Say What?

it’s a long winded version of the “injuries killed our season” exscuse, without having to say it directly, because they’ve already over-used that line.

I think what he’s getting at is: Doc played the young guys and focused on developing them instead of solely trying to win games. This was good for the franchise – we need them to get better. But if that action looked like tanking to you, then its a bit hypocritical to say he can’t win games."

A lame excuse, but I think an accurate parsing.

He’s saying people can’t say Doc lost games on purposes and then blame him for the losses b/c that’s illogical.
But he’s saying Doc didn’t lose the games on the purpose so apparently he was rewarded anyway.

Also, most people note that the Celts were losing games at the beginning of the season well before they started tanking.

“I don’t want Doc to see too much of the big picture”

Huh? So you’re saying that you want to keep the coach in the dark? That’s going to somehow help him do a better job? (or just be able to maintain deniability when asked if the team was tanking this year…)

btw – Doc’s extension is essentially a bonus, nothing more or less, since he will be axed if the team doesn’t play well. For a team that is so cheap, it seems silly to give out that kind of bonus.

I read this myself today and found myself re-reading it. That’s a really puzzling statement and I hope the NBA offices don’t look into it…

I interpreted it the same way Brendan did.

I thought it was pretty straight forward. Danny is getting killed in the media and in these forums on a consistent basis for the job that Doc does – and even more the past two days due to the extension. There are two main points of contention for people against Doc; 1) He sucks as a coach, and couldn’t win games no matter how much he tried, and 2) He didn’t win games no matter what because he was tanking on purpose. It seems to me that Ainge believes that the same people are using both excuses to bash Doc, even though using both excuses would seem to make one contradict themselves. That quote pretty much is Danny saying that Doc realized that it’s more important to get the young guys time and develop them than it would be to sign multiple veterans to partial middle level contracts. In other words… Doc was trying to win, but couldn’t with what he was given. Whether that is true is up for debate – just don’t use the team’s record as an argument for Doc’s deficiencies as a coach if you are also going to accuse him of tanking – Danny’s saying you can’t have it both ways.

 “I don’t want Doc to see too much of the big picture”
….means:
“I’ll be taking over the coaching duties as soon as I have all the pieces in place—-you know,like Pat Riley did with SVG”

Said yet another way, if your’re disliked, it doesn’t matter what you do….you’re damned if you do…and you’re damned if you don’t (win games when they no longer COUNT toward the playoffs but do COUNT in lottery opportunity).

Danny is defending Doc because the criticism has become contradictory and illogical. Those that fire the criticism to an exaggerated degree choose to OVERLOOK circumstances surrounding roster failings (injuries) and instead demand that injuries (and roster depletion) shouldn’t be used to excuse losses. Huh?

Danny’s explanation on Doc was about as clear as Rudy Giuliani’s stance on Roe v. Wade at the Republican debate last week.

Hey, I wanted Doc fired two years ago, at the start of this season, and I still want him fired now. It’s not like people calling for Doc’s head are basing it all on this season.(Although there is still plenty to work with there.) Danny is wrong when he thinks people are focusing on wins and losses. Did Doc tank? Obviously, everyone believes we could have won a couple more games. Did he also fail miserably earlier in the season, such that the team found it self in a position where tanking was the only reasonable thing to do? YES, and that is why people still want him fired.
I won’t give him credit for Jefferson. He thought Al was soft and needed to toughen up. He also buried him on the bench before the lack of Centers on the team made it a an absolute necessity to start him. When given the chance Al blossomed. A similar situation went down with Rondo, who was behind Delonte and Telfair for most of the season. Rondo only got a chance when there was nothing left to play for. The one thing that I can give Doc credit for is Tony Allen. He was behind Tony when he was struggling, and got him to play to his strengths and to stop trying to be a ballhandler. That is one thing that Doc did right.

It was brilliant. He said there was no tanking (which is mandatory), and then went on to say that Doc did what was in the long term best interest of the team (ie tanking) as opposed to being a terrible coach.

Come on everyone, lets not be the kind of stupid fans that expects team officials to always honestly say whats on their minds. If that was the case they’d be terrible at their jobs and idiots to boot.

I think what Danny is saying is that the fans and media wanted the Celtics to tank at the end, (that they were NOT tanking), but we are saying Doc is a bad coach because the team did what the fans and media wanted it to do, they lost alot of games. When he’s saying Doc is doing what’s best for the franchise means that he was playing and developing the young players, possibly at the cost of losing some games (after the injuries there was no choice). When Doc took the job he knew what he was getting into and he thought that playing the young guys was not synonymous with losing. Many coaches would not have taken this job. I think Danny could have said what he was trying to say better, but regardless, people don’t like Doc and will turn any statement about him into something bad. I like Doc and probably do the same in the opposite direction. Barring injuries next year should be the year we start doing better record-wise, regardless of the draft. That should be the time to judge Doc as long as we judge him in the context of what he has to work with, because he will still not have the best team in the league. We should beat the teams we are obviously better than and should be close to .500 (maybe less-whatever is realistic) against the better teams.

The Tom Ziller statement, especially the title, is just plain reckless.

petula said:
  “I don’t want Doc to see too much of the big picture”

Huh? So you’re saying that you want to keep the coach in the dark? That’s going to somehow help him do a better job? (or just be able to maintain deniability when asked if the team was tanking this year…)

I think Danny is saying that it’s Doc’s job to coach and it’s Danny’s job to see the big picture in detail. He’s also saying that Doc has a basic understanding of the “big picture”, enough to be on the same page as Danny. Danny is not saying to keep the coach in the dark. I don’t know what goes on with other teams, but from what I read, the communication between Ownership, GM, and Coach on the C’s is probably right up there with the best in the league.

[/quote]FrieCod said “I won’t give him credit for Jefferson. He thought Al was soft and needed to toughen up.”[/quote]
I would bet that if you asked Al face to face if Doc helped him develop the answer would be yes. I don’t remember if Al or someone else said this in an interview, but the question was about when things turned around for Al this year. I believe the answer was a game against NJ in December when Doc sat Al down and told him he was playing “soft”. Al went back in the game and it was double double from then on. The three people who have helped Al are Doc, Clifford Ray and Kendrick Perkins. I should have said 4 people because Al also did alot to help himself by taking to heart the advice given him.

I feel like the caveman on the Geico commerical.

Oh yes, I have a comment…….“What!”

I thought after this miserable season, at least the C ownership would “clean house”. Well, we’re back to the same old Danny/Doc speak. It’s very frustrating watching how this franchise has been run into the ground, yet we still stay the course.

I live in Kansas, asked a friend if he saw Bush came to KS to see the tornado damage that wiped out a town and killed 10 people, and he replied, one disaster visiting another. When I saw Doc and Danny laughing it up together, the one disaster visiting another quote poppped in my head.

Danny is a paragon of incoherence. What a joke this franchise has become — we have to make excuses for rewarding failure… Red must be rolling over in his grave…