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Daily Babble: Wondering What the Cavaliers Achieved In Blockbuster

Whether or not the Cleveland Cavaliers were on the level of the Pistons and beloved Celtics prior to Thursday afternoon's NBA trading deadline was up for debate.

Given that the Cavs are no longer the team they were Thursday morning, that debate seems moot at this point.

That said, if indeed the Cavs weren't on the level of the Pistons and Celts in the first place, Thursday's blockbuster trade with the Bulls and Sonics certainly doesn't seem to have magically put them there.

By now, chances are you know the details of the deal like the back of your hand.  But just in case there is any need for a refresher regarding a deal involving three teams and eleven players, the excerpt from ESPN's report on the matter lays out the basics below:

Unable to finalize major deals in the past, [Cavs GM Danny] Ferry pulled off a colossal one at the 3 p.m. buzzer. He sent guard Larry Hughes, forwards Drew Gooden and Cedric Simmons, and guard Shannon Brown to Chicago for [Ben] Wallace, one of the game's top inside enforcers, and [Joe] Smith, a versatile veteran.

Cleveland also acquired the sharpshooting [Wally] Szczerbiak and [Delonte] West from Seattle for forwards Ira Newble and Donyell Marshall, two expendable parts. In addition, the Cavs will get Chicago's second-round pick in 2009. The Sonics will receive guard Adrian Griffin from the Bulls.

Sadly for Cavs fans (and likely happily for most of the devotees on this site), we don't have an excerpt to quote with a foolproof explanation of how this move represents too much of a major upgrade for the Cavs (Update: Foolproof or not, Cavalier Attitude's John Krolik has a well-written piece up demonstrating a far more optimistic analysis of this deal than the one you are about to read).

Read More..

All of Steve's daily posts can be found in the CelticsBlog: NBA blog.  Check him out!

 

Star-divide

It's worth disclaiming at the outset that yes, it's reasonable to believe that this move could indeed be very helpful for the Cavs.  Ben Wallace could return to the Ben Wallace of old. Wally Szczerbiak could be that stretch-the-floor offensive presence that LeBron James needs, especially while Daniel Gibson sits for the next four to six weeks with an injury.  Delonte West could be the stud point guard with a shooting touch that this team has needed for a while, and Joe Smith could make everybody forget about Drew Gooden.

It isn't inconceivable that some or all of those possibilities could come to fruition.

But it isn't all that believable either.

The 33-year-old Wallace has been a shell of his former self throughout the season.  Never much of an offensive option, he has been more putrid than ever there this season (37.3 percent from the field, 42.4 percent from the foul line, not much of anything else).  Of far greater importance is the fact that he clearly isn't the defender he once was.  His blocked shots are down and his rebounding is way down from what it has been in previous seasons.  Though he has certainly been plagued by injuries at times this season, it has been clear all year that Wallace hasn't moved with the ease and power he once did on the defensive end of the floor, and he isn't the dominant defensive player that he was during the prime of his career. 

In some regards, Wallace may legitimately have reached a point in his career where he is a less energetic (and less offensively useful) Anderson Varejao.  While Wallace played on the team with the league's eighth-ranked defense all season, it is worth noting that the Bulls were 4.3 points per 100 possessions worse with him on the floor than off this season.  By the same token, the biggest reason the Cavs' defense is only ranked as high as 16th in efficiency is the fact that the man they call the Wild Thing missed the first 30 games of the season.  With AV on the floor, the Cavs are 9.2 points per 100 possessions better defensively than without him.  That's an astounding figure.  Of course, simply citing team defense stats with players on and off the court doesn't tell the whole story about individual defensive performance, but the numbers here should most certainly provoke some thought.

Beyond all that, what the Cavs will do with Wallace with regard to their rotation remains to be seen.  How they choose incumbents Varejao and Zydrunas Ilgauskas along with Wallace and Joe Smith is a major question mark, and how quickly Mike Brown will be able to find a successful set of combinations there remains in doubt.

There is no guarantee that the Cavs have upgraded at power forward.  Drew Gooden had been doing an admirable job all season, averaging 11.3 points and 8.3 boards while playing solid defense to boot.  He was an established part of the Cavs' rotation, and he was doing what he was paid to do.  The 32-year-old Smith is six years older than Gooden, a comparable scorer, not as good a rebounder and not contracted beyond this season.  Two more years of the 26-year-old Gooden seems like it could well have made more sense than an expiring Smith and a highly paid Wallace whose productivity or lack thereof has left plenty of room for improvement of late.

As for the former Celtics headed to Cleveland via Seattle, the question marks continue to come forth with abundance.  To Danny Ferry's credit, Wally Szczerbiak is definitely an upgrade over the oft-maligned Larry Hughes so far as outside shooting is concerned.  It was also crucial to the Cavs to get rid of the ridiculous contract that Hughes had that it seemed nobody would take (although the fact that they had to take on Ben Wallace's even-worse deal in exchange has to at least somewhat nullify that victory).  Szczerbiak had been having himself a nice campaign off the bench for the Sonics and has shot the ball with proficiency throughout the season.  That said, especially having seen this guy play during his stint in Boston, it's worth noting that he contributes nothing else.  He isn't quick, can't create his own shot, doesn't rebound and plays absolutely zero defense.  Further, Wally isn't the scorer he once was.  Next to LBJ, he should still probably fit better than Hughes did, but  the departed two-guard could get to the rim and defend better than Wally World can, and he could handle the ball when needed as well.  And like Hughes, Wally hasn't lived an injury-free life.  No guarantees here.

Finally, three and a half seasons into his professional career, Delonte West is no less of an enigma than he was when he entered the league in green and white back in 2004.  West was a fan favorite in Boston, and deservedly so.  He is a personable guy with a perceived sweet shooting stroke who plays hard every time out.  As a Celts fan, I repeatedly talked myself into believing that he could be the point guard of the future for this team. And on certain nights, he can look very good. 

But the same problem that doomed Delonte in Boston is the same problem that sticks with him now: He is a combo guard without the necessary skills to be truly proficient at either spot.  West doesn't have the ball-handling or the court vision abilities to make him a truly solid point guard, and he doesn't have the size or the slashing abilities to be a stud two-guard in the Association.  He can do some good work as far as getting to the basket at his size, and yes, he can moonlight at both spots, but he isn't the true point guard the Cavs have been hoping for and some fans are already making him out to be. 

West has also been stunningly inconsistent throughout his career, and it bears note that West's shooting figures have never been as good as his "sweet shooting touch" label might lead one to believe.  West has shot 44.4 percent from the field and just 37.0 percent from beyond the arc (a supposed specialty) for his career, and his numbers this season are patently awful: 38.8 percent from the field, 33.9 percent from beyond the arc and an awful 66.7 percent from the foul line.  In fact, his true shooting percentage is actually lower than that of Hughes.  What all this tells us is that it might not be too great an idea to get excited about the prospects of Delonte in wine and gold.

There is without question a long way to go on the road from the NBA's trading deadline to the Finals in June.  The Cleveland Cavaliers earned some points on Thursday by finally ridding themselves of a highly paid player in Larry Hughes who was evidently not going to succeed in the environment there.  They also added four players who certainly bring with them the possibility of helping this team improve.

But there is at least as good a possibility -- and perhaps more so -- that they won't. 

0 recs  |  Comment 24 comments

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The Cavaliers think they have upgraded by swapping Larry Hughes and Drew Gooden for Wally, West, and Wallace? Man, I’d love to be around for the rude awakening.

by kozlodoev on Feb 22, 2008 2:51 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

“We’re on a fast break and I’m waving him on, but he’s coming up behind me. I swear, I thought he was going to steal the ball. We’ve got all kinds of stories like that. We joke about it.” – Chauncey Billups on Wally Szczerbiak

by The Walker Wiggle on Feb 22, 2008 2:54 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

kozlodoev,

So far as I understand, yep, I believe that’s the sentiment. The word out of Cleveland is that they feel like they’ve made short-term improvements while not sacrificing long-term cap flexibility.

As you can see from the column, I’m not buying the former either.

For the sake of our beloved C’s, here’s hoping you and I are on the right track.

-sw

by Steve Weinman on Feb 22, 2008 2:55 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Walker Wiggle,

Nice quote (I wholly forgot that they must have played together in Minny). Guess I didn’t give Wally World enough credit for the potential defense he’ll be able to play on his ’mates.

-sw

by Steve Weinman on Feb 22, 2008 2:56 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Well, my take is they will soon figure out how much Wally hurts them on defense (not for lack of effort, the guy’s just limited), that they will have to work 4 on 5 on offense (Wallace is not a threat even for a wide open dunk type of shot), and that West, as much as I like him, is not going to make them better at PG.

They like themselves over Boston in 7 games? I now like the Celtics over them in 4! :) Call me a homer and pass on the kool aid :)

by kozlodoev on Feb 22, 2008 3:00 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

kozlodoev,

For my part, I have a bit too much reverence for LBJ to talk about a sweep over this team (they’re still dangerous, although I don’t believe they are any more dangerous than they were Thursday morning).

That said, I’m a fan right with ya and one who is more than happy to pour myself a glass and toast with you to Celtic optimism at that. To the Larry O’Brien Trophy we go!

(Though we may want to start by having this team avoid a winless road trip. Oy…)

-sw

by Steve Weinman on Feb 22, 2008 3:04 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Well, that’s sure an overly optimistic view on my side ;) There’s no arguing that LBJ is one of a kind in today’s game.

If you recall our games with the Cavs though, we always managed to more or less contain him, and it was always someone like Drew Gooden that killed us down the stretch. In a way, I am concerned more about Joe Smith in this trade than about anything else.

But I am with you, to me it looks like a lateral move: they got rid of a couple of big contracts, got a couple of serviceable pieces, but nothing happened that can put them over the top.

My eyes are too on the matchup with the Suns tonight. I’ve had enough erratic defense and close losses for a whole season now.

by kozlodoev on Feb 22, 2008 3:23 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Terrible trade by Cleveland. I thought they were in great shape. They weren’t sexy and they were always going to struggle at times during the regular season …. but they matched up so well against Detroit and the C’s. I had them down as the favourite for the East. And they threw it away.

What made Cleveland special was their perimeter defense. They had the best perimeter D in the league. Three guys between 6-5 and 6-8. All were quick enough to guard any position. All were big enough to defend any position. They could switch everything. Larry Hughes should have been an All-Defensive player. He played far superior defense in Cleveland than when he garned the accolade in Washington. He was their best perimeter defender by a landslide and best equipped to handle opposing point guards. Larry’s point skills offensively were key because it allowed Cleveland to get away with these three great athletes. Very long, very athletic, they contested every single perimeter shot and did a great job denying penetration in the halfcourt. And they just threw their best advantage out the window …. and for what? Wally Szczerbiak? Delonte West?

Their other top advantages was their interior defense which was very good and they’re rebounding which was the best in the East. They should hold onto that.

Classic example of a GM not understanding his own team.

This move wreaks of a deal done solely to say you made a move.

by Who on Feb 22, 2008 3:40 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

I’ve a question:

Would you rather Wally Szczerbiak or Kyle Korver?

That same Ira Newble contract would have landed Krover in conjunction with a first rounder. For my money Korver is the superior shooter, scorer, defender, rebounder, passer, ballhandler, he moves better without the ball, he brings more energy to the court and provides more hustle. I’m not even talking about salaries, I’m just saying he’s flat out better at everything. But let’s rub some salt in the wound and state their salaries. Korver 4.4mil. Wally 12mil.

I still can’t get over how many teams let Korver slip through their fingers.

Note: Hoopshype doesn’t have the correct info on Joe Smith. They haven’t really updated any of last summer’s deals. Lots are missing. Joe signed a two year 10mil deal last summer so he has another year at around 5mil on the books. Nocioni is another player for Chicago who’s contract isn’t on Hoopshype.

by Who on Feb 22, 2008 3:47 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

The real prize Cleveland got was Joe Smith, who is way better than Gooden. Plus two more good shooters to keep teams from doubling LeBron.

Even if Ben Wallace is not the player he used to be, he’s a veteran who plays with energy and has a big body. He will be extremely valuable if Ilgauskas gets into foul trouble or needs rest.

IMHO Delonte West is a perfect fit in Cleveland, and I can just see him making hustle plays at critical moments as the Cavs knock the Celtics out of the playoffs.

by Brickowski on Feb 22, 2008 7:10 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

let’s hope the curse of the ex-celtics affects cleveland. so far this season any team who had recent c’s on them were losing regularly. i have liked the cavs this year, especially when varajao plays he accumulates rebounds and plays d. joe smith will help them and wallace gives them more beef.whoever plays wally needs to stick to him because he still has his shot. whoever he plays should get the ball. go ray. i liked gooden.

by nazzbo on Feb 22, 2008 7:33 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Not only did the pre-trade LeBrons have a big backcourt, Z and Gooden were a long & strong post presence. They gave the Cs fits, both scoring and cleaning the boards. Less so, now.

by Tenacious D on Feb 22, 2008 7:43 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

I think that this trade will help Cleveland more than you think. Its true that the stats maybe don’t point to things being much of an upgrade, but I think that playing on a contending team (remember: they were in the finals last year) and playing with Lebron will help these guys considerably. Ben Wallace needed to get out of Chicago after that whole ridiculousness (headbands and coaching changes) and I think will show some new life upon arriving to Cleveland. Hughes was a big disappointment there. Wally and Delonte were having motivational problems being in Seattle where the team is getting shipped, totally rebuilding and there are younger players to get more excited about than either of them. The success of this deal will speak volumes about their coach and their star — can they motivate these guys with a real vision of their potential (see Rivers and Garnett).

by GreenBalls on Feb 22, 2008 9:31 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

The self annointed great one LBJ forced the Cavs ownership into this one, I love it, other than LBJ where will the offense come from?? Game plan is simple now, let LBJ get his stop everyone else, which won’t be to difficult and you’ll win 122-60 everynight. they pose even a less of a threat now

by Bird4 three on Feb 22, 2008 10:36 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Nice work Steve. You’re one of the few I’ve read to get the point (from the Cavs perspective) that excuses aside, Ben Wallace is awful. Even ‘motivated’ (and that tells you enough about him that he doesn’t always play motivated) he doesn’t have the wheels anymore to roam, board, block shots. And no lift to dunk the ball.

Who’s right on Joe Smith’s contract, he’s signed through next year at ~$5m. He’s having a great season but has also been heavily worked this year, I wouldn’t be surprised if his knees explode soon.

by bullsblogger on Feb 22, 2008 10:49 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

the key for us when we play the cavs is rebounding. it has not been a strong point lately and i do believe the cavs have improved their boarding. i am worried.

by nazzbo on Feb 22, 2008 10:52 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

nazzbo, they’ve definitely helped their offensive rebounding, which is one of Wallace’s few remaining strengths and something Smith is surprisingly good at as well.

by bullsblogger on Feb 22, 2008 11:20 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

I agree with you Steve, I don’t think the Cavs accomplished that much. I only see them against the C’s, but when we play them Ilgauskas and Gooden and sometimes Gibson are the ones that kill us. Last game I think Hughes hurt us. By adding Wallace I think that takes time away from Ilgauskas unless they use them together. Then Wallace is a strong forward and probably does less than Gooden, except defensively where he’s not the same player. Perk matches up well against both Ilgauskas and Wallace, but probably better against Wallace. KG would be a good matchup against Ilgauskas if necessary. I think the Cavs went down in this deal. To me you play the Cavs man to man on Lebron with occasional surprise help. You need to let the other players beat you. I don’t think the guys they got are any better than the ones they gave up. I think they will miss Gooden.

by TrueGreen on Feb 22, 2008 11:23 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Where are Joe’s minutes going to come from?

Big Ben is being sold as the centre piece to this deal. Clearly they intend to give him significant minutes. They can’t leave Z out because he’s their second best scorer and only scoring big man. They can’t leave Varajeo out either because he’s their best defender, and he’s their energy guy. That’s all the minutes gone except for maybe 5 or 8 minutes leftover at most.

So how is Joe going to get tick? There’s only so much to go around.

I like him a lot. He’s a quality player. But where does he fit?

And if he they don’t play Smith then they’ll miss Drew Gooden’s offense.

I think Smith should play ahead of Ben Wallace but I don’t see Cleveland doing that. Smith shouldn’t play ahead of Z or Varajeo.

by Who on Feb 22, 2008 11:30 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Matt,

Thanks for the kind words; glad you enjoyed the piece. I would be remiss to omit the fact that one of the primary reasons for my heightened scrutiny of Wallace’s game when I’ve watched him this season has come thanks to the influence of your diatribes at Blog-a-Bull. Very enjoyable reading.

Again, I don’t think it’s wholly inconceivable that the trade, change of scenery and chance to contend pushes him to play on a different level with Cleveland than he had with your boys, but I for one wouldn’t put my money on it.

By the way, I was about to ask you what you thought of this trade for the Bulls — I like it a lot — but it looks like you may have already answered my question (and largely written the column I was considering writing about the Bulls’ end of this deal) over at your site.

Thanks for stopping by and commenting; you’re always an enjoyable read.

-sw

by Steve Weinman on Feb 22, 2008 11:42 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Also, Matt and Who, thanks for dropping the knowledge on the Smith contract (I’ll update that in the column as soon as I get a chance). It’s always frustrating when HoopsHype bails on me…

-sw

by Steve Weinman on Feb 22, 2008 11:43 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

I share Who’s sentiment on this one; this deal is lateral in that what the Cavs have basically done is trade defense for offense. But their offense isn’t what got the Cavs to the finals last year. In this deal the Cavs lose their two best perimeter defenders in Hughes and Newble and a stellar frontcourt rebounder in Gooden. In exchange, they get an aging Ben Wallace as the defensive centerpiece of the deal and the other two (Szczerbiak, West) are purely for offense. I don’t get it.

Lebron is going to play the 3 and that forces Wally to the 2. Wally can not guard any 2 in this league, I’m pretty sure. I’m assuming that when Gibson comes back healthy he will start and West will back him up. Neither are of significant mettle as defenders.

And Joe Smith is not better than Drew Gooden in any phase of the game. I’m not sure how Gooden got a bad rap as an NBA player, but he is quite solid despite his rough shooting year.

It’s just a lateral move that trades defense for offense and I’m not sure that’s what will win games for the Cavs. They won last year by playing great defense and letting Lebron take over and create on offense. Their defense gets a lot worse with this deal and I’m not sure they gain enough offense to compensate, really.

by dobbs on Feb 22, 2008 1:16 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

doesn’t anybody else think west, especially with gibson out, is about to have a monstrous breakout 2nd half of the season? he doesn’t have overwhelming pg responsibilities with LJ handling the ball, they are begging for another scorer (and he never did shoot enough, always begged him to take those short ones off his own dribble) and they are gonna have to bring him in for defense when wally cant stay in front of guys – they are gonna love this guy I am happy for him.

by chicagogreen on Feb 22, 2008 5:50 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

In my mind, this trade makes the Bulls a much better team. They are team of young players, and Wallace decidely did not fit in with their core group. Now they can go ahead with Gordon, Deng, Hinrich, Nocioni, Noah and Thomas. I think the Bulls will finish syrong to make the playoffs then give whatever team they play all they can handle.

by lemonadesky on Feb 22, 2008 9:22 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

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