th pick (Just ask Pitino).

Stuck in Philly, I agree with you wholeheartedly, but it’s just over my head to analyze our volatile situation that thouroughly…If we could bring in Gasol without giving up our pick or AJ, I’d be more than interested, but it’s my feeling (feeling only) that that can’t be done…and now as I think of it, bringing in Gasol would diminish our pick big time, we’d possibly even drop to 10 or worse…that’s a lot of fodder for this rusty canon to assimilate…I would imagine that Chicago is much itchier to “go over the top” with a Gasol than we are and would over-amp us in the end, anyway…

Well it’s a good think Pierce doesn’t run this team. He sounds like Ricky Davis prior to getting LeBron. He’s scared he’ll lose his “franchise” to some newbie.

Get rid of Paul. I’d rather build around the youth

i think all paul is saying is that the lottery is a crapshoot. which it is, given that its a lottery. and honestly, if we don’t get a top 2 pick, i’d seriously consider trading it if we can package it to get a star (like kg). oden and durant have too much talent, so i think you’d be crazy to trade a top 2 spot in this year’s draft, but below that, maybe…though i really think wright or noah could make major contributions to our team from day 1.

2 choices we have is 1) do what pierce says, trade our 1st round pick and one of our players like west, and get another legit player close to pierces level(doesn’t have to make the all star team, but always close to make it).

or 2) To trade pierce and help this team make sure to land a player 5 and below. Honestly i don’t think pierce understands how deep the draft is this year. 1-11 are full of high potential players

3) Worst case scenerio is to keep pierce and win alot more games then now, only to not make the playoffs(or if miracle make 8th) and exit first round and draft an insignificant player(or a player who will take a long time to develop)

I know this sounds bad, but why is Pierce in such a rush to comeback?? why is the team in a rush to bring him back??

I mean seriously i dun think danny will trade the pick nor pierce and we will end up now with like the 12th pick, which nobody wants

Next year celtics better do well , or the fans will have it

Pierce’s comments simply illustrate that what’s good for Pierce may not be good for the Celtics. I wouldn’t be willing to mortgage the future to give Pierce a shot at the second round of the playoffs before he hobbles off into the sunset.

The Celtics are not a team that is one good player away from contention. The Celtics are an expansion franchise at the moment, and they should be managed like one.

Too many of us agree today…. must be Football Hangover…

But also, many of you agree that the closer we are to the top pick, we should keep it instead of trading it away. I guess the realization of what an Oden or Durant brings to the Celtics is best for the long run….again like Toronto and Orlando have done with there picks.

We need to get this season out of our system so we can start fresh. This season has been dragging all of us down, because we pretty much expected this team to contend and making the playoffs, not for the top pick in the lottery.

Goes to show what injuries to keep personal can do to a team.

A few weeks ago when we were talking about injuries, I stated that this benefited Paul more than the youngsters, reading today’s article in the globe, he mentions that.

I’m hoping he sees what Green, Rondo, Jefferson and others can do and when he does come back, that he doesn’t try and take the team on all by himself.

Let me add that so long as Rivers is the coach, I’m coming around to the view that it makes absolutely no sense to acquire any expensive players. What’s the point? The Celtics’ first order of business ought to be to trade away the expensive players they have for expiring deals, not acquire new ones. You can easily lose 60 games with a payroll that looks like the payroll of the Bobcats or Hawks. Why push up against the luxury tax threshhold if the team can never win no matter how much you spend?

Right now most seem fine with trading the pick if it is not 1 or 2. That is based on today’s knowledge of the draft. That may change (probably will) between now and draft day. Some guys are going to come out big, like Tyrus Thomas, who started to climb out of know where (he was outside the top 100 before the season began). Also, there is no single trade we could make, realistically, that would land us a great veteran (e.g.) that would leave us in position to compete for a championship. We would mortgage the future to go two rounds into the play-offs. Don’t do it, Danny. Of course Pierce wants to trade, becasue he knows his value will decline in a few years, and he likely won’t be a major piece of our next championship.

There’s almost no way you trade the pick now. If you did, who would you trade it for? Assuming Gasol as being the type of commodity you’d be seeking, why would Memphis want said pick, if as most of you fear, it may be the #6-8 pick anyway? The pick may indeed be less valuable after the lottery, but that means it also has questionable value right now. To me, it looks like the C’s won’t make any deals until after the season. Everything will hedge on how the lottery plays out. For a team like the C’s, gambling on the lottery is the best hope. What could we realistically aquire at this point? Would said aquisition be worth it if the C’s draw #1 or 2? Furthermore, if the C’s wait and draft #4 per say, would that same player aquired now, still be attainable? I say yes, and therefore, we make no moves till summer. Remember, Theo is expiring in the summer (’07-08 is the last year) and could be an insurance casualty ala Rick Fox was. Could be more appealing to Memphis or whomever else might be a player.

He’s speaking from a player perspective. I understand that. The C’s aren’t an vet team looking to add youth. They’re a young team that needs experience.

I’d have a hard time walking away from a Durant or Oden. But if Ainge can somehow pry an All Star from a team looking to rebuild, he’d have to consider it…

There are no lightning bolt decisions that will instantly make the Celtics a competitive team. Talk about trading the pick means little. Trade for Who? and Which pick? If we had the top would we trade for Garnett and his 20 million salary? Or, if we had Oden as the top pick, why not play him with our roster and be instant contenders. But if we had the 5th pick, or 4th, who could we get?
   The reality is nobody is buying merely a chance at top pick, and the Celtics are not dealing a top 2pick with a shot at Oden or Durant. When the lottery happens and our cards are out there, we’ll deal. But I don’t see alot of available guys I’d give up Jefferson and a top 5 pick for.

A friend who is a Suns fan and I were having a “what if” type discussion the other day and he asked if I would be willing to trade the #1 (or 2) pick along with Theo for Shawn Marion and the #4 pick (Atlanta’s). I actually think this could serve the purpose of getting that vet we need and still getting a potential great young player in Noah (or something close). I think this is the type of move that could do a lot of good for this team.
Thoughts?

I hate to get all philosophical on everyone, but any even semi-tanking defeats the whole reason why I watch sports to begin with. People gaming the system just isn’t what I’m here for, even if it means wins.

These are the Celtics, dammit. If you can only win by gaming the system, trying to sneak in a ringer you don’t deserve, it’s not worth it. Otherwise you’re just rooting for laundry.

Would Al GG filler get it done for Garnett/Gasol?

If we land #1 pick, I would do the above trade.

Sorry Paul if you waited this long you can just that little bit more… You put yourself in this situation.

McCarty’s available and we wouldn’t have to give up a pick either. Or Jefferson for Mr. 34%(foul shooting percentage)?

You don’t pass up a shot at a Greg Oden. You trade the pick and one or more of our best young players for a Garnett and MAYBE you get a couple of years before Pierce and KG start to seriously decline. Both of them have a lot of miles.

If you keep the youth, get Oden(or Durant), dump Dock for a coach who can teach a team how to play defense, and you could be a title contender for the next 5-10 years.

 Brickowski said:
  Let me add that so long as Rivers is the coach, I’m coming around to the view that it makes absolutely no sense to acquire any expensive players. What’s the point? The Celtics’ first order of business ought to be to trade away the expensive players they have for expiring deals, not acquire new ones. You can easily lose 60 games with a payroll that looks like the payroll of the Bobcats or Hawks. Why push up against the luxury tax threshhold if the team can never win no matter how much you spend?
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Rivers only has one year left on his deal though Brick. You can’t add one or two players and make this team a favorite for the championship, but you can certainly make a trade or two, add a MLE and build a solid playoff team that you can build off of…

There’s a middle ground, and if Rivers actually is the root of all evil , it will be quickly put to rest with a veteran team and a stable rotation to prove ultimately that he cannot coach…

You don’t have to make the “one trade” that gives you the ring, just make a trade that puts you in the playoff mix at a competitive level and make sure you have enough core players and assets going forward to compensate for the veterans decline…should be able to float 3-5 years around Pierce and any other 30 year old or younger veteran help…with more picks, MLE acquisitions, and salary coming off the books, you still have room to grow…