Mind Games
Frank Dell'Apa makes a good point. It isn't just the records that count at this time of year.
At stake are playoff seedings. But confidence and bragging rights are also factors that cannot be underestimated in a league in which confidence and verbal jousting sometimes sway the outcome of games.
And the Celtics hold a 2-1 edge over both the Cavaliers and Magic in the four-game season series. In the jockeying for position, teams use the most recent confrontation as motivation.
When the Celtics were near full strength this season, they took 107-88 and 90-80 wins over Orlando. But the Magic recovered for an 86-79 victory over the Kevin Garnett-less Celtics March 8. Orlando will recall that contest for its strong start and blowout-potential 22-point lead; the Celtics will remember their late rally that climaxed with Ray Allen missing a potential tying 3-pointer in the final minute.
"We've been talking about Cleveland and Orlando all year," Allen said after Monday's 90-77 victory over the Los Angeles Clippers. "[The Magic] beat us last time here on our floor, so this is a big game for us."
The funny thing is that the Magic are not just focused on the Celtics. As Jessica Camerato points out, they are also preoccupied with the Pistons:
But before the Magic can think about playing the role of spoiler, they have their own issues to take care of first – the Detroit Pistons.
“We can’t focus in on how they’ve played us in the past,” said Magic center Dwight Howard. “This is going to be a different year for us in the postseason if we continue to do the things that we do on a night in, night out basis.”
Over the past two seasons the Magic have made early exits from the playoffs at the hands of the Pistons. In 2007 they were swept 4-0 in the first round. Last season, in spite of earning their best record in over 10 years, they fell 4-1 in the Eastern Conference Semifinals.
With less than a month left in the regular season and Eastern Conference rankings changing every night, the Magic could very well face the Pistons in the first round of the playoffs.
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setting the tone
getting wins over Cle, Orl and Atl before the playoffs will set the right tone for the C’s —> we are still the champs and can still beat them wherever we play them. That would wipe out any doubts from last year that the C’s can’t win away from home. (yes they won on the road against Det and LA but the home-court issue still lingers)
2nd seed, 3rd seed
While I do certainly hope we get the 2nd seed, it must be said that not having home court against Orlando if we fall to the 3rd seed is only an issue if Orlando can make it that far.
Early morning of a slow news day?
Posted this at 4:24 a.m. on what you described as a slow news day (yesterday was, not today necessarily). You battling insomnia, Jeff, or are you on night feeding patrol?
4:24 PDT
which I think is Pacific Daylight Time, whatever that is
haven’t figured out how to change that yet
"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers" Henry V
I may have fixed it
it looks right to me now (EDT), but I don’t know if it is changed for everyone
"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers" Henry V
I can't take
people leaving out the fact that Rondo was out of the Orlando game that we lost as well. We didn’t have our offensive or defensive anchor for that game and we still almost won. We could have easily won that game had we been at full strength. I respect my opponent and do feel that Orlando has made some noise this year, but I do not fear them. Actually, our loss to them made me fear them even less than it would had we won. Us almost winning that game, coming back from their 22 point lead, showed me that Orlando is not ready to be a champion yet because they can’t handle big games and visably got rattled. Had they not received the ghost foul on Big Baby, the game very well could have ended up in our favor.
So, now to tonights game. I do believe that this win is important. Very important. Because this is the first elite team that the Celts will have played after getting to (basically) full strength. A win tonight will def. give them confidence I believe will help them surge into the playoffs. Dwight is afrad of Garnett (childhood hero, Garnett’s simply better than him, etc.) so neutralizing him won’t be (and hasn’t been) a problem.
I actually like the fact that some people (experets?) have counted the Celtics out. Some even believe the Rockets to be better. So be it. I just can’t wait until they’re all proven wrong a la last year. ’Anything’s possible’.
Magic/Celts/Pistons
Magic fan here, thought I would try and add some perspective from the other side. It’s difficult to properly state just how deep the hatred, and paranoia regarding the Pistons goes down here. This blog cites the last two playoff exits at their hands, but it’s so much more than that. The last playoff exit before 2007, was in 03, when the Magic were up 3-0 on the Pistons, and still lost in 7 games. When you add into that the almost required Pistons/Magic trade, that never works out in Orlando’s favor. Obviously there is the Grant Hill trade, which we still curse, and then you have the most recent Darko/Arroyo trade, which turned into them getting Rodney Stuckey….and us getting….nothing. I can assure you, that all over this city, fans are looking at the standings, and no team, not even Boston, is as terrifying as the prospect of playing Detroit in the first round.
That being said, onto Boston. I know that there is a healthy respect for the Celts down here, you kind of have to respect this team, but I wouldn’t say there is a fear of them. When healthy, they are without question a top contender, but maybe it’s the still relative newness of them, or seeing Doc RIvers on the sideline, they just don’t really scare the Magic. A late round series with them would most likely result in the Magic losing, the Celts have dramatically more leadership, and experience, but I think the Magic have the talent to hold their own, and I would welcome a chance to match up with them deep in the playoffs. Getting Garnett, and Rondo back is a huge boost, but I just can’t help watching their “style” of basketball, and feeling like it’s very beatable. I just don’t understand how a team with such power house scorers like Allen, Pierce, and Garnett can play such ugly basketball. They kind of remind me of the Ewing/Oakley Knicks of the mid 90s. That isn’t a knock, it’s just bewildering to me. Hope to get some comments back, Go Magic…
Well I can Understand the Hatred...
But not the paranoia. The Pistons aren;‘t that good, and when Iverson returns they’ll be even worse. The Magic (or the Celtics) should handle them in no more than 6 games.
It’s Cleveland that everyone should be worried about, because LeBron is on a mission, and so is David Stern to get his Kobe vs LeBron final.
If you look at the Magic record against Cleveland, we actually fare very well against them. The hatred of the Pistons is obvious, but I really don’t think you can understand the paranoia unless you’ve lived it. The Celts have a long tradition of winning, and we obviously don’t Since the Hill trade in 2000, it’s almost seen scripted how the Pistons continually screw us over. It’s just bizarre, and probably unjustified, but they terrify the Magic like no one else.
Backhanded compliment
I guess I can’t get too frustrated with your post because you didn’t directly ‘attack’ the Celtics with hatred, but boy did you dabble a bit.
The Magic aren’t afraid of the Celitcs? Have you watched any of the games where these two teams played? Besides the last game, it’s been basically an elite team vs. a rookie team. I thought the Celtics played smarter and better during each matchup.
The Celtics play ‘ugly’ basketball? If you’re talking about as of late, then I agree. The multitude of injuries all at once could have something to do with it no? Each team has chemistry (at least the good ones) and when you’re constantly having that chemistry interrupted/hindered by injuries, your game is bound to turn less pretty than it normally looks. I mean, when we were playing this ‘ugly’ basketball we beat Cleveland and almost beat you. I’d say that exposes Cle and Orl rather than define the Celtics.
And when we are healthy, how can you say we play ‘ugly’? Did you not watch us all of last year and the majority of this year? The defense has been some of the best in years (as mentioned by numerous NBA players not on the Celtics). You deem it ‘bewildering’ that we’d play like this as if we’re Memphis, which tells me you don’t watch us play very often.
Our style of play is ‘very beatable’ you say? We’re an elite threat beyond the arch and inside. That sounds beatable? Our defense is one of the best in the league. What’s an unbeatable style of play? Relying solely on your outside shot and when that’s taken away you panic?
I don’t have a problem with you supporting your team, but to have such confidence against a team that has on multiple occasions shown that they’re better than your team is strange.
U know why some Magic fans fears pistons more than celtics?
Because they can’t take the chance to lose to the same opponent anymore. That doesn’t mean they have confidence on beating the Celtics. That just means they would rather lose to the Celtics than a lost to pistons again, which will imply the noise they make this year is just, well noise. Worst case for playing against the celtics, is a lost to the defending Champs which is expected for a young rising team.
I heard some Rockets fans have more confidence on beating the Spurs than Jazz. Same logic. They’ll choose to lose to any team in the west other than Jazz for a 3rd straight year. The “3rd straight year” part works on Magic’s case too.
Yeah, I didn’t say it made sense, but it is what it is. The Pistons are more of metaphorical roadblock at this point than anything, and part of me thinks that we should play them, just to get over that hump so to speak. As far as losing to Boston, you’re right, it would be easier to swallow, and even expected. I would prefer Boston over Detroit, or Cleveland, not because I think we have a better chance, but because I think playing a team like that in the playoffs forces you to grow, and mature. If the Magic are gonna lose in the playoffs, I would prefer they at least learn something from it, and mature to the point of not letting it happen again. I know Boston is on top right now, but all 3 of your studs are in their 30s, and you have to know that the rest of the East is just licking their chops at the prospect of the big three losing a step.
Dwight/KG
Oh, and Dwight is not afraid of Garnett, he may be frustrated by him, but he’s not afraid. the Celts use the old “haq a shaq” strategy on Dwight, and it gets him frustrated, but doesn’t scare him. KG, and Dwight one on one at this point in their careers shoudl be all Dwight. The reason Garnett can “contain” him is his obvious intellectual superiority, and relentless slaps that Dwight endures all game long.
Your “haq-a-shaq” story is not quite accurate on how we play Dwight, considering the most free-throws he’s taken against us this year in a game is 6. For someone who averages 11 FTA per game, this hardly looks like a “haq-a-shaq” scenario. We bang and play tough defense on him like defense should be play, it’s as simple as that.
by BudweiserCeltic on Mar 25, 2009 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions
move him out
we also have some big bodies (Perk/Baby) that can move him off a spot and push him out of his comfort zone
plus Perkins is one of the few guys that can body him up (mostly) one on one, freeing up the rest of the team to take away open shots that the Magic usually get when other teams double down
"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers" Henry V
Yeah, obviously I watch the game with a slanted perspective, but IMO the fact that Dwight didn’t go to the line as often, doesn’t mean it wasn’t happening. I know as fans we always feel like the refs are calling the game against us, and if you watched the Cavs/Magic last week you would absolutely understand, but I just felt like there was a player hanging on Howard every time he touched the ball. It’s been a reoccurring theme down hear, to complain about out big men never getting the calls. I’m sure half of it is just being a fan, and the other half based in reality.
Yeah, Perkins and Baby irritated the crap out of me in those games. I give the Celts credit, they play Howard better than anyone, but it really did remind me of the old Shaq days. I think I even had a flashback of Luc Longley, and Bill Wennington rotating turns fouling Shaq. Garnett is obviously the defensive leader of that Celts, and getting him in foul trouble would put them behind the 8 ball, so it seemed like the strategy was to send out Perkins/Baby to foul/frustrate Howard, and let KG do the rest. A good strategy without question, just annoying from a Magic perspective.
So you think the Celts "hack"/foul him on purpose
but the refs just don’t call it? I don’t doubt there is some contact that gets let go, but to say it is a hack-a-shaq strategy, which is purposely fouling because of lousy FT %, and he only has attempted 6 FTs against the C’s is a bit of a stretch. If they were purposely fouling, not just playing aggressive, physical D, there is no way the officials would let that go to the degree you are suggesting. Let me ask a question. How else is anybody supposed to try and play Howard and have a prayer of stopping him if not being physical. The reason the C’s play him physical is because he is physical. When you have a physique like his, camp out in the post, and try to dunk everything, how would you expect your opponent to try and stop you? Should Perk, etc., in the name of keeping it clean, just play soft and let him have his way? Howard should expect to be played like this, not frustrated when it happens.
When they start calling “3 seconds on the paint” constantly on Howard, I’ll hear your frustrations of him “not getting calls”. Hard to believe when he’s shooting 11FTA per game though.
by BudweiserCeltic on Mar 25, 2009 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions
How about Howard's favorite Ewing move
which is flat-out traveling. He takes three running steps from the block across the paint into his little runner and/or hook. Smart for him to adopt it since Ewing was never called, but still frustrating nonetheless. I was at the last game without Rondo, forget missing KG, we were already used to that, missing their playmaker just hours before tip-off was huge. The C’s offense was never in sync all game, yet, thanks to Ray, they almost pulled off the unthinkable.
Howard is a beast and you have to respect him, in typical Russell fashion, he swatted 3 shots into the 3rd row(wink, wink) showing he cares more about the style than the result, since the C’s simply got to inbound the ball each time. If you can swat a ball that far, you can control it or tip it to a teammate. I also didn’t like the way that Howard acted with utter indignation whenever a foul was called against him when he is one of the most physical players in the league. Wonder if he will come out tonight, hit his first shot, then look at his hand as if to say how on fire he is or how he can’t be stopped. How did that work out for him last time in Orlando?
complaining about a guy traveling in the NBA is like complaining that the sky is blue. I’m just waiting for Howard to break out the crabstep. I do though agree with a lot of what your saying about Howard. Obviously we love him down here, but sometimes he just tries to show off, to the detriment of the game. Howard’s game is to be physical, and I completely expect teams to treat him that way, but like I said, this is from my biased perspective, the guy gets fouled on almost every play. My biggest issue with Howard is more mental than anything. I think he’s just too nice, and sometimes lets guys get into his head. I can’t even count the times I;ve seen him make a boneheaded play, and then run up the court laughing about it. I’m all for having fun, but when do you ever see guys like KG, Duncan, Kobe, Lebron, or Jordan laugh after getting embarrassed. Never. In order for the Magic to ever take the next step, they need to develop the killer instinct, which as of now they just don’t have, and it all starts with Howard. The Celts are much stronger team mentally than Orlando, but player for player, I like the Magic’s talent. Van Gundy has done a great job with this team, but I’m not convinced he’s the guy to take them to the finals.
Oh, and as far as the 3 second comment, you obviously didn’t watch the Magic/Cavs game. Completely ridiculous.
and yes, I would love if the Celts played soft in the name of keeping it clean. It will never happen, but it sure would make things easier…
I responded to a comment you made earlier
please read that as well.
But man, you just keep coming up with things I just can’t let go.
You prefer the magic’s talent over the Celtics? You’d take each of your players at their respected positions over three future hall of famers such as Ray Allen, Paul Pierce, and Kevin Garnett? I’m all for supporting your home teams style of play, but to say that individually your team has superior talent is a bit over the top.
People with similar basketball minds as yours is why I believe the NBA is falling. Continuing this ‘Euro’ and strictly ‘finesse’ basketball gives the game a soft reputation. This is why the refs have been calling foul after foul because playing in the NBA today is like playing the kids game ‘Operation’. If you so much as breathe on a player when he’s shooting/going up for a shot/dribbling then it’s declared a foul. I can’t support this style of play. It’s the same as playing a pick up game with a kid who calls everything a foul. No one likes to play with that kid. It’s gone beyong trying to keep the game ‘clean’ into trying to keep the game harmless. I’m sure you’d love if no one could touch Dwight and he could just post up to air. But that’s not how it’s going to be playing against a very good big-man team of Garnett, Perkins, Powe and Baby. So, you’re team will now have to resort to shooting three’s and when that falls through, well, Van Gundy just stands on the sidelines scratching his head.
yeah, missed that comment before, just read it. You are obviously mis-understanding what I mean by “ugly” basketball. I’m referring to the style of play, not the result. If you’ll reread what I said, I compared the defensive intensity to that of the mid-90s Knicks, a compliment if you weren’t aware, but not pretty to watch. You should really read someones comments a bit more thoroughly, before stating that their “basketball mind” in the reason the NBA is failing. I was obviously kidding when I said that I would prefer the Celts to play soft, and if you retrace the steps of the Howard, getting fouled argument, it looks like this…
Me – IMO the Celts were draped all over Howard
response – he only took 6 FTs all game
Me – doesn’t mean they weren’t all over him
response – Howard is very physical, and so the Celts play him that way. *(very physically)
Me – agreed, but it is frustrating.
response – people who think that the Euro way of playing are ruing the game, and the reason why fouls are called for every small infraction.
Follow the logic here. I claim that Howard get’s fouled routinely, and the response is that the NBA calls every foul now, that the Celts played him extremely physical, and that he only got 6 FTs. Do you see the breakdown here?
Finally, bro I never once attacked the Celts, and actually gave them plenty of compliments, calling them superior intellectually, and stating that they would beat Orlando in the playoffs, so why all the digs at the Magic? I only jumped in here to try and have some intelligent basketball conversation with fans of another team, not to be told my “basketball mind” was ruing the game, and that the Magic are weak team…Oh well, I tried.
I read your post just fine my friend
I’m not going to respond completely to your post because it’d be a waste of time. But when arguing that I don’t read your post clearly, you should rerear the first line of my first response which states that I can’t get mad at you because you didn’t directly attack the Celtics – hence why I called your post a ‘backhanded compliment’.
better a backhanded compliment, than just a backhand. Oh well, truthfully, I’m just excited that the Magic are playing a game against the defending champs in late March that is actually important. It’s been a long time since we have actually played for anything substantial down here, so you’ll have to excuse our excitement. Should be a good game tonight, and hopefully the Magic show up to play…..
i love how
the celts were at full strength when you beat the magic twice, yet we were missing our all-star pg twice playing the celts (one of which was a win).
in fact, our starting backcourt the first time the two teams met was anthony johnson and jj redick. congrats, you totally owned us.
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