OK, Now You Can Panic (a little)

The Celtics are still one of the few legitimate contenders for the Championship and I still think we will end up winning it all this year. However, that doesn't mean that we can gloss over a 1-3 road trip and pretend that nothing is wrong.
Sure, we have the banner from last year, but honestly that doesn't buy us anything but a little bit of swagger this year. And I'm not sure that swagger has been all good. Maybe the team had started believeing in the hype after a 27-2 start. They are human after all, and it is very possible that they have been suffering from a bit of overconfidence.
There is a lot of buzz around the league about how much trash the team talks and the general outside opinion of the Celtics is that they are arrogant and disrespectful. You can write that off as petty jealousy, but you have to understand that when reporters ask you time and time again if something is a distraction, eventually it becomes a distraction.
There are tangible issues as well. For one thing the bench is officially a very big concern at this point. They contributed a whopping 9 points last night. Nine. We need help. We can't rely on the starters to do everything.
When asked about what the team needs to work on, Doc didn't pull any punches:
“Oh, the list is too long,” he said. “Timing mostly, defensively and offensively. You know, the more you practice the better your timing gets.”
It is also troubling to see the way the team has failed down the stretch of games lately.
Said Ray Allen, "Down the stretch we just made bad plays. It was reminiscent of the other losses."
Now, none of these flaws are fatal. None of these issues are beyond repair. The team has any number of excuses they can point to for the losses (fatigue, holidays, streak pressure, maybe even the refs - though I hate using that crutch). The team can get back to practice and a little bit of home cooking and all should return to normal.
The next three games are against the Wizards, Knicks, and Bobcats. So there will be ample time to get the kinks worked out before we face the Rockets and Cavs (who also lost last night).
Like I said, this team is still great. They have hit a rough patch and in the long term it may even help them focus and get back to basics. So when I say "it is ok to panic" I'm doing so with tounge firmly planted in cheek. I'm not trying to be "that Boston fan" that overreacts to a little bit of adversity. Still, there are real concerns here and the team needs to address them soon.
Bonus link: The Duke has some ideas on how to cure what ails this team.
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58 comments
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Comments
Our record was better than the way we were playing
Sooner or later, losses would happen. We started the season winning an insane amount of close games – Atlanta, Milwaukee, Toronto, Indiana, Charlotte, etc. That kind of crunch time dominance is unsustainable on the long run. It was our turn to lose some close games.
So, we can forget the losses; the difference is that the malaise is now partially translated to the W/L column . The problem has been visible since the pre-season: this bench hasn’t enough quality. From last season championship bench we lost the 6th man and arguably the best 4th player in the team, plus the first big of the bench. Their replacements, who were already here last season, put the effort but are not on the same quality level. The other teams are always able to make a run and regain confidence or put themselves back in the game. They are always able to create matchup problems. Very rarely a bench player can produce a positive, and sizeable, impact on the game. The starters were supposed to see their minutes way reduced this season; it’s not happening.
We have the best starting 5 in the league, but unless the players who constitute the current supporting cast grow up a lot in the next few months, we’ll need some key additions badly.
by cordobes on Dec 31, 2008 9:40 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Amen
-sw
Manuel Aristides Ramirez is the greatest hitter I've ever seen.
by Steve Weinman on Dec 31, 2008 10:54 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yes, the bench needs to grow up, and Doc needs to help them do so
I’ve been a broken record lately, so I’m going to shut up after this comment (too much holiday time on my hands I guess).
But Doc can help straighten out the bench a good deal by helping everyone to develop their roles better. And the best way to do that is to play Pruitt as the backup point guard. His play, as being more of a true point guard, will allow everyone else, including House, to fill in their slots better.
by no kidding on Dec 31, 2008 9:47 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Concern with size and sm forward defense
I am extremely worried about our lack of size on the bench. It seems that there has been a pattern over the last few games (Binum, Aldridge) where the opponent brings these guys back in the beginning of the 2nd and 4th quarter to matchup against Powe and BBD. The problem is not just that Powe and BBD are usually a lot smaller then their opponent, but we become very limited in what we do offensively. It simply becomes a perimeter game with Eddie or Ray Allen or a screen up top to rub off Pierce’s defender and get PP to match up with opposing point guard. TA seems to get lost in most of the games, he is not getting any calls and his finishing has not been as good as early in the season.
The second major concern for me is defense at the 3. PP has not been as good this year and TA has also been at times overwhelmed by larger 3s.
by nba_vman on Dec 31, 2008 9:48 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
you guys can have channing frye for a song
6’10" PF with range out to the 3 pt line, but can’t play a lick of defense or rebound. Going once…going twice…
by hawkblogger on Dec 31, 2008 1:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I hope Danny makes that trade foe Joe Smith before next Friday. I really don’t want to lose to the Cavs.
by Bankshot on Dec 31, 2008 9:52 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
and i dont like how the way Doc Rivers are holding the starters long in the bench. They may start on fire, but sitting for long time killed their intensity. Im not losing confidence on them, they can regroup and restart when they were halted..
by spoiled on Dec 31, 2008 9:56 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
no reason for panic but some for concern. let’s start with the big 5. rondo has shown his non all star side this trip. he has not played badly but teams are adjusting to him. he had 5 assists real early and then not much. his down low penetration and pass out to ray is being covered and rondo needed to put up some shots a la the phoenix guard. pp is playing really well but could crash more. ray is not looking good-missing layups. the bench is a mess because there is no on- the -floor leadership and glue. the ball is not flowing because the point is not pointing. the 5 played good d in the 4th quarter but the defensive intensity is not there as much with the subs. and the lack of length was evident last night in how we were outbigged for the boards. by the way, even tho he had a good game, i was not impressed with oden. he’s strong but slow and clumsy. he’s serviceable but 1-2 years away from being a force. aldridge, on the other hand is ready now and i liked the way the blazers were chippy.
by nazzbo on Dec 31, 2008 9:58 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Anyways, this loss was embarrassing, truly the worst loss of the year. did we really just lose a 14 pt lead to portland without brandon roy?
This isnt the same team on the road, specifically KG and Rondo… and the only thing that will redeem this pathetic road trip is a win in Cleveland, which isnt gonna happen, and it will NOT suprise me if we go on a bit of a losing streak here, this team IS overconfident, doesnt and cant play 48 minutes anymore and I dont care who we play, they all have more than a 50% chance with our PATHETIC bench
by TheAncientRivalry on Dec 31, 2008 10:00 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Find your Chi'
“If you plant rice, rice will grow. If you plant fear, fear will grow.” – Po
Is it Soup Yet?
by Master Po on Dec 31, 2008 10:18 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
thats deep man
spoken like someone who has never panicked before (except we know better) :)
"Would I rather be feared or loved? Easy. Both. I want people to be afraid of how much they love me." Michael Scott
by Jeff Clark on Dec 31, 2008 10:21 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Are you sure you're in the right place?
shouldn’t you be a rockets fan or a bucks fan? cheering on one of those guys whose name starts with a Y?
"Another spam message pops up. It gets trapped. Nowhere to go. To the recycle bin. RIP CITY BABY." --Ben describing Schonz checking his email.
by prezofdeath on Dec 31, 2008 10:22 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Please
Don’t mess with Po!
by Amager Celtic Fan on Dec 31, 2008 10:48 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
hahaaha
I watched the movie….I know better than to insult a panda
"Another spam message pops up. It gets trapped. Nowhere to go. To the recycle bin. RIP CITY BABY." --Ben describing Schonz checking his email.
by prezofdeath on Dec 31, 2008 10:51 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
the bench has no identity
In the beginning of the season, the bench came in with a purpose on offense. Leon Powe was posting people up, working them on the box and either scoring or getting fouled. We slowed things down to a halfcourt game and let him do his thing. For whatever reason, we’ve gotten completely away from that. Against the Lakers and Portland (both losses, obviously) Leon took zero shots. No wonder our bench is losing leads!! Our only inside scorer isn’t getting the ball.
by MetroGlobe on Dec 31, 2008 10:32 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
There has to be a move on the horizon..
I cannot imagine Danny is just leaving things as they are after watching the teams 2nd unit get waxed on this road trip. It’s a team game and all but the 2nd unit is the issue here. Pruitt could resolve some of the issues but not all of them and the league seems to have taken notice that the key to stopping the C’s is to out play the 2nd unit.
I’m not going to say the ‘P’ word, but we’re now seeing what his real value was.
by teaguelife on Dec 31, 2008 10:32 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
timing
Glad to see Doc mention timing…that is my mantra! We have been a little off lately. However, last night I thought we were outplayed by a team that was “in the zone” timing wise. It happens. I would still like to see Pruitt and OB get some playing time (and not have all the clairvoyant boo birds write them off before they play meaningful minutes). After all….we lost anyway, and if we had lost by more points because of the play of OB and Pruitt it would have still only counted as one loss. The west coast trip has always been a hard one. We are not sneaking up on anyone this year. Instead of tearing the Celts down, how about giving Portland some credit.
Until Danny does make a trade, or pick up a free agent, Pruitt and OB are what we have and we had better develope them.
by thirstyboots18 on Dec 31, 2008 10:38 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
POB, Big Baby and a Pick
to the Clippers for Camby and then sign Starbury. Team bench problem solved.
(all sorts of Team Chemestry problems created… but whatever.)
by teaguelife on Dec 31, 2008 10:43 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
salaries don't match
so it won’t work
"Would I rather be feared or loved? Easy. Both. I want people to be afraid of how much they love me." Michael Scott
by Jeff Clark on Dec 31, 2008 10:48 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Marbury is brain-dead and Rivers can’t manage brain-dead players so it won’t work anyway.
by Finkelskyhook on Dec 31, 2008 11:11 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Paul Pierce
was the only bright spot most of this trip and certainly last night…KG needs to stop letting opposing crowds get to him, its sad
by TheAncientRivalry on Dec 31, 2008 10:44 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Very well said, Jeff
Agreed with the whole message, that it’s not worth going off the deep end for us right now, but it’s clear that we have some concerns that need to be addressed.
-sw
Manuel Aristides Ramirez is the greatest hitter I've ever seen.
by Steve Weinman on Dec 31, 2008 10:54 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
This is a tired looking team. That’s why I wondered why Rivers would have his starters out at all in the second half of that scrimmage against Sacramento. There is no logic to having starters pounding on an NBDL team. Since Rivers didn’t seem to observe the 4th quarter of the GS game, history repeated itself.
I’m tired of hearing the bench being blamed for losses. The bench was barely on the floor. The starters didn’t exactly show up for this game, either. They got killed on the boards. I watched the first half of last year’s game 6 against the Lakers this morning before work. Van Gundy was blasting Gasol for being soft inside and getting beat up by Garnett. Maybe he should have in Portland last night talking to Garnett. Garnett did a stellar imitation of Gasol last night.
“The next three games are against the Wizards, Knicks, and Bobcats.” Hey Doc: When these games are out of reach, rest you’re starters. Find out what you have on your bench. It’s okay to win by only 15-20.
by Finkelskyhook on Dec 31, 2008 11:05 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Garnett does this all the time
Garnett is a soft finesse player, I find it funny how people sit around calling Gasol soft as a babys bottom etc…Um hes no softer than KG, I remembe a few times in the finals where gasol just backed KG down and dunked literally right on his head
by TheAncientRivalry on Dec 31, 2008 11:42 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
THANK YOU!!
was invisible in the 4th quarter. I’ll repeat was invisible in the 4th quarter. All he ever does is shoot 18 footers. Th only times he score point blank is an alley-oop from Rondo. He NEVER did back anyone down in his career. Perk defended Pau well, not .
Hey, what happened there? It was who was invisible in the 4th. It’s not working. That’s how bad it was. It’s invisible here too.
K – G. There.
by wondahbap on Dec 31, 2008 12:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
By the way
I don’t buy that Pau is soft. Never did. I just think he expected certain calls to come, and they didn’t. He’d never been that far into the play-offs and he spent too much time expecting regular season calls, and not adjusting to playoff basketball. He constantly let the ball be swiped low, which is usually a whistle. Or waited for the refs on contested shots.
Utah was the only real test (he was far better than any big man they have anyway), as far as play-off no calls, and he didn’t adjust to the no calls, added with a better overall team defense of Boston.
by wondahbap on Dec 31, 2008 12:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This Used To Be My Impression Too
But KG is changing and taking it more to the basket and he’s taking it hard. His position on the floor makes it hard for him to go at the basket with one or two dribbles, but the C’s are doing pretty well with him playing the way he does. Also, KG is a team defender and I wouldn’t call him soft on that end.
by TrueGreen on Jan 1, 2009 9:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
What bothers me about this bench is every time they’ve gone to it lately, the team has stalled — and I’m not just talking about this road trip. And it’s a trickle down effect. The coach loses confidence in them — the starters end up playing more minutes that they should be and they become susceptible to blowing late leads or looking tired as they have on this trip.
Plus as was proven last night, they can’t stop teams with size up front. HUGE (and possibly insurmountable) problem if you get the wrong match up in the playoffs.
by Kuberski33 on Dec 31, 2008 11:24 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Yep. Atlanta, Cleveland, etc.,
That IS the playoffs.
by teaguelife on Dec 31, 2008 11:34 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Why did the celtics let that counted basket effect them so negatively? it tottally deflated the whole team, I thought they would come out in the 2nd half and just put the blazers away because of it, instead it went the other way
by TheAncientRivalry on Dec 31, 2008 12:32 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
That basket didn;t affect the outcome of the game.
You can use that as an excuse if you want, but they just didn’t have enough energy, enough offense, and didn’t make a stop when they needed it. Using that play as an excuse is a cop out.
House’s 3 pt. attempt was inexcusable. Travis Outlaw shouldn’t walk by PP on his way to dunking on KG, Doc Rivers shouldn’t be 3/4 court pressing Portland’s PG’s with KG and Ray Allen with a minute to go.
by wondahbap on Dec 31, 2008 12:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Im not saying thats why they won
Im saying it affected the way our guys played, or it certainly seemed too…refs get in their heads to easily on the road
by TheAncientRivalry on Dec 31, 2008 12:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah...
it was surprising to read in the ESPN recap that they kept talking about it throughout the game. That’s the kind of thing you’ve got to let go, just like an ejection, a flagrant, or any other missed call.
If I were a coach in the NBA, I’d be taking notes. You can take the C’s out of their game by throwing weird crap at them.
by LicketyBrindle on Dec 31, 2008 8:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
As a Laker fan
I don’t want to make it seem like I’m just piling on when the C’s lose, but the bench is showing some major problems right now.
I knew the game was over when McMillan brought in Oden to play alongside Pryzbilla against the 2nd unit. No way Big Baby and Powe can do anything offensively or defensively against them. They are BIG and physical. The point is, the rest of the NBA has seen the weakness, and it will continue to get exploited from here on out. Professional sports are full of copycats, and I just knew it was coming before it the sub was made.
From here on out, the opposing team is going to put a big line-up against the 2nd unit. Especially in close games, when they can extend the lead, or close the lead. Couple that with good pressure on TA or House, and it’s an even bigger problem. Portland had the length, athleticism, and coaching to expose those areas.
by wondahbap on Dec 31, 2008 1:08 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I think alot of us are well aware of this
by TheAncientRivalry on Dec 31, 2008 1:10 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The Blazers are your matchup problem before ours, Laker Fan
You may have to deal with Oden, Przbilla, Outlaw, and Aldridge vs Bynum, Gasol, Odom, and um Radmonovic. Not to sure Kobe over Brandon Roy is enough to compensate. The Blazers are coached to play defense. Can your team step up? If you want another shot at our team in 2009, you better take care of Portland first, bubba!
Boston Celtics - 2008 World Champions
by QuinielaBox on Dec 31, 2008 1:18 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Okay. That's funny.
1.) I wasn’t talking trash. I know all about the Blazers, they are in the West. Trust me. THEY have to step up, not us. We beat them often, so what’s your point? It won’t be Portland stopping the Lakers from seeing the Celtics again.
2.) I was pointing out a fact about the game that took place last night, and how it affects your team in regards to the rest of the league. So chill out.
3.) Bynum, Gasol, Odom, and um Radmonovic > Oden, Przbilla, Outlaw, and Aldridge
4.) Kobe over Brandon Roy is A LOT.
5.) Before you etch your name in another trophy, and say we have to go through Portland(?), then you should also remember that other team kicking ass in the East. You know, the one with LBJ. It goes both ways.
by wondahbap on Dec 31, 2008 1:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Bynum, Gasol, Odom, and um Radmonovic > Oden, Przbilla, Outlaw, and Aldridge
Dont agree with that
by TheAncientRivalry on Dec 31, 2008 2:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
They why are the Lakers better?
Along with Brandon Roy, they are THE core of the Blazers.
by wondahbap on Dec 31, 2008 2:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Gasol is the best out of the players mentioned, but Oden and byum are a wash and I give major advantages for Pryzbilla, Outlaw and Aldridge over Odom and Radmanovic…Also I would say the Blazers front court rebounds the ball better, which really killed us last night…when we played the lakers we still outrebounded you guys
by TheAncientRivalry on Dec 31, 2008 3:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Oden and Bynum are tied
This is a very ignorant comment. Bynum isn’t a rookie.
by Fundefined on Dec 31, 2008 3:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pau over Aldridge.
Bynum is better than Oden because his offense it MUCH better. Odom over Pryzbilla. Outlaw and Radman is a wash.
They outrebound you, yet we out rebound them when we play them. That’s situational. The Lakers are one of the best rebounding teams in the NBA.
by wondahbap on Dec 31, 2008 3:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Actually
the Lakers are fifth in offensive rebounding percentage. Portland is first.
LA is thirteenth in defense rebounding percentage. Portland is eighth.
Portland has a clear edge in rebounding. And if the Lakers beat them all the time, why did they split the season series last year?
Odom over Przybilla? Are you serious?
by Cablinasian on Dec 31, 2008 6:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Are you?
Lakers are 2nd in rebounds per game. Portland rebounds about .531 %, Lakers at .521. Not that huge a difference. I believe we killed you on the boards last game, and out rebounded you 2 of 4 games last year, and tied in another.
Pryzbilla is nothing but a hacker. He’s good for getting Kobe fired up. A 7’ version of Matt Harpring. LO is one of the most versatile players in the NBA.
Wow. You split last year. Good for you. Blazer fans are cute. You’re tough at home. I’ll give you that.
Are you Cablinasian from Jim Rome take fame?
by wondahbap on Dec 31, 2008 7:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
A Reminder and a New Years Resolution
The Celtics are 28-5 as of this writing. We ran into 5 hungrier opponents so far this year. We’ll run into more. We’ll also run into teams that have apparently given up like Sacremento. The rest of the league except my candidates for contraction is fairly healthy and are competing for playoff spots or at least trying to build a future.
So the Celtics are coming off a 1 and 3 road trip West of my home and I assume they are safely home east of me. I’m disappointed that they lost in Golden State with their 4th quarter collapse and that is an accurate statement. I think there are adjustments that need to be made, particularly with the bench. But most of it is break down in fundamentals like not boxing out or mistakes in rotation that cost us in Golden State and Portland. Both present matchup problems. Portland is troubling due to taller personnel. Davis and Powe were simply overmatched and therefore not effective and Eddie House could not make his shots because he could not get open. I think we will get the Lakers or the Rockets in the Finals anyway in 2009. It is 2010 to 2015 that I am worried about if this Oden kid breaks out.
So I think the Celtics have the tools to solve these matchup problems so my new years resolution is to avoid panicing on the messageboards.
Boston Celtics - 2008 World Champions
by QuinielaBox on Dec 31, 2008 1:12 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
“The Blazers started three rookies on Tuesday night for the first time since 1971 and still managed to beat the Boston Celtics 91-86.”
realGM decided to make this frontpage news, they also published “PJ Brown is officially retired”
by TheAncientRivalry on Dec 31, 2008 3:14 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I think this is a tired and familiar argument...
…the Celtics hit a lull last season and everyone flipped out – we were having problems offensively, defensively, and everyone said similar BS….
…listen, the bench needs a better back up center than Davis and it would be “neat” to get a veteran scorer/playmaker, but the idea that the bench is the issue that will prevent the team from winning the ’chip is silly.
This year, Doc is playing an entire bench “unit” in order to keep the starters minutes down and to maximize the minutes the entire starting 5 play together – If the team was mixing its top 3 bench players into the game with 2 or more starters – as they would in the playoffs – they’d be much more productive.
We’ve seen this bench produce when used this way, but Doc wants the starting lineup in peak physical condition going into the playoffs, so he’s using a true “2nd unit” something he didn’t do with anywhere close to the frequency he’s now doing…
The Celtics will lose 15-20 games this year – deal with it…
by BillfromBoston on Dec 31, 2008 3:17 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
thank you, Bill. The level of ADD on message boards is nausiating.
by D Dub on Dec 31, 2008 7:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Re-read Metro Globe
He is on it. The 2nd team O often went through Powe to productive ends. For the last two weeks…not happening. Other teams have adjusted. So, need to adjust to the adjust which is maybe why we’re seeing more BBD. But that hasn’t worked. Doc needs practices, as he has said. And you should all be patient. Pruitt’s time is near and POB may also get some looks.
Also agree with other comment re the starters. They are still getting rested but not winning the 4th Qtrs as was their fashion.
by Wildblu1 on Dec 31, 2008 5:50 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Portland
No one has mentioned Battum. 19 years old, has long arms, jumps quick, runs like a deer, plays hard. I see all defensive team in his future. Does anyone else?
by Little D on Dec 31, 2008 6:35 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I don't understand why they have to talk so much trash.
I know you’ll say it’s just a part of the game, especially when you’re the reigning champs; even that it’s necessary to take teams down a notch when everyone’s bringing their A-game and dropping confetti from the rafters when they beat you.
But I can’t remember a champ in recent history that acted as arrogantly as Boston does. The Spurs just brought their game, year after year (aside from Tim Duncan googly-eyeing the refs after every call against him.) The Lakers did talk, but not like KG does. I think you have to go back to the Detroit Bad Boys of the early 90’s to find a team as arrogant and talky as this one.
Why is it a part of the game?
by LicketyBrindle on Dec 31, 2008 8:26 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Talking trash is a part of the NBA game. The Celtics are not the only team talking believe me. The celtics are under a microscope though because they are so damn good. Well except this west coast road trip.
Do we even know what the guys are saying? Does anyone know except the refs and players? Geez I am sick of Laker fans coming and critizing the Celtics for this when fans have no idea what is even being said. If Boston didn’t have a ring no one would be mentioning this.
by esp4p3 on Jan 1, 2009 2:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
























