Typecast

The findings here I would term

As Creative, Reflective, Astute, Philosophical or

C.R.A.P.

LOL

And sadly…we’re paying him…sigh…

I think what the Brain Doctor does has a lot of holes in it because it relies on observational data only and it doesn’t get into the minute details of the athletes personality and behavior…but I do think it IS quite important to ALWAYS consider WHO the individual is and not just what he does on the court…John Niednagal was one of the first to believe in the value of psychology in athletics and for that he gets my respect…

Neidnagel knows nothing about psychology either. He was in real estate before developing this money-making scheme, he has no formal training in psychology. If he did take even an intro psych coure, he would know that if you use a “brain typing” system based on a method where people filling out questionnaires (by the way not one Neidnagel created, there is no original thought on his part), you should actually give that questionnaire to the person whose brain type you claim to know. Neidnagel did not give the questionnaire to KG or pretty much anyone else he claims to know the brain type of. I bet if he, or anyone else, did we’d find Niednagel’s guesses are wrong more often than they are right. We’re basically suppose trust to that this guy with no formal psychology training or experience with professional basetball can intuit a player’s brain type from watching them play. At best he’s a behavioral scout.

The fact that Springer does not even ask simple questions about how he determines this is also lazy journalism.

Sorry Jeff, I was referencing a south park episode.

These are just the same Meyers-Briggs categories that have been around forever. I’m not sure why anyone cares.

i’ve seen this guy’s website and there don’t seem to be any credentials that would show this guy to be an actual “doctor”

So how is a questionnaire better than an actual observation? I’d argue the observation would be an even stronger method, since it accounts for what you actually do in a given situation, not what you say you would, on paper.

I know very little about what Niednagel does, which is precisely why I hold off with the name calling, be it charlatan or genius. Other people, obviously, have have little problems doing that.

By the way, I’ve never heard about any formal statistical training John Hollinger might have had…

Bogus science.

What he appears to do is to administer a standard Meyers Briggs— which any idiot can do— and then draw conclusions about future basketball performance from that, based on the prior performance (good or bad) of players with similar scores.

Call me old fashioned but I’d prefer Ainge stick to the Zodiac as his guide when assembling the roster.

[quoteWhat he appears to do is to administer a standard Meyers Briggs— which any idiot can do— and then draw conclusions about future basketball performance from that, based on the prior performance (good or bad) of players with similar scores.[/quote]
Recruitment and HR personnel s do that all the time, except they administer written questionnaires, and he watches footage, just because he can. I wonder what makes them respected professionals and him – a charlatan?

When I find out that recent NBA franchises (San Antonio, Miami, Detroit) use brain-typing and have won, I’m all ears. Until then, a whole bunch of hooey.

kozlodoev – It’s fine if he wants to render judgment on a player from watching him, that’s scouting. That’s what he is, a scout. But the way you use the Myers-Briggs is by administering it. Period. That’s how the acronyms are generated, through scores based on the test compared against the norms for that test. No competent psychologist, human source profesional, whatever professional uses it would guess at a person’s brain type, other than as a parlor game. Many of responses to items in the Myers-Briggs can not be know through watching behavior. There are also 16 different types. What are the odds he is nailing this exactly? As he ever validated his methods? Made sure his guesses are accurate against real profiles? The answer is no. He provides no evidence that his methods are sound. I agree watching behavior could be as or more valuable in judging a person character, but that’s not how these types (which are controversial even when assessed the correct way) are generated.

The comparison would be that you could watch a person talk and behave and state “They are smart.” But it would be foolish to watch someone and state “They have an IQ of 141.” The method is valid and perhaps more meaningful than an IQ test in determining whether somne is “smart” but it can not generate a valid IQ score.

If you want to learn more, visit his site (http://www.braintypes.com/), read his justification, and then look at how others view him by doing a quick google search (check out the papr “Braintyping: the Pseudoscience of Cold Reading” by Terry Sandbek for a different perspective). Perhaps you can decide for yourself if he is a charlatan or a genius.

I thought “ISFP” stood for “Incredibly Selfish Franchise Player”

This neidangle fellow is just another cheap hustler eeking out a living on the fringes of the NBA by duping gullible mules like Danny Ainge. It’s a simple twist of fate that led this franchise to being held under his spell, and one that all Celtic fans carry a burden of shame for. This track suited svengali sells his bill of goods to Shira and she recites it like a workaday reporter trying to get away for the weekend, yet Bob Ryan is lambasted as a pariah for pointing out that the Celtics have a weak bench.

These modern times make my head spin.

I wonder how Niednagel categorizes Doc and Ainge?

no need to knock shira for this excerpt, seeing as she didn’t actually conduct an interview with the brain “doctor”…..she just pulled some quotes of his that were probably from his website or his book….and it’s not as if she’s tring to tell everyone that she thinks this a legit science either….she’s just shedding some light on an interesting aspect of the celtics front office. personally, i think this guy is a total fraud, but i find the whole thing to be completely fascinating.

kozlodoev,
Using personality profiling as an HR recruitment technique is highly suspect. There is no definitive proof that its use yields favorable results. While it is widely used and accepted in some industries, such as financial services and law enforcement, many scientistics and psychologists reject it. Some of it’s major flaws are that it attempts to simplify the human psyche into a multiple choice questionnaire and that it relies on test subjects to answer subjective questions about themselves, and their perceptions of themselves may be wildly distant from reality.

I think it’s a highly debatable whether HR recruiters who rely on personality tests are respected professionals or are relying too beavily on an imperfect, unproven tool.

Cousin, hankfinkel,

I agree with that. However, just calling people names won’t do for an argument.

The Doc administers the Myers-Briggs type indicator. It’s a common personality test often relied on by employers. It’s something given to people all the time.

My wife is an employment counselor and is certified to give these tests. While the test isn’t hooey, relying on it too much to pick a player isn’t helpful altough somebody’s type can make a difference in how they blend with teamates. Diversity is somewhat of a plus. You can’t have a team made up of 5 players who are exactly the same as far as personality.

There are 4 scales and each of the paired options at the extreme ends is merely your personal preferred mode of operation. For example, at my office I’m an ENTJ. This type is described as the Field Marshall with George Patton as the archetype. I’m a much nicer version. A basketball team wouldn’t do well with 5 guys who are Field Marshalls like me but it is surely the best type to be for a point guard.

However, you can rate closely on some scales (making it easy to switch between modes) and everyone prefers to operate differently at different times and places. The J in my scale means that, at the office, I’m very organized and like things kept neatly and in order. I like to plan ahead and avoid surprises. However, at home, I don’t want to plan anything. That’s where I like to stop and smell the roses as they say.

True story: I was explaining this as an example of how people like to switch their preferences in different places to a bunch of my wife’s Myers-Briggs colleagues talking about this at a cocktail party (it’s actually fairly interesting to talk about). I got myself in trouble though because, while explaining how I’m a J at the office but not at home, I said that’s when my "P"ness really comes out. You can fill in your own blanks for the commentary that followed that remark.

This “your comment is too short” thing is really getting on my nerves, Jeff. I’ve done everything right and still get the prompt.
Grrr.
“Short” version: Shira Springer is no NBA columnist.
Hope that’s not “too short.”

My all-time favorite Jon Niednagel quote:

Cincinnati quarterback Carson Palmer, an ISFJ and the top pick in the ‘03 draft, will never be a great player because of the poor physical response to pressure. Niednagel believes Palmer’s ideal sport is bowling.

I want a scientist in a nice white lab coat, not
a track warmup suit. I want the PDBO types.
Play defense and box out. HTOM types. Hit the open man. WTDL, KTOA. When they drive the lane,
knock them on their asses. GBOD. Get back on defense. WWRD. What would Red do?

boooooooring!

Greg37,
Brilliant post.