Doc Having Fun With Lineups Already

You know what i consider fun Doc ?

Winning !!

Dont stuff this up.

Smooches.

Hondo.

this fiddling and diddling with personnel drives me nuts. it’s like the kid with a new watch who constantly puts it on, takes it off. inevitably, he loses it.he also wastes the preseason

Oh no. Not again. Please Doc, just get a set rotation together and try to stick with it. We don’t need to constantly tinker with line-ups given all the new faces on this team.

What’s a “linup?” It sounds like a small furry animal.

Well he answered the pace question and how we’re going to play. Quicker half of the league but nowhere near a Phoenix level. Much like the previous Doc years.

god, here we go again.

The short answer is emulate a rotation like the Spurs have because they are the NBA Champs. The detaled long answer is to setup different lineups due to injury, foul trouble, experiment to spark offense and defense when necessary. I can see experimenting with that at times during the preseason but the majority of the time it would be the normal rotation of players. The Patriots do it in Pre-season they have there starting lineups at the start of the games and as the pre-season goes on the starters play more but at the same time they get to see other lineups. I believe the best way to win a championship is balance of offense and defense. Past championship Celtics and the current Spurs champions all had that. I would like to see more Tall ball then Small ball like in the 80’s. I think we can have the best half court offense in the league and pick our spots to run like the 86 Celtics did.

just his excuse to play that small ball crap, send five guys out there with a size disadvantage was always his way, not like we didnt have enough disadvantages already in docs previous trys.

THIS is why Ainge had Doc call Larry Brown.

But small-ball seems to be getting “bigger” and more athletic as the roster continues to reshuffle. The small guys seem more talented too. Perhaps we’re getting to the point where small-ball no longer aptly describes the “second” or “third” unit?

Doc already thinking small?…We finally have a PF that will dominate smaller PFs, and now Doc will remove that advantage from KG….hhhmmmm

i agree with everyone’s sentiments here as well. though i will say i dont think this has the chance to have as much of a negative effect on the players this time around because were dealing with far more veteran players this time. experimentation can effect how younger players grow and learn and doc had to do so much teaching of the game itself the last few years. this time around doc doesnt have to do that so much but because hes dealing with so many new faces he wants to see which guys are gonna fit in well with the big 3. as long as this “mixing-and-matching” doesnt go on too long i actually dont have a problem with it.

I’m already getting woozy thinking about Doc’s lineups. Pierce at PF? why oh why. Ainge better pull the plug on him fast if Doc starts wrecking our season.

Ease up! If Doc had no ideas to look at going into camp, then you’ve got a right to babble. With a re-made roster he should be testing everything. You are the same guys who applaud adding a 16th and 17th guy to roster but want Doc to settle into a fixed rotation.

Master PO, I’ll take Scal over Battista-who. Scal is one of the role playing style winners in the Big 3 adventure we are beginning.

Dahntay Jones! Do you all forget the “exciting wing man” Jumaine Jones. I’d take a holiday on “Jones” and pray for “Allen”.

Doc hasn’t decided on tempo, because Paul,Kevin and Ray haven’t had time to tell him.

We haven’t lost a game and people are complaining already. Doc’s talk about pace, uptempo, different lineups was done just to get you guys talking. He did it out of the kindness of his heart because there’s been a lull lately. Even I was upset that we didn’t get more info about the workouts going on since labor day. Now Doc has talked and we can complain and this site will get so busy it will need to find another company to keep up with it. So says a Doc fan.

oh boy…we’re losing cabin pressure…

can they justify firing Doc if they lose their first preseason game?

Doc…Doc… please Doc…. no more “Jethro Bodine” bonehead moves….

Just when I was giving you a pass, someone must have thrown a brick at your head…..

Please Just let the boys go out and play and sit there like a good little dooby!!!

I don’t think it’s such a bad lineup if Pierce stays at SF and Posey is the one moving to PF. KG, Posey, Pierce, Ray, and TA(when healthy) are the best guys we have. I think that lineup could be pretty dominant. KG is such a good passer that having him play as the C in Doc’s offense will really get things moving. Also, unlike in the past with small ball lineups, teams would be moving to adjust to what we’re doing when we play them. Where KG plays doesn’t really matter: If there is anyone on the other team with a chance of stopping KG, C, PF, or otherwise, that’s who’ll end up guarding him.

Yeah, I think that Souza’s article is closer to the truth. Doc’s point about C’s rosters in the past is true… all the players were generally mediocre. Now there is a clear cut top 7 with TA and Posey. 8-10 in the rotation will shake itself out through preseason and the early part of the season. I’m a little weary of small ball but if it’s advantageous matchupwise than it’s not a bad thing. The Souza article really expresses some things that I’ve felt were difficult about Doc’s job, I think we’ll be pleasantly surprised with Doc this season a la Sam Mitchell.

Your comment is too short! How sad that this phrase continues to detract from an otherwise great posting site. Rephrasing a staement doesn’t work nor the omission of quotes. It’s a glitch pure and simple!

The ghosts of summer boredom are quietly being vaporized by the magic of literary expression. …we’re losing cabin pressure!…should we be allowed to BABBLE about the unknown?…does talent TRUMP coaching madness?…

It’s apparent that the HEAT is beginning to rise…

I dont see how even Doc can avoid playing as the starting 5: Perks, KG, PP, Ray Allen and Rondo, unless one of them is injured pre-season. Then he has to come in with Possey, Batista, House. Bringing in Allen or Danhtay will depend on Allen’s health. You got 10 players there. More than enough to keep the starting 5 relatively fresh thruout the season. Defensive match-ups will vary any sequence. Pruitt and Scal(uugghh!)will come in in blowouts. If Scal is played otherwise, then we are in deep _ I mean, trouble.

I forgot Baby Davis. He is kind of lost in that shuffle. I dont see us keeping Wallace, though I like the guy, nor Manuel. in the top 12. I just dont know who we leave out for Baby.

OK, just read the Souza article and putting the two together I think I get it: Doc’s gonna play the Big Three to death, but they’ll be out of position.

I can’t believe you all believe anything you read in the press about preseason.

C’s havent even played a game, Doc hasn’t coach a game with the trioka and you all are already complaining. Sound like a bunch of ex-wives and mother-in-laws.

Tampax stock once again goes up in the greater Boston area.

coaching becomes a factor when your in the 2nd round of the playoffs
and the two teams squaring off are pretty equal. thats when we will really grasp how important having an all-star coach to go along with 3 to 4 allstars really is.
Not so much when you either have a 7-3 10 game stretch or a 6-4 10 game stretch during the regular season.
last yr we came out of half time without making any adjustments to our game and the better coaches made adjustments and would overtake us in the 3rd or 4th qtr, this yr our talent wont allow docs inneficiencies and poor x and o decisions to cost us so many games.
like incidents of us not cvering the inbounds pass with 1 second on the clock and losing by 1 pt )detroit) because of the clean easy pass to a shooter was there. we wont only be 1 pt up so docs very poor coaching wont show until its to late and were too deep in the playoffs and possibly behind.

I was all set to give Doc a chance this season; but enough with “small ball” or a “three guard set.” How about we have a 7 or maybe 8 man rotation?

Remember last year?

He would put players into games for 35 seconds; for a minute and a half. What’s the point of that? This guy is a lot of good things – but game manager is NOT one of them. Someone else needs to be making the substitutions.

Mon, thanks!, I had read the Souza article earlier and agree, it’s a much more enlightened look at what the Celts face this preseason…I suggest others read it and calm down; we haven’t even got to our first official practise.
1 through 7 are set, and Doc has stated that overall he wants at least two of the Big three on the floor at all times. That allows for the possibility of three other players max in the mix: One would be TA for RA, if and when he’s 100%, (perhaps Jones until then), another is House behind Rondo, perhaps when KG is on the floor, and the other is Posey for Pierce…We’ll have a war at the 4 for minutes, may the best man win and Pollard will spell Perk, at least out of the gate, I imagine…
I think what frightens most people is becoming a team that must adapt to what other teams do. I don’t believe that this team needs any of that type of thinking…Let the opposition adjust to what the Celtics do…They won’t, because, overall, they can’t…This is a powerful team we have here, perhaps even more powerful than we dare yet imagine.

One last thing: D Jones makes the team over Wallace…two position player (2 and 3), especially with TA returning from disaster…
Batista makes the team over Manuel for obvious reasons…

Reyquila,

I agree, I don’t see how he can start another five. My hope is that they start every preseaon game they can. The second half can be a time for experimenting.

I have to say people getting on Scal kind of bothers me. He does so many little things that no one sees. He moves, he talks, and he hustles. He’s not worth the money we are giving him but a “quality” player shouldn’t be based on stats.

I believe since Ainge has put his reputation on the line with all these acquisitions, he will be a “hands on” General Manager and is not going to allow Mr. Rivers to whittle his team. Ainge Will definitely have him on a short leash.
BTW, I also forgot what to do with Pollard. We seem to have an excess of players now.

Every time Doc opens his mouth, he expresses why he should be fired.
Why are Danny and WYC not listening to Doc?

I think the rotation is pretty clear because Doc is going to be playing as many vets as possible. Posey and House will back the main backups off the bench, with Tony Allen seeing some time as he gets healthier. The only real rotation question is who the backup bigs are behind KG and Perk. I see the most likely candidate as Scal, with KG playing some center. A lot depends on whether Batista can replicate Perk with toughness and rebounding. If he can, then he could be the main backup big. I can’t see Pollard getting a lot minutes except for when we play Shaq or Yao Ming. I also don’t think the youngsters like Baby or Powe will see any time.

So, the bench should be: House, Posey, Scal/Batista, and some Tony Allen as he heals.

Doc, is a great guy…..

but he needs to go the K.C. Jones School of coaching…..aka 1986

Let the boys play…

I have a got feeling the middle of a time-out once Doc is trying to tell them what play to run……Garnett will just erase the board and just say “Give me the Ball”…

hmmmm that phrase sounds familar……..

This is just fun talk guys….the team will be okay…Once the season starts… Doc will see that he won’t have to do much coaching on the sidelines with these guys….

Doc is a terrible moron. He is just a complete fool. I mean it is obvious he has a terrible case of adhd, isn’t it? Its just numbing listening to his drivel. I swear he is missing a chromosome. Can we get a coach with all his chromosomes? Please? This is just going to be awful to watch him screw these guys up.

You guys are crazy. It’s preseason. It means nothing.
Ask yourself this. If you are doubting the Celtics already. WEre you a fan who a month ago was saying the Red Sox were going to blow it?
If you were, stop being so negative. The Negativity in this town stinks.
He may play small ball in the preseason for the nights when they have to play small. It’s normal for good teams to mess around with their lineups. Does anybody watch basketball? The Suns went small so your beloved Spurs played a lineup of Duncan at the five and Bowen at the four. Do you think thats their normal lineup? Is that their 8 man rotation that they never waver from?

no we aren’t crazy. Doc’s entire history tells us he does this. And in one article he says he will basically have a set rotation and in the other he says he won’t. these are quotes from him. What he is going to do is screw this up by playing guys out of position for stretches that are too long. This is what he going to do. Count on it. The question is whether thses guys are good enough to win anyway. I actually think they are because no one on the planet loves KG more than me. KG can overcome doc. But I sure wish someone else was the coach.

all this tells me is that everyone on the staff agrees Perkins and Rondo may very well suck this year… and they better think of alternatives quick.

I would really like to see the people calling Doc a fool, and a jerk, and an idiot, etc say those things to him. Better yet insult him like that to his family.

Nice people. Great to talk about people like that who you don’t even know.

How are people complaining about sifting through different lineups IN THE OFFSEASON, not even the Preseason…it boggles my mind.

What do you guys think a coach should do, have a set lineup before we have even played a single preseason game with a brand new team?? Or better yet, not test out the different lineups like everyone is complaining here about? I mean we do want to know the different variaties of play that our team could provide. You guys are the biggest crybabies in the world.

Reyquila said:
  I believe since Ainge has put his reputation on the line with all these acquisitions, he will be a “hands on” General Manager and is not going to allow Mr. Rivers to whittle his team. Ainge Will definitely have him on a short leash.
BTW, I also forgot what to do with Pollard. We seem to have an excess of players now.

Ainge has always been a hands on GM, but not in the way you are intimating. Danny Ainge is a disciple of Red Auerbach. Once retired from coaching Red stayed retired. He did not interfere. Ainge discusses things with Doc, but Doc makes the on floor decisions. Ainge was reticent about working with the players in practice. Doc asked him to do this. Doc is NOT on a short leash. For those intimating that Ainge and Doc are worried about their jobs or reputations I think you’re deceiving yourselves. This is the last year of Doc’s original contract (I believe). Danny’s contract is linked to Doc’s in time. Look at the extension Doc signed. It’s not one that would be signed by a coach wanting a long-term committment. It’s not good sense for a team to have a lame-duck coach even though I don’t think it’s a problem for this team. Now unless I missed it has Danny signed on for more years? I don’t think either one of them is concerned about job or reputation. They don’t need the job. They’d just as soon play golf and do color analysis work once or twice a week. I don’t think either one is thinking past this year.

Ancient Red said:
  Doc, is a great guy…..

but he needs to go the K.C. Jones School of coaching…..aka 1986

Let the boys play…

I think this is exactly how Doc WILL coach this year. I think he wanted to coach this way from the start, but found out he couldn’t do it. I think Doc would be happy if he didn’t call a single play or time out. He wants the players to be able to play and use their athleticism. He just needs to set up the framework and let them go and this is what he’ll do. But, it will take awhile to refine the framework until all the guys get used to playing together and learning each other’s tendencies. A week or two ago there was a statement by Ray Allen that he learned in their workouts this month that KG doesn’t like to receive bounce passes. This is the type of stuff that needs to happen and it will take time. And Doc even said in one of the articles today that once these guys learn the things that are new to them they will remember it. That’s what is so different from the past where the players will learn something and then forget it. That’s why Doc had to coach (teach, not coach) the way he did. Let’s not worry our heads so much.

LarBrd33 said:
  all this tells me is that everyone on the staff agrees Perkins and Rondo may very well suck this year… and they better think of alternatives quick.

Now where did this come from?

Doc deserves the criticism. the name calling comes out of frustration for the fact that he is still here and he is an awful, terrible, x’’s and o’s guy. Count on the fact that we have an awful bench coach. I suspect he is very good in the locker room. If he can get a set rotation and have guys have set responsibilities, we will win more than if he flitters around from lineup to lineup and has guys confused, which he has done his whole career. And he hasn’t been any good at spotting talent either, ie, play Telfair, not Rondo, play Scal and not Gomes, don’t try Al at Center until you have to etc etc etc

tmcdon said:
  I would really like to see the people calling Doc a fool, and a jerk, and an idiot, etc say those things to him. Better yet insult him like that to his family.

I agree with this sentiment, but Doc and Danny know quite well what people are thinking and they understand where it’s coming from. But both are secure enough not to let it get to them. Danny discussed this in the Globe or Herald today. As to Doc’s family, that’s one reason they aren’t living here (unless something has changed). Red Auerback went thru this stuff also and his family stayed in DC.

as someone pointed out he played with crazy lineups the last few years in the pre season and we enterd the saeason looking unprepared and confused, so that is why we are upset.

I think we have the greatest player in the world now, KG. We have a guy who is the best shooter in the league, Ray. and we have a top five drive the hole guy, PP.I like Posey and Tony too. RR and Perk will grow. We are going to win the title, imho, as long as the bench coach doesn’t screw things up by playing with crazy lineups. But this is the first thing he is going to do…wow, not a good sign.

Fantastic! I’m glad to see Doc is working on his strengths yet again…Ugh

To put it in simpler terms: Doc has been given all the necessary pieces to build a thoroubred horse capable of wining the Triple Crown. We are just worried that at the end of the day, he might build us a giraffe. ??%$#**&!

May aa well try “Tall Ball”… Garnett, Batista, Perk, Wallace, and Scalabrine. Doc was probably the guy who blew up the chemistry lab in high school.

The tinkering examples mentioned make sense. There is a clear cut top 7 or 8 getting the bulk of the minutes. When the C’s go small, they will do so for a speed advantage as well as an opportunity to play the top 5 players: Rondo, Allen, Pierce, Posey, Garnett.

When Rondo is on the bench, a 2 guard is going to have to replace him – either House (for his shot) or TA (for defense against bigger PGs).

I don’t think we’re going to see lineups of House, Pruitt, TA, Pierce, KG very often… No need to panic… yet. :)

If you think that a coach ought to play exactly the same team irrespective of the team they are playing against you know absolutely nothing about sports. The thought of sticking a team out there and not adjusting to game situation is rediculous. Doc is stating that he has ideas of trying out a couple different line-ups that will allow us to take advantage of the skills we have available to us. What is so difficult for most of you to understand about that?

Seeing as there are very few centers in the east, and most of you think Perk sucks anyway, why would he not play a little smaller and use our talent to our advantage?

If he had come out and said he is salivating over the thought of a lineup of Rondo, House, Posey, Scal, and Pollard and thinks that they can really play a majority of the time then maybe we have something to talk about. All of his adjustments included the Big 3 as the centerpieces.

Some of you, obvious from your posts, have absolutely no clue whatsoever.

Its virtually impossible for Doc to screw this up, too much talent

Using Posey at the 4 shouldn’t be any surprise as most of us respect his ability to guar mobile PF’s. The Ray, Tony, Eddie lineup shouldn’t be any suprise either, and that would be a lineup we could expect to see at the beginning of the second and fourth quarters, when Rondo, Paul and K.G. are resting on the bench. It is the Tony, Ray, Pierce one which bothers me more than anything.

I will be shocked if Perk averages 30 minutes a game. Doc will be too tempted to go with KG at the 5. And Perk may not warrant that much time anyway.

Where Doc will struggle is plugging the 4 spot when he subs for Perk and moves KG over to center. He won’t know whether to use Posey, Powe, or Scal…so we’ll still be seeing his typically inconsistent substitution patterns.

With this group of players the C´s have about the next 3 years to win a championship and DA is not going to let Doc screw this up. KG and RA sure as hell won´t let Doc screw up their last chance on winning a ring. If Doc doesn´t get his act together by the allstar break he´s gone. Otherwise DA will be gone. He is the one mortgageing the entire future to win now.

I am so glad Doc is coaching and not you guys. Players must get use to playing with each other and that is the point doc is making. pace and tempo is impoartant to set. you certainly don’t want play at a speed and pace your players are uncomfortable. all players not just three must get acquainted with one another. WE can Not play three on five. so why not determine the best five under different situations. Thanks goodness we got Doc.

Lets annoint 8 players today. Plays them all the minutes they are going to in the regular season. Don’t play anyone else.
Do any of you guys coach at any level?

Rondo isn’t as good as everyone hopes and Perk is a backup… they are going to experiment with lineups that will be effective.

This is an 82-game experiment using a 10 or 11 man rotation with this type of roster. Once the playoffs begin it will be shortened and revolve around the big three running the team with others defending, rebounding and knocking down open shots. I expect the regular season to be a learning experience but this will be a team that nobody wants to play in the first round.

oh god, freakin doc. I want to give him a chance for the first few months but past experience and knowledge and just hearing his stupid stupid quotes just wont let me……. he makes me WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY more nervous than anything else.

I really wish we had hired Stan VanGundy.

Larbrd that is BS, those two are great at the 1 and 5 with what they bring to the table with 3 superstars in the lineup. Theyre great for the starting lineup and bulk bulk bulk of the time

Celticswin (4th post down about) said it perfectly. I relly hope its that way too and think the team will be GREAT like that……. Doc makes me nervous but this team is gonna be amazing so Im not sweatin too much on Doc.

Great post you had though, completely agree.

————I think what frightens most people is becoming a team that must adapt to what other teams do. I don’t believe that this team needs any of that type of thinking…Let the opposition adjust to what the Celtics do…They won’t, because, overall, they can’t…This is a powerful team we have here, perhaps even more powerful than we dare yet imagine.

One last thing: D Jones makes the team over Wallace…two position player (2 and 3), especially with TA returning from disaster…
Batista makes the team over Manuel for obvious reasons…————

(cant use quotation marks)

I completely agree with that.

15 that make the team i bet are kg ray pierce rondo perk posey house t allen scal powe jones batista davis pruitt and pollard

 ShotCaller said:
  Its virtually impossible for Doc to screw this up, too much talent.

Don’t underestimate Doc!!!!!!!

thats where the problem is, there is to much talent for doc to screw this up so he will float by until the playoffs were the coach becomes the 6th man…time outs , X’s and O’s .substitutions , wether to have them adjust to us or we adjust to them.. my sister can win 7 out of ten
games with this team, but she would be lost in the playoffs like doc

actually she would do better, she would say hey you the tall one
get back oput there is it kg where as doc will be trying small ball crap in order to get scali maximum minutes

perk- Absolutely rediculous. Stop hating on someone who has accomplished more in his life than you have even dreamed about sitting there on your couch. Doc didn’t bring Scal in here. He has no affinity for him. Scal, while limited in talent, is a tough defender and knows how to play the game. If you can’t see that then you don’t know basketball. Sure, we would like to have someone that has those same things plus is a high talent, but then they are usually starting somewhere.

Why you possibly would think that KG won’t be playing huge minutes is beyond me. Maybe you should have that basketball phenom sister of yours start posting in your place as well. Sounds like she has a better handle on the game…

EJPLAYA-well said