Are Paul Pierce and Ray Allen Hall of Famers?

they’re both close and have a way to go in their careers. if pp gets to 20,000 pts. and 5,000 rebs. and assts. he probably will make it. i don’t know if jack sikma is in and tho not a comparable player, he never was the top center but was all around good and deserves to be in. pp and ra seem to be like jack, 1b not 1a types.

The ring is the thing in the eyes of the people electing. For a baseball comparison, look at Jim Rice. Incredible career. But missing out on the ring will forever dog him in the eyes of whatever commitee… I don’t agree, personally. A great career is a great career.

Pierce and Allen are both All Stars who have played cosistantly great ball for a very long time. The both continue to improve and are far from the one dimensional players who routinely get/will get elected.

Not at this point but the next few years are the most important of their careers. Simply not enough winning at this point.

With the expanded league several players will have impressive stats in comparison to past years. They aren’t all going to make it. Winning provides the degree of seperation.

It’s surely rare to be confident of someone’s HoF credentials when they have 5 years left in their career … not really a debate for today.

I generally agree – however if PP or RA have EXCEPTIONALLY long careers they can also get in that way. Reggie Miller probably makes the hall for that reason..

I don’t think there’s much question that Pierce’s number will (and should) be retired by the Celtics when all’s said and done. HOF, on the other hand… the jury’s still out. But even without a ring, if Pierce plays another 4-6 years of All-Star level (or close) basketball, I think his numbers will speak for themselves. Ray Allen is a tougher call, because while he may be one of the great shooters in NBA history and a great scorer, he doesn’t seem to have a Hall-of-Fame worthy all-around game. I could see it going either way for Ray, but again, it really all depends on the next 2 or 3 years and whether the get that ring.

Unlike the thugster and Kobe, Paul and Ray have no history of undermining their teams and their coaches.

Such brilliant commentaters as steven i smith and Bill Walton think the thugster and Kobe are first ballot HOFer’s. ;D ;D

If one was using that criteria, Ray and Paul would be HOFers now.

Both have a lot to accomplish before they are deserving to be in the same club with Russell, Havlicek, Cowens, Bird, Chief, DJ, McHale etc etc.

I’m surprised you can honestly say that this is a “very, very rough filter[/u] at best.” They make >135 a likely HOFer based on their index, and just about everyone above that number is in. Those that aren’t are either not yet eligible and [u]will be in or are members of the often discussed “players that should be in the Hall of Fame by now” argument (Haywood, Bernard King, Artis Gilmore, Adrian Dantley, et al). I think it is about as accurate a gauge of HOF status as you’ll find. And sorry, Pierce and Allen just don’t yet have the credentials. I think they may when they’re done, but not yet.

To mcpu40…. come one now. What the one thing that all but guarantees a Hall of Fame induction? Winning the NBA MVP. Garnett’s done it. Pierce and Allen have not. 2nd most important thing (according to Basketball Reference research)? All NBA 1st Team honors. Garnett has been 3 times I believe, Pierce and Allen none. Then there’s the sheer amazement by the man’s numbers. He’s already the only player in history with at least _ points, ____ boards, _ assists, ______ steals, _______ blocks (left numbers blank, just think there is nobody with at least as many in one category, that also has at least as many in every other category…. apologies to Wilt and Kareem for putting up numbers before steals/blocks were counted.)

I also believe if KG ended up on the cusp, his place in history would get him in. He started the revolution of teens in the NBA, forcing a rule change within 8-9 years of his decision to go pro. He also changed the way “power forwards” are perceived… from the Barkley or Malone type brute force inside-out threats, to tall, versatile, athletic guys that can hurt you all over the court. His place in basketball history is already set in stone whether or not he wins a ring, I can’t say the same about Pierce or Allen (although Allen’s 3 point proliferations makes him close).

with ring(s) they are first ballot HOFers, without eventually. Especially Ray being the #2 all time 3 point leader, I don’t know if he has time to catch Reggie but if he does, so much the better. Also politics plays a role too, ask Artis Gilmore.

Does Scal have the cedentials to get in?

Of course Scal goes in. With the rest of the tour bus.

Paul Pierce is well on pace to end up as the 2nd highest scorer on the most successful franchise in NBA history, and you are asking if he is a hall of famer? Jeff please, that is a joke. He is going to outscore Larry Bird, I mean my god. A championship is not needed for him to be a hall of famer. That helps, but it is not a pre-requisite. Karl Malone won’t need it, Barkley won’t and neither will Pierce.

Ray Allen is not nearly the complete player that Pierce is in my opinion, however he does not need a ring either, he is a lock already. Being the 2nd best 3 point shooter in NBA history should just end the argument. If you are the 2nd best in any of the major statistical categories that matter, you are a clear cut hall of famer. End of discussion. Next topic please.