Joe Smith Update
by Roy_Hobbs on Feb 22, 2009 10:26 AM EST
in Boston Celtics News & Links
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PrintSteve Bulpett has some quotes from Joe Smith, perhaps backing off his earlier statements that he's not seeking a buyout:
The prime target [for the Celtics] remains Joe Smith. And while he’s said he’s not looking for a buyout from Oklahoma City, there are different rumblings behind the scene. Word is strong that, after being sent to New Orleans in a deal that was ultimately reversed last week, he could be on the move.
“I don’t know too much right now,” Smith told the Herald. “This week has been a crazy week all around, as far as being traded and the trade being rescinded. I don’t have too many answers right now about what’s going on in the office or what’s going on with my agent and talks with the team.
“I didn’t know what to think before the trade deadline. You heard so many things. And now it’s almost the same situation. I hear my name as far as being bought out and a lot of teams inquiring about it. But I really don’t know. I don’t expect anything to happen, but I’m not sure.”
The 6-foot-10 Smith has done an admirable job of honoring his employer, but it did please him to know the Celtics would have such interest if he gets free.
“That’s very flattering,” he said. “Obviously KG and I played together in Minnesota, and we talk quite often. And this is the defending champions. They accomplished a lot last year and this year, too. For them to feel that I can be a piece of their puzzle, that’s very flattering.”
For their part, the Celts appear willing to let a potentially helpful piece (e.g. Mikki Moore) get away if they think a better player will become available.
Are the Celtics making the right call by potentially bypassing Moore? Discuss.
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Danny talks to agents all the time so he better know what’s available…get both Smith & Starbury and we’re in…no homecourt needed…but at the end of the day we need a 6th & 7th man…1-5 and 8-12 are covered
worth the wait
definitely better than MOORE….
but again there are always no guarantees…. just like the DIKEMBE option then…… we are never sure until the our guy gets to sign
whoops, meant to include this: http://www.nba.com/dleague/playerfile/index.jsp?player=courtney_sims
another POB ? why? Pretty sure sims signed with the suns anyways
by TheAncientRivalry on Feb 22, 2009 1:16 PM EST up reply actions
Of course they are making the right call
Moore would be a very marginal improvement – he’s a hustle guy who works hard and a different player than Powe/BBD in terms of skill-set but not really better than them.
Smith is a good role-player, he’d make the rotation of any NBA team.
Oh, I agree...
But for whatever reason, other people don’t seem to.
All the negativity in this town sucks. It sucks, and it stinks, and it sucks. - Rick Pitino
If we get Marbury and Smith, the bench will really be good
I believe Marbury and the Knicks are meeting on Tuesday. It’s a vital date, because it could be one of Marbury’s last chances to play in the playoffs this year. And if that meeting goes well, he will likely be a Celt by next weekend.
Also, i think that OKC will release Smith this week too and then he will sign with us.
They need a guy who can come in a defend Kobe or LeBron for a few minutes— i.e. a Tony Allen replacement— more than they need another front court player. I have no idea who that wing player is. Maybe Bonzi Wells could do it, and the Globe is talking about Bryon Scott (probably as a favor to his agent), Then there’s David Noel, an excellent defender in college who has been playing well in the D-league. And whatever happened to nanny raper and self-proclaimed Kobe stopper Reuben Patterson?
I would have loved to see the Celtics trade for a guy like Sefolosha, and I would have given Powe or BBD to get him. And in that scenario I would have kept O’Bryant.
As for Smith, I realize that some here have adopted him as their binky, but the fact is that Smith is not that good. He’s in decline. So is Mikki Moore, but at least he’ll block a few shots. Then there is Big Shot Bob. You know that Horry will stretch the floor, and he could be useful if someone can convince him to play a little defense.
"... but at least he'll block a few shots."
Moore is not a shot blocker. I’m not sure where people get that idea, but only once in his entire career has he averaged as many as 1.1 blocks per game (which is a terrible number). This season, he’s averaging 0.7 blocks per 36 minutes. That would rank him behind Brian Scalabrine (0.8 blocks per 36).
Also, Moore led the entire NBA in personal fouls last season, and is allowing opposing centers to shoot 60.9% against him this season. I’m not sure that that’s the guy you want anchoring your defense.
No, in terms of big men, it’s Joe Smith or bust.
All the negativity in this town sucks. It sucks, and it stinks, and it sucks. - Rick Pitino
I don’t put too much stock in statistics, particularly when a guy is coming off the bench for a bad team. Having said that, I’m not a big fan of Mikki Moore, either. He’s 33 and also in decline. Mikki basically pulled a Blount in NJ: put up good numbers in a contract year. Then he got his decent money and disappeared.
As I said above, I think they need a wing defender, not another big. I’m happy to go to war with KG, Perk, BBD, Powe and Scalabrine up front.
Wing would be nice...
But I have no idea if Bonzi can still play (or what his attitude would be), and nobody in the league has much interest in Ruben the Rapist, apparently.
Danny should have done everything in his power to get Q. Ross off of Memphis at the deadline. A minimum salary guy who plays lock down defense would have been a great fit for this squad.
All the negativity in this town sucks. It sucks, and it stinks, and it sucks. - Rick Pitino
Actually, as Weiman pointed out this summer, Ross should have been signed then – a point I agreed with then and agree with even more so now that Chapter Four of the Tony Allen experiment has blown up like the others.
Thanks for the reference, Coach
If I recall the discussion correctly, I think there was some agreement on our wariness of signing Ross just because he is so limited at the offensive end of the floor. But given the directions we ended up going in and the fact that it was fairly evident what we would get from the guy defensively, I’d have snapped him up.
It also speaks more to the point you’ve made about Posey in the forums lately. You don’t find a lot of reserves who actually do a little bit of everything well. So taking guys who at least had certain skills would have been a good way to try and recover from that.
On another note…
I think Ruben might have some game left, but I really don’t have a desire to root for the guy. Probably even less than Marbury. Jeff Benedict’s book “Out of Bounds” was fairly scarring as far as the detailed accounts of Ruben’s many behaviors it provided. I understand that all these guys are human and that there is a danger of building any of these guys up as “TV heroes” and a hypocrisy in playing character police when we know so little about them away from the floor (i.e. my beloved Pose had a DUI before last season). But there’s still a place where I draw my own personal line…and I’m not interested in Patterson. Though of course, if he somehow ends up here, I’ll root for anyone on the court as long as it says “Celtics” across the front.
-sw
Manuel Aristides Ramirez is the greatest hitter I've ever seen.
by Steve Weinman on Feb 22, 2009 12:23 PM EST up reply actions
I've seen the statistics comment from you before, Brick
and I understand the idea that there needs to be a balance of using what’s on the paper and actually watching basketball, because there is still plenty the stat sheets don’t tell us, even as we find more advanced metrics.
But as far as something like shot-blocking is concerned, I’m really not sure how that’s a viable claim. Moore isn’t blocking shots that aren’t being recorded on the stat sheet. As Roy points out, the idea that Moore is a shot-blocker is patently false.
I’ll grant that there is an intangible part of interior defense as far as altering and discouraging shots from even being taken is concerned, but I’m not buying that Moore does much of that either.
-sw
Manuel Aristides Ramirez is the greatest hitter I've ever seen.
by Steve Weinman on Feb 22, 2009 12:17 PM EST up reply actions
I completely agree
with the wing backup being our biggest need. But guys like Scott or David Noel aren’t the solution.
You have some unconventional opinions about basketball, but the idea that Smith is not significantly better than Moore is one of the weirdest ever. And Smith is averaging more blocks per minute than Moore.
Joe, don't cut yourself short
“For them to feel that I can be a piece of their puzzle, that’s very flattering." We don’t "feel”, we know. And you wouldn’t just be a piece of the puzzle, you would be a HUGE piece to the puzzle. I’d take Joe over two Mikki’s in their prime. If you asked me last year if I wanted Joe or P.J. you would have gotten “Joe” as an answer 9 out of 10 times. The guy never panned out the way some would have hoped from a top pick, but is easily in the discussion for “best big man rotation player over the last decade.” Mikki, on the other hand… is not, and pulled a chapter out the Mark Blount hand book in NJ. Cordobes is right about, and Ainge probably agrees that BB and Leon are better.
Brick
Brick,
It is really not true that Mikki had a big contract year and then disappeared. He averaged 9.8 points and 5.1 rebounds that year, but then followed it up with the Kings the next year with 8.5 points and 6.0 rebounds. He didn’t “get his decent money and disappear.” Not by any stretch. I am not saying that we should definitely sign Mikki, but let’s not misconstrue facts just to make a point.
Smitty77
the right thing to do
they should sign a big man and a back up point guard like marbury or jackson or even williams !!!!!!! and quick especially wd kg out for 2-3 weeks
by celticsgreen4lyf on Feb 22, 2009 10:12 AM EST reply actions
Is the Smith-Moore option mutually exclusive?
What stops the team from signing both if they can? Or even another big a la Rasho or Mihm?
Is it the roster spots? Cash? Something else?
All of the above?
God bless and good night!
Roster spots
With three holes, and two roster spots to fill them, it doesn’t make much sense to sign two big men (especially one as mediocre as Mikki Moore).
All the negativity in this town sucks. It sucks, and it stinks, and it sucks. - Rick Pitino
smith seems the best option. he knows how to play with kg. he can shoot. he won’t be as rusty as pj was in the beginning last year. hecan get you some boards and throw out some fouls to waste. he can move without the ball. he is no mcdyes(sp?) but he beats the rest including dikembe. i am not a marbury man. white thunder can dribble, hit the 3 and make the pass.
10 day contract
Since no one is knocking down the door of Bonzi or Moore, why not offer one or both a 10 day contract? I think Bonzi jumps at one to prove himself. Gives us a chance to evaluate while we wait to see what else shakes loose.
Smith is bought out? lose Moore. Same for Marbury and Bonzi. Or set Tony Allen free and keep Bonzi with Marbury and Smith. Any way we cut this, all of these guys are gone (except maybe Smith) next year unless we sign them for change IMO.
"First fix their hearts"-Eizo Shimabuku
There's really no incentive for Moore to take a 10-day contract...
Since he can get a deal for the rest of the year at any point. Wells might, but Doc excluded the option:
"Asked about picking up someone on a 10-day contract to help fill Garnett’s roster void, Doc Rivers said the team would decline.
"If a guy was that good, it wouldn’t be a 10-day deal," the coach said. "You know what I mean? If there was somebody out there that good that could replace Kevin, he’d be playing for somebody already."
All the negativity in this town sucks. It sucks, and it stinks, and it sucks. - Rick Pitino
Have to wait and hope for Brown
I absolutely agree with everyone saying Brown is worth the wait. He would be a huge piece of the puzzle, instantly becoming the anchor of the second unit. Plus he’s a great character guy who would likely add to the team’s chemistry.
We don’t have a lot of room to play with and could really use a roster addition or two before going into the postseason, so why not wait to see if the best possible outcome pans out?
Moore reconsidered.
Would seem I’m in the minority, but I believe Moore would give the Celtics more than he’s shown this season with the Kings. Offensively, Moore runs the floor hard, cuts hard, uses his length well, has the mid-range jumper, and shows good shot selection, but he needs playmakers to create most (all?) of his offense for him. Rondo may not be Kidd’s equal in that regard but he’s well ahead of Beno and Bobby Jackson. (And Kings as a whole are 25th in the league in assists…)
On the other end, it’s hard to overstate pressure Kings’ hold your nose team defense (29th in points allowed, 30th in rebounding, 3rd in fouls) puts on any of their individual defenders, particularly a 33 year-old hustle-guy with no place in the team’s plans. No, I’m not excited about Moore’s foul and TO numbers, but I also suspect he could be a revelation (yup) in this culture, as the back-up center on Boston’s undersized second unit.
by The Walker Wiggle on Feb 22, 2009 2:30 PM EST reply actions
While RE Joe Smith
Now of course, I’d prefer Smith. But it doesn’t seem to me people are being honest about the odds. Let’s go through it one point at a time. 1. He hasn’t been bought out. 2. He has too much class to openly campaign for a buyout; and is likely a great locker room presence on a young team. 3. While he’s saying everything we Boston fans want to hear, and his friendship with Garnett can’t hurt the cause (see Cassell, Sam), why wouldn’t the Cavaliers offer him TWICE as much money to sign in Cleveland? He’s familiar with the players and the system, they could use the front court insurance, and (most importantly) it keeps a potential difference maker from instead signing with the only team likely to beat them in a seven game series… (Or am I the only one that sees it that way?)
by The Walker Wiggle on Feb 22, 2009 2:41 PM EST reply actions
Well...
He seems to acknowledge that his agent is working on a buyout, and most media reports link him to Boston. While I have no idea what the true odds are, I am assuming that Danny Ainge does.
All the negativity in this town sucks. It sucks, and it stinks, and it sucks. - Rick Pitino
This is one of those rare cases where I'd LOVE to be wrong.
But I’m also finding out from Tattered On My Sleeve that Smith still owns a house in Cleveland… Add it to the list.
by The Walker Wiggle on Feb 22, 2009 2:55 PM EST reply actions
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