Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: Following UFC 146 Loss, Jason 'Mayhem' Miller 'Done' in UFC

Rondo Plays Like Stockton

Photo

TrueHoop has an interesting player comparison article up.

In the 1989-90 season John Stockton had the highest PER of his career -- about 24 -- but made just about half a 3-pointer per 36 minutes he played. His shooting percentages were high from everywhere, and he managed a shocking 14 assists and 2.6 steals per game. Who plays anything like that today? The normal first guess is that Stockton is like Steve Nash, but Pelton's numbers say Rajon Rondo and Chris Paul are more like it."The biggest reason Nash doesn't show up," explains Pelton, "is that while Stockton was one of the league's best thieves, Nash collects steals at a rate way below league average."

  • Rajon Rondo 92.0
  • Chris Paul 91.0
  • Deron Williams 86.5
  • Jose Calderon 84.8
  • Devin Harris 84.7

In other Hall of Fame news, Dennis Johnson will once again not be honored in Springfield. From that same TrueHoop article:

At the age of 52, about two years ago, coach Dennis Johnson passed away. To many, he was always a tremendous role player on Larry Bird's Celtics teams -- and an elite defender. But Pelton points out there was more to the story of his career: "His earlier incarnation was as a high-scoring guard who could also distribute the basketball. Alas, Johnson's strongest skill in either role was his defensive ability, which is tough to measure here. Still, those comparables should remind everyone that DJ could score too."

  • Vince Carter 95.3
  • Tracy McGrady 95.5

Comment 25 comments  |  0 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

Try to tell anyone who isnt a celtics fan this

“rondos a scrub, cant shoot, only reason hes good is because of the big 3”

Anyways, Rondos game has always reminded me slightly of Stockton

by TheAncientRivalry on Apr 6, 2009 12:06 PM EDT reply actions  

in other HOF news

sounds like DJ didn’t get in again

Marc Spears just “tweeted” the following

“Sorry Celtics fans. No Dennis Johnson or Don Nelson in Hall of Fame this year. Jordan, Sloan, Stockton, Robinson and Stringer in. Congrats.”

I’ll post a link when it is available

"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers" Henry V

by Jeff Clark on Apr 6, 2009 12:23 PM EDT reply actions  

Not wowed with Stockton

And here’s why… by playoff time, everyone knew that his M.O. was to find Malone open for a pick ’n pop.

In other words, it was a predictable, patented play between the psychic brothers. Whenever he had to run similar plays with other supporting players, like Hornacek, it wasn’t nearly as effective. For the most part, Stockton’s assists were mainly Malone’s points. In contrast, Rondo is moving the ball for everyone on the floor and then getting those assists.

by TitleMaster on Apr 6, 2009 12:38 PM EDT reply actions  

ummm

isn’t the amazing part about that the fact that everyone knew what was coming and yet he still executed the play over and over again?

the guy deserves to be in the HOF and mentioned among the best PGs of all time

"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers" Henry V

by Jeff Clark on Apr 6, 2009 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

really?

a) i agree with jeff, if you know the play coming and can’t stop it that is all the more impressive.

b) as much as i HATED the jazz, and was never more torn than the jazz/bulls finals (a true case of wishing no one would win) stockton is easily in the conversation for who is the 2nd best pg of the last 30 years besides magic and probably the winner (zeke is the only other top tier player in the debate i guess). led the league in assists for 9 straight years. only 9 times has anyone had more than 1000 assists a season, stockton is responsible for 7of those seasons. 51 percent career fg percentage. blah blah stats stats but yeah, stockton was that good.

by ChainSmokingLikeDino on Apr 6, 2009 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

so predictable he made the Finals twice, only to face Jordan in his prime

not to mention setting the all-time record for assists. easily one of the pg’s of all time.

by PJ Martinez on Apr 6, 2009 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Travesty

The fact that DJ is not in the hall is the biggest travesty in sports. He won championships with 2 different teams and was the best player that Larry Bird ever played with. His career should speak for itself.

Perk and Powe... the Next Big Thing

by FLCeltsFan on Apr 6, 2009 12:43 PM EDT reply actions  

not surprised

Not surprised about DJ being overlooked but not overwrought over it. The others getting in are more worthy. I’ll get up in arms about it once someone less-qualified goes in.

His time with the C’s was less than all-star level. Before I’m crucified for saying that, anyone who watched DJ with the C’s saw he was primarily the person who brought the ball up and played very good D against the other PG. He wasn’t the main facilitator or a top-level scorer. His shooting was sub-par by then and watching him shoot anything outside 15 feet was cause for concern.

His time in Phoenix was a washout when he was labeled a problem.

Any entry into the HOF would have to be based on his days in Seattle and as a contributor on 2 C’s championships. Apparently that’s not enough to sell him as a candidate to the voters.

by slamtheking on Apr 6, 2009 12:49 PM EDT reply actions  

I forget

is there a limit to the # of inductees each year?

"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers" Henry V

by Jeff Clark on Apr 6, 2009 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

The fact that DJ is "comparable" to Vince Carter and TMac...

… shows that statistical correlations mean nothing.

All the negativity in this town sucks. It sucks, and it stinks, and it sucks. - Rick Pitino

by Roy_Hobbs on Apr 6, 2009 1:01 PM EDT reply actions  

yeah, I like stats as a supplement to observation, but these comparisons...

…don’t add all that much. it’s far too crude of a statistical tool — especially when looking at one season, rather than a whole career.

by PJ Martinez on Apr 6, 2009 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

?

I’m not sure what the stats in this article refer to. I’m also not sure about what the point is in comparing DJ to TMac and Vince Carter. I don’t even think they played the same position. McGrady and Carter are 2 guards and could possibly play the 3. DJ was a combo guard. He wasn’t a true pg. But just in comparing them in general there is really no comparisons. DJ was a far superior team player than the other 2. He made his teams better. The other 2 don’t. DJ was a warrior. Certainly McGrady is not and I’m not really sure about Carter. DJ is just a far superior basketball player to McGrady and/or Carter.

"I don't come to play, I come to WIN"--Larry Bird
"Criminally Negligent Officiating"--Tommy Heinsohn

by TrueGreen on Apr 6, 2009 6:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

DJ was great

i remember loosing to Milwakee 0-4 in the playoffs.
forget the year but moncriff was killing us then we went and got DJ. He made a BIG difference.

by tommyfan on Apr 6, 2009 1:16 PM EDT reply actions  

Sorry Everyone

I love Rondo and am glad that he us getting better and better each year and is turning into the player we all had envisioned, however this is absolute nonsense bordering on blasphemy. I lived in the Salt Lake City area through most of his years, and Rondo at this stage in his career doesn’t deserve to be mentioned in the same article as John Stockton. As I discount Magic as a true PG, Stockton is the best pure PG to ever play the position bar none. This is no different than stating after 2-3 years that Dirk Nowitzki and Larry Bird were eerily similar. That was such an insult to Larry, and similarly to Stockton. In 7-8 years if Rondo is producing like he is and is nearing the top of the leader boards in assists, and steals, and has replaced his streaky shooting with a consistent reliable one, and executes to perfection the play that everyone in the building knows you are going to run over and over… THEN you can start to mention the guy in the same breath.

Stockton was such a consistent player on both ends of the court no matter who he was teamed with. At times they had great teams. At times they weren’t very deep. It didn’t matter. He had such amazing focus and confidence coupled with a killer attitude. Stockton was unbelievable and to throw Rondo in that same light is a complete ridiculous comment.

by EJPLAYA on Apr 6, 2009 1:47 PM EDT reply actions  

I have to agree with you EJ

call me old-fashioned,call me bias,i find it hard to compare any player today with players of the 80’s,just not the same level of bbasketball,(imo).

by house_call on Apr 6, 2009 3:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

EJ is pretty much right, but

I don’t think the point is to say that Rondo’s achievements now are comparable to Stockton’s (which would be, as EJ notes, nonsensical and premature to say the least). I think the point is that, among PGs currently playing, Rondo’s game is closest to Stockton’s.

Let me say that though I’ve lived in Boston for quite a while and am now first and foremost a Celtics fan (at times perhaps to the point of monomania) I too lived in the SLC area through the Stockton years and was blown away by what Stockton could do on both ends of the court. As EJ notes, what was most impressive about him was his consistency, game after game. He was a PG like no other. There was simply no other Jazz player you could trust in big games like Stockton. Probably the greatest moment in my years of watching the Jazz was Stockton’s three-point shot at the buzzer in 1996-7 that sent them to the Finals for the first time. Ice cold, huge shot. And Stockton’s reaction was nonpareil.

Well, almost: Man, last year was beyond huge. And as a huge Stockton fan, I find the comparison of Rondo to Stockton awesome, not blasphemous. It is a real compliment to Rondo’s development, not an insult to a Hall of Fame player. Let’s hope Rondo more than keeps it up.

by grnpeak on Apr 6, 2009 6:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Stringer?

Stringer who? Quit stringing DJ along and put hin the HOF!!!!!!!! Makes me sick.

Is it Soup Yet?

by Master Po on Apr 6, 2009 3:25 PM EDT reply actions  

Stockton was mean...

Rondo’s a good player but John Stockton was mean and would set those hard picks and take cheap shots. Stockton would do anything to win. Rondo needs a little mean streak.

by liamail on Apr 6, 2009 4:57 PM EDT reply actions  

Rondo Has A Harder Job Than Stockton Or Paul

Stockton played and Paul plays the same way every nite. Rondo seems to have to play a different game every nite depending on the situations. And Rondo is the one who has to make the decision of what to do. Rondo is a pass first guard in mentality. The other parts of the offensive game are not natural to him, but he can do them. The problem is in him deciding how best to use his skills in each game or quarter or a few minute stint. Obviously he is hitting the outside shot better, but I think his improvement is in the decision making part of the game, both in how to mix in his own skills with those of his teammates, when to be a scorer or a passer.etc. He also has to decide that in some situations he needs to be the one to take over the game. And don’t forget the rebounding. He’s a better tough-nosed rebounder than Stockton or Paul. Rondo goes for the rebound, the other’s wait for it to come to them.

"I don't come to play, I come to WIN"--Larry Bird
"Criminally Negligent Officiating"--Tommy Heinsohn

by TrueGreen on Apr 6, 2009 7:16 PM EDT reply actions  

I have to disagree TrueGreen

Rondo plays a different game many nights because he loses focus or is letting his arrogance get the best of him. Rondo needs to play the same game every night and that is attacking the rim to be able to drive and dish, or get to the rim. Some nights he is aggressive and does this. Others he dribbles the clock out. That isn’t being smart based on matchups, that is being ineffective. Rondo also lets his defensive effort slip at times. There are times out there that he doesn’t make an attempt to fight through screens or rotate out on the three point shooter once he has let his man blow by him. That isn’t playing a different game. That is being lazy at times. He is definitely a better rebounder than Stockton was and that is mainly because the guy is very athletic, has freakishly long arms and big hands, and gets a lot of long rebounds. One thing that was so impressive about Stockton is that he did what he did based on his smarts, knowledge of the game, and sheer determination vs. athletic ability. Just because Rondo is 5th in the league at steals doesn’t mean he is remotely similar to Stockton. They are so absolutely far apart it baffles me how a professional columnist could make such a stupid comparison.

by EJPLAYA on Apr 6, 2009 9:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Good Points

I sort of agree with your remarks on Rondo. I do think he often loses focus. I do think he should always up the tempo, which he often doesn’t do. I’m not sure that I agree that he should always attack the rim because teams clog the rim against the C’s, especially when Rondo is in. That is why they sometimes replace him with House to spread the floor. I do think he needs to play a varied game because he has so many weapons he needs to involve, both for their skills and to keep them into the game. I also agree with you on defense. He has trouble staying in front of his man and because of this Perk ends up getting alot of his fouls by having to make up for Rondo’s mistakes. I’m not sure he’s arrogant, but I do think he can be stubborn. But. This is his second real year playing (I’m not counting the first year). And he’s still learning. And I think it’s foolish to compare a 3rd year player to Stockton. We can compare them when their careers are over, but that’s hard to do also. Stockton did his thing for a long time. I don’t remember how he was when he was younger, but I do think he had 4 years of college experience when that really meant something. It’s getting late and my grays are wandering, but I do think your points are quite valid.

"I don't come to play, I come to WIN"--Larry Bird
"Criminally Negligent Officiating"--Tommy Heinsohn

by TrueGreen on Apr 6, 2009 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

It's the other way around. It's Stockton played like Rondo.

I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.

Used to mix the wine with the lean/Now we sip soda with the Barre/20 inch blades on the car - Pimp C

by erivera7 on Apr 7, 2009 12:03 AM EDT reply actions  

.. but I guess it's all semantics since it goes both ways. Nevermind.

I'm the other guy at Third Quarter Collapse, with a Twitter account.

Used to mix the wine with the lean/Now we sip soda with the Barre/20 inch blades on the car - Pimp C

by erivera7 on Apr 7, 2009 12:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

CelticsBlog is a growing interactive community dedicated to providing fresh, comprehensive coverage of the Boston Celtics.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recent FanPosts

Small
"We really have only 2 options to keep winning."
Small
Celtics vs. Heat - ECF Matchup
Small
How Avery Bradley's absence affects everyone else
Small
Thoughts on Celtics vs. Heat
Small
Already Doubting The Celtics?
Small
Start Pavlovic over Ray to cover Dirty Wade
Small
Why we can beat the heat
Mchale_small
Can the C's Cool Down the Heat?
Small
Fourth Quarter of Game 7: A Glimpse of the Future with Rondo?
Small
Is Rondo out of his mind? Or just on some other level?

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >


CEO

Shamrock-blk-trans_small Jeff Clark

Authors/Editors

Hoosiers-dvdcover_small Roy_Hobbs

300h_small Wide Load

Big_4_small Jimmy Toscano

Leon_powe_small Green17

Ud_small Tom Bellinger

Grawful3_small Kiorrik

Authors/Mods

1_koolaid_avi_small FLCeltsFan

Po3_small Master Po

Images_small Bent

Green_avatar_small Fafnir

Small Tom Halzack

N23879518902_8484_small Jon Duke - CSL

Small jose3030

5bill_small Jack Jemsek

Small wjsy

Small Ryan Desmarais

250_small Brendan O'Hare

1119816_small JoshZavadil

Small TLayman

Small Anthony_Bruzzese

Small theoriginalhagrid

Sheed_small evansclinchy

Moderators

Photo_14_small Steve Weinman

Too_much_coffe_man_small Edgar

Small Chris72

Small thirstyboots18

Small CfanMissippi