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Did the Celtics make a mistake with Miles?

Hello Celtics fans! I'm a life long Celts fan from Columbus, Ohio and this is my first post to Celtics Blog. So here I go....Not sure if anyone heard but I read that Darius Miles was waived by Memphis. Maybe the Celts should give him another look? What do guys (and gals)think? I just liked his attitude during training camp. He's still young, and I think he just wants a second chance. If all goes well he could address some major needs off the bench! I'd rather see them take a chance on him than Stephon. Mainly because I think he's ready to be a part of team philosophy rather than a star focused team.

Be respectful and keep it clean. Thanks.

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No

Memphis had all kind of incentives to keep Miles:
- they’d take Portland out of the FA market next Summer (they’re one of their few competitors)
- what they’d receive from the luxury tax revenue (by sending the Blazers into tax territory) would be enough to play half of Miles’ salary
- they’re a bad basketball team (their record is better than what they deserve) that can use any semi-decent player

However, not even all those factors were enough to convince Wallace to keep him. Although I didn’t watch Miles playing for them, what I saw in the pre-season, as I repeatedly said, was someone very, very far from being athletic enough to play pro basketball (and not only in the NBA, I’m pretty sure that the pre-season Miles wouldn’t find a spot in the Portuguese domestic league, for example). Unless he improved his condition by a lot since then, I can’t see him anywhere near to be a contributor for a NBA team.

by cordobes on Jan 8, 2009 10:43 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No thank you

=== Bob ===

by Ref10 on Jan 8, 2009 1:27 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Nope

I think a pre-injury Darius Miles with the attitude he has now would be great for the C’s. But like cordobes said, he’s just not athletic enough right now to help or the Grizzlies would’ve kept him.

by KerasM on Jan 8, 2009 2:12 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I would sign him to a 10 day contract

He can contribute later in the year, I think that he is slowly getting into real shape, he is quite big and talented.

by greenwise on Jan 8, 2009 3:15 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

why?

He got cut from a far inferior team… I know our bench needs some help, but that doesn’t seem to fit the bill.

"simul justus et peccator"

by cavman on Jan 8, 2009 5:26 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

As a sidenote...

According to RealGM, Miles only needs to play two more games before he counts on Portland’s cap. Apparently, preseason games count towards the 10 games he needs to play in.

All the negativity in this town sucks. It sucks, and it stinks, and it sucks. - Rick Pitino

by Roy_Hobbs on Jan 8, 2009 8:33 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Preseason games count?

I don’t think so, otherwise the suspension would have also applied. I believe the criteria was that he be active for 10 games, on a team’s 12 man roster, not that he actually entered the games, otherwise, he could be on a team’s top 12 for the whole season, and if he only got into 9 games, it wouldn’t count. Maybe that is the deal, but it seems like him defying the career-ending designation would have to be with being on an NBA roster of 12, that would mean he was back in the league, i.e. his NBA career is not over. I don’t think it is up to how many minutes, if any, a coach decides to actually play him.

by KJ33 on Jan 8, 2009 9:56 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The CBA talks about games played...

… not time on the active roster. However, according to the RealGM article — which has sourcing from the NBA — preseason games count. Regardless of whether that makes sense, it’s apparently the rule.

All the negativity in this town sucks. It sucks, and it stinks, and it sucks. - Rick Pitino

by Roy_Hobbs on Jan 9, 2009 11:15 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes

I would give him another shot. Only two more games and Portlands has his salary on the books. For all of you saying that his athleticism is gone, it sure did not seem to be the case the other night againts the T’Wolves.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYJbuxJiHSo

by Goldstar88 on Jan 8, 2009 11:43 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

that's a huge block

i would sign him again. You can’t really say he couldn’t make it in an inferior team, because the Grizzlies now are quite a chaotic organisation. Look what happened with Livingston, wasn’t he traded there and waived again? In any case, if i were Danny I would just finally set Cassell as a coach and start making room for a new player. In the meantime, we could try Darius. He is 6-9 and can block shots and has the talent to give a spark to the bench

by greenwise on Jan 9, 2009 1:54 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Blazers just issued a warning to the rest of the league in case someone signs Miles now:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/basketball/nba/01/09/Blazers.Miles/?cnn=yes

This is incredible. First they say the guy is done, and after a long way to recovery now they want to end his chances to make a return. wow..

by greenwise on Jan 9, 2009 2:01 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That is a disgrace

As always, the Blazers are the most crude and unclassy franchise in the NBA. Quite disturbing behavior. I’ve already written to the NBA threatening to cancel my LP subscription if they don’t take measures.

Anyway, after reading so many of their fans wishing that Miles “blew up his knee” or that “someone should take care of him definitely” (and wishing similar things to Garnett, for example), I’m not surprised. Pritchard surely knows his costumers.

by cordobes on Jan 9, 2009 7:53 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It sounds like you have never worked with lawyers.

This has all the earmarks of the Legal Dept advising management of the best route for protecting their rights, should the issue end up in litigation.

hakkaa päälle !

by timg56 on Jan 9, 2009 10:00 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Rather a tacky comment

But since you posted it, I’ll post what I posted on Blazers Edge. It isn’t the Blazers who were being crude and unclassy, but the people who were talking about gaming the system to screw Portland and artificially make Paul Allen spend millions on luxury tax.

——

I’ve got news for everyone wringing their hands about this and perception and all that stuff. This is about whether the NBA is a joint venture or not, and millions of dollars.

People around here like to joke about SPAM (Spend Paul Allen’s Money) and I do it myself. I doubt Paul Allen enjoys those jokes as much as some other people do, though.

The NBA is a joint venture. Teams are not supposed to take actions which violate the intent of league rules for the purpose of taking money from a franchise for their own benefit. If you are completely independent, you can look for loopholes to mess over your competitors, but you don’t do that financially to your partners in a joint venture. You can get in big, big trouble.

There were media reports, you’ve all seen them, about NBA executives saying someone was going to screw Portland by playing Darius for a couple of games. To do that would be a violation of the joint venture agreements. As a couple people with legal background have cited in the sidebars, that would be acting in bad faith. The tort lawyers would have a field day.

Why? Guess what, fans, this probably isn’t really what you think it is about. As fans, we care about cap space this summer. As Dave has posted, we can probably do anything KP really wants to accomplish this summer even without the Miles space. KP planned for cap space this summer long before we knew there was going to be a Miles retirement.

This is about millions of dollars of luxury tax that have to be paid this year if Miles goes back on the Blazers’ cap number. About a team paying Darius for ten days to play in two games so they can collect an extra $300K or whatever it is at Paul Allen’s expense.

And Paul Allen is saying, "Not so fast, guys. I’m not really into payiing millions of dollars just so you can divide it among yourselves, and this is not the way a joint venture is supposed to work. And if you do this, I’m going to sue you so fast you won’t know what hit you."

In one of the sidebar discussions, someone questioned the use of the term "perspective" instead of "prospective", and said it was the wrong word. It is the right word, and tells the whole story here (do you think that Paul Allen can’t hire lawyers who will know the right word?)

"in perspective"

An object or person that is in perspective has the correct size and position in comparison with other things in the picture.

If a team plays Darius for two games for the purpose of screwing the Blazers, it will skew the "perspective economic opportunities" of the Blazers relative to the rest of the league, their partners in this joint venture.

This does not say, "Don’t sign and play Darius." It says, "Don’t do what people have been saying in the media is going to be done, or you are going to pay."

You want to know who David Stern is angry at? It isn’t the Blazers. It’s the stupid NBA execs who were talking about teams screwing the Blazers. I would bet money that David Stern saw that email and raised no substantive objection.

You think something stinks or smells bad? It isn’t the Blazers sending out an email. It’s teams setting out to rip off millions of dollars from the Blazers, their partners in a joint venture.

Note that this was NOT sent out when Darius was with Memphis. If the Griz had guaranteed his contract, no one would have suggested they were doing so only for the purpose of benefiting from luxury tax, and messing with "perspective economic opportunities".

Timing is everything. The Griz just happened to sign Darius soon enough so they could clear his suspension (they were the ideal team in the league to do it, since they weren’t carrying 12 guys on their active roster), play him two games, and then cut him without having to guarantee his contract. Sorry, but that smacks of collusion with intent to defraud. Some one else would have picked him up, and the Griz could say, "Well, we didn’t do it," and the other team could say, "We were just looking for a little help, it wasn’t us, we only played him a few games. Too bad, Paul, that’s the breaks. Pay up."

Every single email between the Griz, Boston, and any team that signs Darius will be covered with a fine tooth comb, if it comes to a law suit. Emails that mention Portland, or cap space, or any mention of free agents and who might be attractive, and whether Portland would want them, all that stuff. Any little side comment about "too bad Portland will be a player, too" is going to suddenly look pretty bad. It would be a big, expensive lawsuit, looking for recovery of the luxury tax plus punitive damages.

SO, WHAT DOES IT MEAN FOR THE FUTURE?
It means Darius is extremely unlikely to get a 10 day contract this year. No one wants Paul Allen slapping them with a huge lawsuit. If Darius gets a contract, he will not play in two games and then be dropped. If you want Darius, you better grab him for the year, and play him in more than 3-4 games, or you had better first review every single email and communication. Is Darius going to help your team enough for ten days to make it worth that?

It means Darius may threaten a lawsuit. His position is weak. First, he’s not been able to make it with Boston (whose bench is very weak), Clippers, Memphis, and maybe other teams he’s tried out for. Memphis cut him when they weren’t even replacing him on their roster with someone else! That’s not L.A., that’s, um, the Griz. It’s going to be hard for him to prove they kept him from having a chance, and hard to prove that he would have made it and has been damaged.

Also, it will be hard to prove that the Blazers hindered him, because it only threatens teams who are "contemplating signing Darius Miles to a contract for the purpose of adversely impacting the Portland Trail Blazers Salary Cap and tax positions." If you sign Darius for the purpose of helping your team, this is an irrelevance to you. They are NOT trying to blacklist Darius, and any media outlet that suggests that could find itself in litigation if they aren’t careful. They are warning their joint venture partners against intentionally defrauding them.

Also, this was not issued in a vacuum, this was issued after some joint venture partners had said they were going to be defrauded. That also weakens any case Darius may try to bring.

Finally, it means one other thing for the future. If Darius is signed and plays a less than significant role for another team for the remainder of the season, it means that we win our appeal against him going back on the cap. The ground has already been laid for that appeal, because the intent of the CBA clause was not to stick teams who follow the advice of an independent, league appointed, doctor.

So why does this mean we win that appeal? Because the best way to avoid a nasty lawsuit, ugly headlines, disclosure of various unseemly emails, and all kinds of other things, is to make sure that Portland is protected from other teams who are ignoring doctors’ advice and jeopardizing Darius’ future health. If they want to play him, fine, but don’t penalize Portland for that. (And, oh, by the way, Mr. Stern just whispered in my ear that this also means Portland hasn’t been damaged, so that means no big, ugly lawsuit.)

That’s what this is all about. That’s why this is a good and strong move. If you want to rip off one of your joint venture partners by playing games with the luxury tax, expect a lawsuit. A big ugly one.

If you can't convince them, confuse them -- Harry Truman, U.S. President

by jscot on Jan 9, 2009 10:03 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   3 recs

Yep

If Miles gets hurt, its that he can’t earn a few thousand on a ten day contract.

Oops, he’s getting that anyway. Pretty hard for him to prove Portland kept him from getting a contract now….

I know you can put admiration in bags, because admiration is real, and tominhawaii says that everything that is real is measurable.

by jscot on Jan 10, 2009 10:23 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Crude and Unclassy?

That’s just a ridiculous statement.

by GUnit on Jan 9, 2009 12:14 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

its customers not costumers

Quite disturbing spelling.

"When I have the ball, I experiment." #5

by Sabonis4Ever on Jan 10, 2009 7:57 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-blazersthreat010809&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

"The point that everybody is missing is that this isn’t about Portland’s salary cap. It’s about whether this guy [Miles] is healthy enough to play or not," said an Eastern Conference executive. "He obviously is healthy enough to play. It doesn’t matter how good he plays. He can still play, and they said he couldn’t.

"Portland received benefits when [Miles’] injury was ruled career-ending. If he can play, they don’t deserve to have those benefits."

by greenwise on Jan 9, 2009 2:08 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That GM is an idiot

the Blazers hired a chief medical exec appointed by the Players Association to deem whether or not his injury is career ending or not. Based on that independent evidence, the Blazers make their decision.

Sophia

Though patience be a tired mare, yet she will plod. - William Shakespeare

"He should have his face
shaved into the back of his head.. Then there would be no escape" OutlawisRejector on what Bayless' next haircut ought to be...

by BlazerFan1 on Jan 9, 2009 3:10 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Forgive me if I find the evidence from actual NBA games a little more independent than this. Tough luck.

by kozlodoev on Jan 9, 2009 4:15 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

sigh

again the players assoc. appointed the doctor who recommended the appropriate plan of action.
At that time, clearly Miles had no intention of putting the Portland uniform on again. He sits around for 2 years and still cant pass the required post op conditioning test the team requires. When he keeps accidentally re injuring his knee the team knew that there is more to the original diagnosis and treatment than originally thought. When they start the medical retirement process the doctor’s that deem his knee fit for NBA play are independently chosen by the nba player’s associate, you know, the organization that represents the players..? Anyway, with that advice , which is against Darius playing, and legal advice Darius is let go.

OH WAIT NOW Darius wants to get in shape. He hires a trainer, he gets his PR team going and the “portland wants to ruin my chances” cry baby routine commences. If things are soo well then why did Darius not get in shape w/ the fancy personal trainer during his recovery w/ Portland ? Why didn’t the Celtics sign him? you guys could use a SPARK off that bench now that we come to think of it.

Sophia

Though patience be a tired mare, yet she will plod. - William Shakespeare

"He should have his face
shaved into the back of his head.. Then there would be no escape" OutlawisRejector on what Bayless' next haircut ought to be...

by BlazerFan1 on Jan 9, 2009 9:26 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   1 recs

lol, rek

December 18, 2008.

"Roy is Roy, and if I were to bet my life on a game of 5-on-5, I’d bet on whichever team Roy was playing on." by HurraKane212

by maid tu rek on Jan 10, 2009 11:31 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

NBA execs

have been quoted as saying things like all someone has to do to screw Portland is sign him and play him for two games.

So tell me that this isn’t about the salary cap. It’s about the luxury tax, and making Paul Allen pay a lot of money so someone can get a cut of it. That, and that alone, is what Portland is warning people against doing.

If someone signs and plays Darius for the rest of the season, that’s one thing. If they sign him to a 10 day contract and play him two games, then let him go, the lawyers will be calling.

If you can't convince them, confuse them -- Harry Truman, U.S. President

by jscot on Jan 9, 2009 7:26 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

So, Miles is the only player in the NBA

who can’t be signed to a 10 day contract?

by cordobes on Jan 9, 2009 7:54 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The rules are pretty clear

Ethically challenged millionaires can’t bully basketball players out of a job.

by cordobes on Jan 9, 2009 9:13 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Perhaps you should consider the ethics

of such statements when you obviously don’t even have a grasp of the fiduciary responsibilities of parties in joint ventures.

If you can't convince them, confuse them -- Harry Truman, U.S. President

by jscot on Jan 9, 2009 10:04 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Don't forget jscot

His grasp of English isn’t to the point where he understands fidicuary too well, but he dang sure remembers bully!

That statement is a crock. There is no way Paul Allen could bully a 5 year old girl with pigtails.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. It's simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get tangled, you tango on

by pookeyguru on Jan 9, 2009 3:16 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

As clear as fog - but I'm sure you can explain where lawyers and CBA experts such as Larry Coon are in doubt
"(h) Long-Term Injuries. Any player who suffers a career-ending injury or illness, and whose contract is terminated by the Team in accordance with the NBA waiver procedure, will be excluded from his Team’s Team Salary as follows:

(1) Beginning on the first anniversary of the injury or illness, the Team may apply to the NBA to have the player’s Salary for each remaining Salary Cap Year covered by the Contract excluded from Team Salary.

(2) The determination of whether a player has suffered a career-ending injury or illness shall be made by a physician selected jointly by the NBA and the Players Association.

(3) Notwithstanding Section 4(h)(1) and (2) above, the career-ending injury or illness of a player who plays in more than ten (10) games in any Season shall not be deemed to have occurred prior to the last game in which the player played in such Season.

(4) Notwithstanding Section 4(h)(1) and (2) above, if after a player’s Salary is excluded from Team Salary in accordance with this Section 4(h), the player plays in ten (10) NBA games in any Season, the excluded Salary for the Salary Cap Year covering such Season and each subsequent Salary Cap Year shall thereupon be included in Team Salary (and if the tenth game played is a playoff game, then the excluded Salary shall be included in Salary retroactively as of the start of the Team’s last Regular Season game). After a player’s Salary for one (1) or more Salary Cap Years has been included in Team Salary in accordance with this Section 4(h)(4), the player’s Team shall be permitted at the appropriate time to re-apply to have the player’s Salary (for each Salary Cap Year remaining at the time of the re-application) excluded from Team Salary in accordance with the rules set forth in this Section 4(h)."

Note especially section 4(h). When exactly is the time he can come off the cap? When can you appeal that if he re-injures himself? Why are “NBA games” also in pre-season?

by Norsktroll on Jan 9, 2009 10:09 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I apologize in advance if that was “condescending”. I try to debate the facts, and they are murkier than fans on both sides want to make them.

by Norsktroll on Jan 9, 2009 10:58 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Blazers aren't trying to prevent him from signing with a team.

They are trying to prevent a team from signing him for the sole purpose to hinder Portland’s cap, and Luxory payout which would be a serious anti-trust issue for a partnership league.

Roy To The World

by Outlaw is Rejector on Jan 9, 2009 3:21 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

To expand on this ...

…. the news that preseason games counted is what likely changed the dynamic with the Miles issue.

Prior to that piece of news, any team contemplating signing Darius to a contract for the primary purpose of ensuring his contract went back on Portland’s books would have had to do so for at least 2 ten-day deals, in order that he have a chance to appear in 8 games. Without looking at every team’s schedule, I’m guessing there was a fair chance that it might have taken a third signing, since under normal circumstances, it is rare a team’s 12th guy on the bench makes it into every game. What this meant is that a team would be less likely to sign Miles if their intent was to harm Portland, due to the fact that there was a fair chance of Miles contract becoming guaranteed (which I believe happens on a third 10-day deal) and that he would be taking up a roster spot for at least a month.

Now, the risk to a team is considerably lower, therefore some might be considering an action they previously were not. Apparently, Portland management felt the risk of this was great enough to warrant putting the rest of the league on notice that such action was not as risk free as they might be thinking.

hakkaa päälle !

by timg56 on Jan 9, 2009 10:13 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Okay, here they are again

the Blazers trolls trying to bully everybody with their insulting and condescending tactics. It’s like the 4th time already this year.

Saying “you don’t have a grasp bla bla bla” was usually out of limits stuff in CB.

by cordobes on Jan 9, 2009 10:25 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Just note that you started

with “crude”, “unclassy”, “ethically challenged”, and identifying all Blazer fans with the few idiots who wanted Miles to blow out his knee.

And if you did have a grasp of fiduciary responsibilities in a joint venture, you would recognize exactly what this email is about, and what it is not about, and wouldn’t have posted some of the things you have.

And if that makes me a troll and gets me banned from CelticsBlog, that would be too bad, because I like it here, and I like discussing things with other fans, including you (in the past). But I think this is a better place than that, and I think you are better than that, too.

Take care.

If you can't convince them, confuse them -- Harry Truman, U.S. President

by jscot on Jan 9, 2009 10:43 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   1 recs

Yeah, I apologized for the generalization

Not all Blazer fans are idiots, it’s just that so many of them are. I stand by my qualifications of this procedure.

You’re confusing the legalistic judgment with the ethical judgment. Being legal doesn’t make it right.

by cordobes on Jan 9, 2009 10:58 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I don't think it's unethical

the Blazers are fine with Miles signing a contract and playing with a team for the rest of the season. This letter addresses a team that wants to “screw the Blazers,” as a Western Conference GM reported teams wanted to do.

If Miles can come back, so be it. It teams mess with the Blazers and use him as a tool to get at a rival, that isn’t fair to the Blazers or Miles.

by Cablinasian on Jan 9, 2009 11:05 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Do you really believe this?
the Blazers are fine with Miles signing a contract and playing with a team for the rest of the season.

This is pretty optimistic of you, considering we are talking about big business here and millions of dollars are at stake.

Whether you agree with what Portland is doing or not, in no way, shape or form are they “fine” with Miles joining another NBA roster this season. Don’t think they don’t know this memo, and the threat of litigation, isn’t going to be enough to scare off some teams with honorable intentions who may need a guy like Miles for a 10-day contract.

The hassle of bringing him in is clearly more than the benefit of adding him to the roster at this point.

Are we gonna live together? Together are we gonna live?

by otis29 on Jan 9, 2009 12:52 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

portland is very much ok with miles joining another team, AS LONG AS HE'S ACTUALLY PLAYING,

versus being thrown in the game for a minute or two. if miles can play meaningful minutes, then congradulations miles, golf clap. he said whil he was in portland that he didnt love the game of basketball, and he didnt even know if he wanted to come back, but people have the right to change their minds, so be it. for portland at that point, the cap space would be an unforunate casualty of the rules and the game teams play. there is however, another sinario that duznt sit near as well, if another gm signs miles to just enough games, and plays him just enough minutes to effectivly have prison relations with our capspace, and paul allens wallet, as at least one gm suggested is more then a certainty, well thats another matter.

December 18, 2008.

"Roy is Roy, and if I were to bet my life on a game of 5-on-5, I’d bet on whichever team Roy was playing on." by HurraKane212

by maid tu rek on Jan 10, 2009 11:39 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And how is Miles not unethical

He screwed Portland by not even trying to come back. One of our main players at the point of injury, he was overweight by forty pounds for most of the time he was supposed to be rehabbing. Because of these actions, the Blazers tried to have him come off the cap. Only then did he mount a comeback.

Which is more unethical? A player taking 30+ million from a team, and not attempting to honor his contract, or a team trying to wash their hands of a player who didn’t try to come back from injury?

by Cablinasian on Jan 9, 2009 11:09 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   2 recs

Cavs owner is also "uneducated"
With all due respect…although the Cleveland Cavaliers have no interest in signing Darius Miles and will not be signing Darius Miles, I find your email quite peculiar from two standpoints:

1. It’s dead wrong. I believe that all 30 NBA teams were and are fully aware of the terms and provisions of the collective bargaining agreement as to which all teams and the NBA are a party to, including the Portland Trailblazers.

2. Are legal threats through a mass email the best way to circumvent the known potential consequences that could result from the Trailblazers decisions and actions they took with respect to Darius Miles?

I fully understand the frustration you and your team’s ownership must be feeling in regards to this situation, but a preemptive threat of ‘litigation’ directed at all of your partners through a group email does not sit well with me and seems to be incongruent with the spirit of keeping a ‘fiduciary duty’ and good ‘partner-like duty’ to your ‘NBA joint venturers.

I would think there has got to be a better tactic than this one.

He urgently needs a good condescending lecture by jscot and the rest of the Blazers fans who don’t think there’s anything wrong with a fear-mongering e-mail threatening to sue business partners.

by cordobes on Jan 9, 2009 4:27 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

u certainly dont mind handing them out

but the recieveing end seams a touch unconfortable, huh. when you showed up at the BEdge, your remarks reflected an individual that had allready made up his mind and was out for blood. your very first comments included how much of a discrase portland was to basketball. kind of inflamatory. your not the only person to show up at the BEdge that felt skeptikle, just one of the few that never displayed intent on participating in conversation that could further broaden veiwpoints. im sure the condencending tone was simply addressing your seaming inability to grasp previously(in the same thread) discussed and understood concepts, even thow they had been repeatedly explained to you. you did not show up questioning the fanbase as to what we were thinking and attempting to engage from there, you showed up insistant on our guilt and spoke in an acusational and disrespectful tone. there have been several back and forths, that i have witnessed with blazer and nonblazer fans that were cival and furthered all participating partys understanding. the underlying theme in all of those exchanges were civility and openmindedness. im sorry if you feal your welcome was wore out befor your due.

December 18, 2008.

"Roy is Roy, and if I were to bet my life on a game of 5-on-5, I’d bet on whichever team Roy was playing on." by HurraKane212

by maid tu rek on Jan 10, 2009 11:53 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What?

I said the exact same thing I said here: that the Blazers behaviour was a disgrace and that they were trying to bully Miles and the rest of the league, with a rude and bogus threat to sue. That’s a POV shared by lots of people.

I was received with racist remarks about Spaniards and Mexicans and how uneducated I was. I’m not even Spaniard and Mexican, but I’m not very comfortable having conversation with racists, so I reported what happened to the proper organizations and the conversation ended, just like this one ends here.

Take care.

by cordobes on Jan 10, 2009 12:03 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And the concepts previously explained to me..

..as I’ve said repeatedly, I never sustained that there was anything illegal with the Blazers e-mail. It’s just the ethical side of the question. As many, including Gilbert, agree.

by cordobes on Jan 10, 2009 12:05 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

admittedly, there are meny ethicle questions regarding the entirety of this situation,

and a resonable person could hold ground on a few different sides.

you were NOT RECEIVED with racists comments. I saw the conversation that you were refering to, and as to the spainish question, the BEdge has a very high number of spanish visitors that have english as a second language, so its quite common for that to be the default dialect for someone claiming english as a second toung. it was certainly not ment in a racist fasion. i can not defend the mexican coment, as i think that was most certainly out of line. as is, all that came after a considerable amount of inflamatory posting on your part.

the funny thing is, that your were quick to call names and point finger, and tell portland fans how your were cancelling your LP cuz of the personal affront you felt by the email, and plenty of people were patient with you at first, and the more people tried to explain the portland view to you, the louder you got about how we were all fools, homers and blind, ect. ect. your welcome wore out, becouse you never engaged in resonable discution. hence, the condacending tone.

hears a question, youve pointed out that the blazers can not PROVE that another team would sign miles to screw the blazers cap space. and your right, its just spekulation. but can you PROVE that this is most certainly a bullying tactik? i would rather think that you cant. its an ascertion, or opinion, and nothing more. granted, its shared by no small number, but never the less, it can not be proved.

its easily arguable that asserting opionions as fact is poor conversational ettaquette

December 18, 2008.

"Roy is Roy, and if I were to bet my life on a game of 5-on-5, I’d bet on whichever team Roy was playing on." by HurraKane212

by maid tu rek on Jan 10, 2009 1:17 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I never used that kind of personal attack

It’s just not my kind of thing, ad hominem arguments. I’d never call people fools, blind or homers. I didn’t. I said Blazers FO was behaving like a bully and I stand for it – it’s exactly what they did (an opinion shared by lots of Blazers fans, credit to them). You’re lying when you’re saying that I called anyone blind. Or maybe you’re confusing me with someone else.

Good you can’t defend the Mexican racist remark.

This conversation is over.

by cordobes on Jan 10, 2009 1:31 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I can

You’re an idiot now then and forever. And I’m not a member of Blazers Edge you dumb moron turd.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. It's simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get tangled, you tango on

by pookeyguru on Jan 10, 2009 10:21 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And I'm the one who made the "Mexican" remark

And the moron is so dumb, he doesn’t even get it. Which is of course, the point I was making in the first place.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. It's simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get tangled, you tango on

by pookeyguru on Jan 10, 2009 10:27 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

LOLOLOLOL

I know you can put admiration in bags, because admiration is real, and tominhawaii says that everything that is real is measurable.

by jscot on Jan 11, 2009 2:54 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Darius signed with Memphis again

I am glad to read this. I hope he gets a chance to stay the whole season. He deserves a chance to play ball.

by greenwise on Jan 10, 2009 2:36 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I actually wouldn't mind that

What I hope doesn’t happen is the Griz playing him 2-3 games and then letting him go. That could get ugly.

If Memphis was going to keep him the whole season, why did they cut him loose before the deadline? That says they don’t want him for the rest of the season.

I know you can put admiration in bags, because admiration is real, and tominhawaii says that everything that is real is measurable.

by jscot on Jan 10, 2009 10:25 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I guess it's just to rub it

on Pritchard’s face. Call it a backlash. I’m pretty sure that lots of teams in the league were willing to do it after being threatened with KP’s fear-mongering tactics.

by cordobes on Jan 10, 2009 10:59 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Your posting here

is about as worthwhile as the things you posted on Blazers Edge on this topic.

But just to be clear for anyone who wants to discuss it intelligently (not that you can’t, but you won’t), that kind of comment is exactly what was being discussed in the media BEFORE the Portland email, and is the reason the email was sent.

Call it a backlash? “Oh, we’re going to screw Portland.” “If you do, we’ll sue.” “Oh, you threatened me, I’m going to backlash and screw you.” Backlash?

I know you can put admiration in bags, because admiration is real, and tominhawaii says that everything that is real is measurable.

by jscot on Jan 11, 2009 2:53 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

agreed

December 18, 2008.

"Roy is Roy, and if I were to bet my life on a game of 5-on-5, I’d bet on whichever team Roy was playing on." by HurraKane212

by maid tu rek on Jan 10, 2009 11:54 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Is the horse dead?

I came to this debate late. I have a terrible problem. I see the merits of some of the points from both sides. The easiest way to look at it is to imagine that the player was yours and it is your team.

A little Darius history. He came to the Blazer’s as his third or fourth team, I forget which. He made promising comments about being dedicated. He was one of the key focal points of the team at the time. The honeymoon lasted barely more than a year. There were off court distractions. Questionable work ethic and a lack of leadership. He showed blatant disrespect for the coaching staff. Thats stuff is docuemented somewhere.

Unfortunately he gets injured. Around this time the Blazer’s start in a new direction and start cleaning house. New personal in the organization and on the team. Things look more hopefull from a character standpoint. Talent and potential look good as well. We draft some nice players and then Oden. Darius was injured long before Oden, but did only a tiny fraction of what Oden did to get back into shape, and Oden still has a ways to go. Darius’ extra weight wasn’t necessarily from hitting the weights, although I am sure he did some of that. The point is that he really didn’t work and didn’t seem to want to be in Portland. Of course by that time he was seen as a locker room distraction by just about everyone.

Now we are here. Darius doesn’t fit with the current Portland team. That being said. if Darius wants to play then he should. If he still has the skills and can put in the work, good for him. He made noises about wanting to play for Portland, but his actions didn’t support that assertion. Given the situation, I expect most team would have sought the independent medical exam. I make no defense or support of the process as I know little about it, but it wasn’t a team doctor.

I am uncomfortable with the email the Blazer’s sent out. I think it sounds like the rope is slipping through their fingers regarding Darius. I would like the salary cap relief, but I don’t like the possiblility (real) of the percepion that the Blazer’s are against Darius. The real issue is that they hoped for the salary cap relief, and if some team execs were talking about “screwing” the Blazers, then I suppose they got defensive. I think it was a move out of mild panic, and the thought of dashed possibilities. The money issue isn’t necessarily specific to Darius. It is about cap relief and the thought that someone else in the NBA would deliberately try to sabatoge that.

Did the Blazer’s bully. I can see how it could look like that, but the real point is that they were trying to protect their financial interests. Better that they hadn’t done this, but I can see the motivation.

This isn't the Lakers,...
"It's not Show time. It's GO time!"

by GameFace on Jan 12, 2009 3:33 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Third team

But, this isn’t the point of your post I don’t think.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. It's simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get tangled, you tango on

by pookeyguru on Jan 12, 2009 7:00 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Missing the point

Just had to jump into this discussion. I completely understand the frustrations of Blazers fans, but the facts are the facts. Portland received a benefit from having Miles declared medically unable to play. Well, he’s now medically able to play, so why should Portland still benefit from that decision?

Understandably he was a headcase and showed no desire to play for the Blazers, but that’s really your fault for signing him to that ludicrous contract in the first place! I think the Blazers are an up and coming team and think highly of the moves to transcend the organization, but where’s the accountability? You signed a bad contract in the first place, you should pay for it!

by TwentyThree9 on Jan 20, 2009 6:57 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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