Blogging With The Enemy: Forum Blue & Gold
We are one day away from the match-up we've all been waiting for. A Christmas gift, from the NBA to you and me. Of course we've been enjoying our 19 game win streak, but spoiled as we are, it just isn't as fun to beat up on the onetime rival Sixers and Knicks as it is to stare down our greatest rivals. The same rivals that were favored headed into the Finals last year. The same rivals that got most of the preseason buzz.
The Celtics may be repeating the mantra that all the games are important, but none of that resonates with the fans. This isn't just big for us, this is big for all sports fans. The world will be watching and I can only hope that the team we know and love will show up and display their dominance over the Lakers.
I want all Laker fans to receive a huge lump of coal in their stockings in the form of a Celtics stomping. Of course it is nothing personal. As it happens, one of my favorite NBA bloggers is a Lakers blogger. Hey, if Larry and Magic can do it...
So as is our tradition, here are some questions I shot at Kurt from Forum Blue and Gold and his answers back to me. Enjoy.
1. So, clearly the Lakers are obsessed with the Celtics. Do you see this as a good or bad thing? Has it been a distraction or motivation?
What you're asking is: Obsessed in a good way, or obsessed like I am with Scarlett Johansson?
I my opinion it is the good way, they are focused on the Celtics because they lost in the Finals. There's a lasting scar from game six. (By the way, a lot of the consternation from Lakers fans lately is because they are still skittish after that game.)
Actually, let me clarify that last paragraph: It's good, if the team uses it as motivation to get better, to overcome obstacles. They have not done that of late — for the first 10 games or so they came out on fire, but from there they grew comfortable and (unlike your Celtics) they have been playing to the level of their competition. Of course, part of what has been going on is that when his teams struggle, Phil Jackson lets them. It's how his Bulls and earlier Laker teams learned to win.
But the recent struggles along with seeing a streaking Celtics team again should remind this team where it needs to get to if it wants a parade and a banner. It's December, the Larry O'Brien trophy isn't handed out for six months, so there is plenty of time to get where they need to be. But the work starts now.

2. Along the same lines, it sounds like the Lakers have discovered this thing called Defense that seemed to work out pretty well for the Celtics. How much of that is Ariza and Bynum and how much of it is simply a renewed dedication from Kobe on down?
Part of it is personnel (when said personnel is focused), but the biggest change has been scheme. Phil Jackson won nine rings playing straight-up man-to-man, but the change in how fouls are now called on the perimeter has changed what he wants to do.
What the Lakers have instituted is a defense where the help comes out fast and far to the strong side, essentially bringing and extra defender there and zoning off the weak side. They trap anyone along the baseline they can. I could bore you with plenty more detail, but I'd suggest reading one of two posts about this: Mine or better yet Kevin Pelton's.
What this defense does is take advantage of what is the Lakers biggest strength defensively, their length. Even someone like Vladimir Radmanovic, not exactly known for his defense (how is that for being gentle), can play in this system — he doesn't have to be a stopper, he just has to shade his man and get him to drive to help.
That said, players matter. A lot. Ariza has been a big boost for the Lakers, he has been maybe the third or fourth best player on the team this season, and one of the few guys who brings it on the defensive end nightly getting steals and thriving in a faster tempo. He likely will get some time on Pierce.
As for Bynum, he definitely is a boost in the paint, providing a shot blocking presence that Pau Gasol just cannot. That said, he is playing like a 21-year-old a lot lately — being timid and afraid of picking up fouls (then getting them for stupid things). His growth this season will be key to the team's growth defensively.
3. It would be a shame to miss an opportunity for a rematch (I'm still bitter we didn't get a chance to sweep you in 1986), but who is the biggest Western threat to your return to the Finals?
This may sound like I've been hitting the Christmas eggnog early, but the team that scares me is Houston. If they are healthy (and that is a big, big IF). I've watched them when they have Artest in the fold, with McGrady and Yao healthy, and it is a scary. They can defend very well, and they can score inside or on the perimeter. Health and them keeping it together are big questions, but if they can they are loaded with talent we have only seen glimpses of.
The two others just below them are the two you expect — New Orleans (because CP3 can win games in the end and has a nice compliment around him) and San Antonio (do I really need to go into them and say why). That said, I don't think, if both the Lakers and those two teams are play their best game, that they can't beat the Lakers. They just don't have the talent.
A healthy and focused Huston, however, could be different. If they can get there.
And, on a side note, I want to wish a Merry Christmas and happy holidays to all the CelticsBlog readers and fans. I hope your holiday is everything you hope (except for a couple hours in the middle of the afternoon).
Comments
Merry christmas but this hype surrounding this game is ridicoulous, you’d think it was game 7 of the finals
by TheAncientRivalry on
Dec 24, 2008 9:02 AM EST
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I disagree
nobody thinks this is the Finals, but it is always fun to see how the teams react the next time they meet after the Finals and adding in the hype surrounding the rivalry is a whole lot of fun
"Would I rather be feared or loved? Easy. Both. I want people to be afraid of how much they love me." Michael Scott
by Jeff Clark on
Dec 24, 2008 9:34 AM EST
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PREDICTION
i’m calling it now, a 15 point win for us. final score: 107-92. can not wait!
by screwedupmaniac on
Dec 24, 2008 9:47 AM EST
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It'll be just "just another game"... if the Celtics win.
But if they lose it’ll either be a “challenge to their manhood”, a “blistering indictment of their sense of entitlement”, a “surprising revelation of their vulnerability”, or “clear evidence of their lack of commitment to practice”.
by no kidding on
Dec 24, 2008 9:52 AM EST
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right on
I can certainly hear the talking heads chanting 1, 2 or 3 if the unspeakable happens.
by Thruthelookingglass on
Dec 24, 2008 10:57 AM EST
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C'Mon, Ancient Rivalry, get with the flow
We only play them twice. The Legacy of the 80’s is NBA unforgettable. Bostonians have nothing in common with Angelenos (except now dancing girls). And this is sports for God’s sakes. Nothing beats arivalry. I can’t wait for this game.
by Wildblu1 on
Dec 24, 2008 10:05 AM EST
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Celtics-Lakers not Personal?
If the Celtics-Lakers rivalry isn’t personal, you need to find a new place to blog…
by Page_and_Plant on
Dec 24, 2008 10:32 AM EST
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ummm, no I don't
"Would I rather be feared or loved? Easy. Both. I want people to be afraid of how much they love me." Michael Scott
by Jeff Clark on
Dec 24, 2008 10:41 AM EST
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Lakers Defense
I respect the fact that they are giving it a shot, but those who watch the Lakers more than me say that they don’t give the effort day in and day out like the Celtics do
with that said, if they “turn it on” for the post season or even just for this game, they could be hard to beat
not that it would stop us from beating them, just make it harder
"Would I rather be feared or loved? Easy. Both. I want people to be afraid of how much they love me." Michael Scott
by Jeff Clark on
Dec 24, 2008 10:43 AM EST
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while I hope the C’s win I won’t be disappointed if they don’t. They have a lot going against them: a winning streak that everyone wants to stop, revenge by the Lakers and homecourt for the Lakers. I expect a tough game that could go in any number of different directions. We could get blown out and that won’t shock me. IF the Lakers don’t win this game I think the blow to their psyche is much larger than if we lose. In fact for this to be a rivalry the Lakers pretty much need to step up to the plate and win this game. If they don’t the Celts will feel like they own them
by Red2 on
Dec 24, 2008 11:00 AM EST
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I tend to agree
I really want this game, but if they lose, the silver lining is that the team will get ticked off and want the next one that much more
"Would I rather be feared or loved? Easy. Both. I want people to be afraid of how much they love me." Michael Scott
by Jeff Clark on
Dec 24, 2008 11:01 AM EST
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right now the top 2 teams are in the east: Boston and Cleveland so say what you want about the lakers, spurs, houston etc but the truth is that the eastern conference no longer has to fear who comes out of the west; now the western conference has to fear who comes out of the east and that includes Orlando as well and perhaps detroit if they get their act together
by Red2 on
Dec 24, 2008 11:02 AM EST
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the team that scares me the most out west is san antone— duncan and depth. the team i hate the most= the fakers-oh, they are good. watch out for ariza on pp. the big 5 will have to play a lot and stay out of foul trouble and the wild card is eddie. if eddie can hit the 3’s right away, watch out.
by nazzbo on
Dec 24, 2008 11:16 AM EST
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Watch out for ariza on PP?????????
Sorry but Trevor can not guard paul pierce, not only did they try it last regular season when paul dropped 33 on his head, most people forget ariza played in the finals…if paul has it going, the last thing you need to worry about is trevor ariza on Pierce, are you saying hes a better defender than Kobe?
by TheAncientRivalry on
Dec 24, 2008 12:07 PM EST
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Nobody Forgets
Last year Ariza was getting worked into the system and was playing far less minutes. Then he was injured and didn’t get back on the court until the Finals. So, if you figure a role player will be as effective coming in to play in the Finals for the first time after a few months of rehab (having played in the system for only a few months) as he would having had a full training camp and now averaging starters minutes then, by all means, the Ariza addition is insignificant. As for the quality of his D, Ariza IMO, is a better defended then Kobe. He has a very similar body, with similar quickness and speed. He locks down on his player and does not take the chances that Kobe does. I also seems to me he has slightly better instincts on D then Kobe. I’ll be happy to see Ariza on Rondo for parts of the game. He was effective bothering CP3 last night.
by P. Ami on
Dec 24, 2008 2:40 PM EST
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Okay..
I dont care how many seasons he’s been in a system, (is it just me or was half of our team new to our system last year?) if you cant guard someone, you cant guard someone…Trevor ariza was perfrectly healthy last regular season in LA and Pierce dropped 33 on him…I also dont want to hear him being rusty or not 100% in the finals…was Pierce 100%? is he right now? no … And if Ariza is a better defender than Kobe, that shows how much of a joke Kobe is.
Anyways, I believe if Paul Pierce is “on” noone can stop him, certainly not a young role player
by TheAncientRivalry on
Dec 24, 2008 4:06 PM EST
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Pay attention to detail
What you don’t understand is that having Ariza (actually playing consistently, not being thrown into the Finals after months off. That matter, you know) allows the Lakers to match up much better. No one is saying PP can be"stopped," but Ariza is versatile and can match up better on 2-3 guys better than what we had last year. He has long arms, quick hands. I disagree with P.Ami about Ariza being a better defender than Kobe, but he’s no slouch. He’ll allow our guys to stay home on their guys, and for Kobe to take less chances on his guy. Your 3’s killed us in the Finals, because we were caught helping too much.
Yes, half your team was new, but they were also border line Hall of Famers, hungry to win, after failing to lead their own teams. They were the most talented and they took care of business. Kudos to them.
by wondahbap on
Dec 24, 2008 4:17 PM EST
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Ariza
Has been in the league 4 almost 5 years and has a career average of 6/3 with 1 steal…can we stop saying he can stay at home on Paul Pierce, theres 0 evidence of this in fact, ariza couldnt stay in front of pierce any better than Walton, Radman, etc in the finals, I brought up the 33 in the regular season when ariza started on Pierce…and I dont want to hear the excuses of rust or not 100, I could say fatigue and not 100 about Pierce
by TheAncientRivalry on
Dec 24, 2008 5:25 PM EST
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Ariza has struggled with Pierce in the past. Paul’s strength has been a great advantage for him. I don’t think much has changed on that count.
by Who on
Dec 24, 2008 5:30 PM EST
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lest i forget- merry christmas and full stockings to all the great posters and to jeff,et.al. who make it all possible.
by nazzbo on
Dec 24, 2008 11:18 AM EST
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same to you!
"Would I rather be feared or loved? Easy. Both. I want people to be afraid of how much they love me." Michael Scott
by Jeff Clark on
Dec 24, 2008 11:19 AM EST
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get ready for the Rondo show
Rajon is gonna do DFish dirty!! Lakers got in from NO about 3am this morning, and DFish has had to play 40+ mpg in their last few games with Farmar out. Dude is gassed, I think they only really have Sasha backing him up…
by D Dub on
Dec 24, 2008 11:53 AM EST
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early lines out of vegas...
lakers favored by 3.
God bless and good night!
by BrickJames on
Dec 24, 2008 1:13 PM EST
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Rondo and Vegas
Hey guys, Kurt from Forum Blue & Gold here, just with a couple thoughts.
First, never buy the Vegas line with a Los Angeles team. So many Angelinos go to Vegas we skew the lines, people are betting the Lakers with their hearts, so it’s never a good reflection. This is true of USC football, big Dodger games, etc.
Second, Rondo is the guy that scares the crap out of me, D Dub. We have struggled with quick point guards again this season, even with the changes in defense. The Lakers need to find a way to slow PP this time around, but Rondo could fill that gap (so to speak) and kill us.
Finally, Jeff is right, the Lakers commitment to defense is not a nightly thing right now. Which is frustrating, as a fan. It was there last night in New Orleans, but totally missing a few days earlier. That said, this Laker team is wired differently than the Celtics. They just are not going to bring it all out for 82 regular season games. Kobe will, Ariza will, but not Gasol or Bynum or Radmanovic. What I want to see is the focus build as the season wears on. Who knows if that happens or not.
by Kurt on
Dec 24, 2008 1:24 PM EST
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Interesting comments...
Considering Vegas had you dogged last night against the quick CP3 + crew, yet you blew them out. I’m not disagreeing with what you are saying, just somewhat ironic that the events that unfolded 12 hours ago contradict your claims…
Anyways thanks for the Q+A and stopping by. Have fun losing tomorrow =D
God bless and good night!
by BrickJames on
Dec 24, 2008 1:34 PM EST
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I think the reason....
And this is just a guess, is that the Lakers had played like crap on the road trip and now were in the second night of a back-to-back, so people were down on the team. Honestly, there was as much relief as joy with that win last night, because it showed the team had some spark that we hadn’t seen in weeks.
But I’ve won a lot of money on that theory over the years, betting against UCLA basketball and such. Notre Dame football has the same effect, even when the suck like this year. I have no idea why.
by Kurt on
Dec 24, 2008 2:06 PM EST
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Defense will decide
The Lakers have yet to prove they can win against a tough defense.
by michael32951 on
Dec 24, 2008 1:44 PM EST
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???
Really? Like whose? They had no problem with any other team, and although Game 6 still lingers, they proved they can beat the Celtics as well. Not that it matters at this point, but the Finals wasn’t the complete ass-whooping most of you would like to think.
by wondahbap on
Dec 24, 2008 3:45 PM EST
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Lakers were 2-6 vs the Celts last year
So they proved they can beat the Celtics 25% of the time…
by nba is the worst on
Dec 25, 2008 9:31 AM EST
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Kurt, why don’t the Lakers bring it all out every night? Why doesn’t Kobe demand it?
by RebusRankin on
Dec 24, 2008 3:16 PM EST
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Interesting question
Assuming it was serious, of course. It’s something that I (as a Laker fan) have wondered too sometimes.
I think part of it is that we have short-term memories. Very few teams have the ability to play well all throughout the regular season and in the playoffs. It requires, to be honest, a freak of nature leader. Someone like Michael Jordan or Garnett, who just have unusual intensity every single day of the year.
But while I have a tremendous amount of respect for the heart you guys bring every night, the Celtics, to me, are the exception. Don’t forget that most teams can’t handle that. The Spurs were truly great, and usually didn’t turn it on until late in the season. Don’t forget the 2006 Pistons and the 2007 Mavs – regular season dominance, not so much in the playoffs. The Celts last year were the first team in a while to play hard every single night and succeed.
I’m not sure it’s something the Lakers can emulate, and I think Kobe knows that. The makeup of the team and even the coach is a bit more laid back. I can’t say I love it as a fan, but it’s the way most NBA teams operate.
by Snoopy2006 on
Dec 24, 2008 6:13 PM EST
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Good stuff
Forum Blue and Gold is a very interesting blog. Kudos to Kurt for the good work.
by cordobes on
Dec 24, 2008 3:38 PM EST
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Agreed
Thanks for coming on and sharing the insight, Kurt.
-sw
Manuel Aristides Ramirez is the greatest hitter I've ever seen.
by Steve Weinman on
Dec 24, 2008 5:13 PM EST
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A question of the rotation
I was wondering to some of the lakers fans that are commenting over here at the moment, what’s going on with the rotation? I’ve just been a bit confused to see Radmanovich and Walton basically swap places from starter/no minutes over the early part of the season. Are these just Phil Jackson’s mind games or does he really think that one or the other can contribute but not both?
Also, how has Lamar Odom handled playing off the bench? From the few games I’ve managed to watch as an Australian it seems that he hasn’t been producing greatly as of late, is this a trend we can expect to continue or is his game just in a slump?
Thanks in advance,
Bluey
by blueygreen on
Dec 24, 2008 7:12 PM EST
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The SF flux has to do with Ariza. Ariza is probably the Lakers 4th best player right now, so he gets the majority of the minutes and always closes the games out. He’s unquestionably our best SF. However, he fits better with the 2nd unit because his athletic running game. The Lakers 2nd unit gets out and runs, and Ariza is perfect for that. The starting unit plays a more half court offense, and so a better shooter is needed to play with them. That’s why Vlade used to start. When the Lakers offense stagnated, Phil inserted Luke because Luke’s an excellent passer, and Phil hoped that he would bring more ball movement and a crisper offense. That hasn’t really been the case. Vlade should be starting again. But both Luke and Vlade can’t get minutes because of Ariza, so it’s one or the other.
by Snoopy2006 on
Dec 24, 2008 7:54 PM EST
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Odom confuses everyone. The hallmark of his career has been inconsistency, so I think we can safely expect some great games from him and some not so great ones. He has been struggling more than normal lately, although the issues seem to be more mental than anything. I don’t expect this level of play to last much longer, though, I think we’ll see an improvement.
Bynum and Odom are both fragile mentally. Right now Bynum starts but Odom finishes games. It’s not great for either of their psyches. Once Phil gets a fixed rotation, it’s likely at least one of them will grow more comfortable and improve their play.
by Snoopy2006 on
Dec 24, 2008 7:57 PM EST
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Let's Get It On!!!
You guys did a good job of analyzing what to expect from this game. Kudos for that. With that said, I can hardly wait for this game to begin. The wait is killing me. Nice job the NBA and the national sports media (eg. ESPN, etc) did in hyping up this game. Now it’s time to end the talk and just get it on the court. I want the C’s to win this game badly. Getting the scalp of the Lakers on Christmas Day is the best gift I could have for this year. Let’s go for 20-straight! Go Celtics!
With that out of the way, I’d like to wish everybody here a Merry Christmas.
by Celtic_E on
Dec 24, 2008 11:17 PM EST
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