Hollinger On The Celts
Hollinger puts the Celtics up there with the Cavs and Magic in the East:
Yes, it's possible the Celtics' magical championship march in 2008 was a one-shot deal. But dismiss them at your peril.
Last season they won more games than Orlando, even though Kevin Garnett missed the final two months, and took the Magic to seven games in the conference semifinals. Garnett will be back, but is something of a question mark until he shows his knee is fine. Meanwhile, the Celtics brought in reinforcements in Rasheed Wallace and Marquis Daniels, with the former being particularly useful since the Celtics lacked a "stretch 4" a year ago.
Age is a huge issue here, and they'll have to pace themselves in the regular season, so they're probably going to be the East's No. 3 seed. But if they're healthy come playoff time and the Ubuntu is flowing, they still look like a team that can win the East.
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We should SHOOT for 3
I think the C’s should shoot for th3 seed, and not the 1 or 2. Sounds stupid, right? But, Docs biggest problem is wearing his players down. He needs to not care about the regular season. Play KG and Ray 32 mpg, and pierce maybe 34 … no more, regardless! If they are rested and healthy come playoff time, a 3 seed will be fine, and they can come out of the east. I totally agree with Hollinger.
by libermaniac on Aug 10, 2009 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions
You don’t have to shoot for #3. That’s completely dumb. What you need to do is shoot for #1, just not at the expense of the teams health.
by BudweiserCeltic on Aug 10, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions
If healthy
home court throughout the playoffs.
The deepest team in the league.
"Do you know that nonbelievers create the most positive energy?" Davis said
Great offseason by Danny
Rasheed and M Daniels is quite a haul. Re-signing Big Baby a good move. $3.0 mil per sounded fair from the get go and that’s what it came to. Would have liked 3-4 years but it will be a good thing if Big Baby is worth more in 2 years. I’m a sucker for diamond-in-rough draft picks, who isn’t?, so I’m channeling positive vibes re Hudson. Only move left is to find a new home for Tony Allen. hope they don’t have to include Scal.
Why the optimism re Sheldon Williams? He couldn’t get into games for Minnesota last year, a team with a big man’s coach as head coach. If the optimism is warranted then its a real fine off season. But, he’s probably another Pat OBryant-type “home run or strike out”
Shelden Williams
I complete disagree. POB was a shot in the dark. POB was a guy with all the talent in the world, and the height to match. If he did the work, he could be a superstar. If not, out of the league in due time. Williams on the other hand doesn’t have those expectations. He’s a legitimate 6’9" with little offensive game. He plays defense and benefits from good players around him. He’s a stop-gap player for this team who will be expected at the most to play a Perk kind of role. albeit, being fifth or sixth on the depth chart for this team at the 4-5 positions. So there is no ‘home-run’ attitude about Williams. Not even close.
that's definitely the reason
although I don’t think POB ever had the possibility of being a superstar. Nonetheless, his ceiling was much higher than Shelden’s.
I really like the pickup of Shelden b/c I really believe that at that depth chart position on the Celtics they needed a guy who could defend & rebound. His offense is pretty lousy, but hopefully he can benefit a bit from the drive and dish plays, similar to what Perkins gets. He’s a different player than BBD, so it gives some nice versatility.
by TomHamilton30 on Aug 10, 2009 8:09 AM EDT up reply actions
Williams is quite capable of giving this club what it needs – intelligent, blue-collar basketball off the bench. I like the acquisition if for no other reason that Shelden will play hard and smart – two qualities this club lacked off the bench last year.
Absolutely
He’s the kind of guy Danny likes, smart and hard working. He may not be what he was in college, but he’s more than capable of being a very good back up in this league for years.
I would like to add Bowen and a back up PG.
We also have some expiring contracts, so we can add a nice player or two at the trading deadline…
trade deadline will be interesting
B/c the Celtics really will have an opportunity to improve their team. Who is left besides Bowen, b/c his game has drastically deteriorated.
by TomHamilton30 on Aug 10, 2009 8:11 AM EDT up reply actions
ummm okay
Celtics missed KG 2 months and finished in 2nd place
this year, if apparenty healthy and a clear cut better bench, we will be the 3rd seed?…..okay?
The celtics arent the spurs, they have a hard time “pacing” themselves, they bring it every night and will be going for #1 seed, and if healthy they weill finish 1 or 2…sick of hearing people act like we looking up at the magic and cavs in the east…not at all
Hollinger confuses me
He founded his career off of analyzing purely off of statistics, yet he occasionally goes off as a non-statistical analyst.
His comment about health & age being key is spot on though, and I really hope the Celtics don’t spend all of their energy during the regular season. But, I don’t see them being #3.
Everyone is adamant about moving Tony Allen, but it’s not going to happen. No team particularly likes him, especially his contract. That said, I hope he gets “filler” minutes to give guys a rest.
I’d also like for the Celtics to add some more youth/athletecism to the last 2-3 roster spots. Those guys can then play some high-energy off the bench minutes when the Celtics have a good-size lead. The team is going to need to stay fresh.
Because analyzing basketball purely on stats is stupid, and Hollinger knows that
He may have gotten a job at ESPN because of PER, but that doesn’t mean he should apply it to every single article (though Hollinger does try mightily in doing so).
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Aug 10, 2009 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Hollinger is worthless
Hope your reading this Hollinger. #1 Franchise of All-Time 18th Banner on the Way Eat it.
He hates the C's
…so much that I’m surprised he even picked them as high as 3rd.
Still need a backup PG
When that gets done, the Celtics are the best in the East, no question. Definitely Carter isn’t the answer, not sure about Lue since SVG never played him…
Here’s hoping Hudson can make the adjustment to this level, wrt ball-handling and defense.
by nba is the worst on Aug 10, 2009 9:29 AM EDT reply actions
Probably but, at least
have 1 good PG. Imagine having no PG at all.
"Do you know that nonbelievers create the most positive energy?" Davis said
I asked Bill Russell to make a prediction when we got KG
he said “Have you ever heard me make a precdiction?” I don’t make predictions – that’s why they play the games"
enough said
Is it Soup Yet?
I Feel Sorry for Stan Van Gundy
These analysts get caught up in the league’s publicity machine.
Vince Carter is a bigger name and a flashier, more athletic player than Hedo Turkoglu, so obviously the Magic are much improved in the offseason. In fact, Hedo is a better player than Vince Carter—- and a far better team player— and guys like Brandon Bass and Matt Barnes won’t make up the difference. Yes, they have Jameer Nelson back, but he’s coming off a serious injury, and I’m not impressed with Anthony Johnson as their second pg off the bench.
Bottom line: the Magic won’t be as good as last year, unless Dwight Howard makes major improvements in his offensive game, and I’ll believe that when I see it. Also, Rashard Lewis’ suspension may cost them games early, and for playoff seeding purposes those games matter just as much as the ones in April.
Then look at Cleveland. Are the Cavs really going to put Ilgauskas and O’Neal on the floor at the same time? If so, is one of them going to attempted to guard a good NBA power forward? I don’t think so. The O’Neal acquisition basically turns Ilgauskas into a backup center, even though Z is a much better shooter than O’Neal.
It isn’t 2000, it’s 2009, and O’Neal isnt the player he once was. Anthony Parker was a nice addition, but Mo Williams did nothing in the playoffs except shoot off his mouth. So I don’t view the Cavs as having improved much either.
These are both good teams, but certainly no better than the Celtics as each of the three teams is presently constituted.
I Agree
I thought Orlando broke even with Vince, because I think at some point he’ll have injury problems. Turky-Glue played some great ball in the playoffs. Was surprised to see Hollinger pump them up. Their frontcourt is much stronger, but backup PG may become a problem.
I have no idea how Shaq will fit in in Cle.
I still can't
believe the Magic essentially traded Turkoglu for Carter — a lateral move at best — and then in the process threw away Lee, an outstanding defensive player and soon to be an outstanding offensive player, and Alston, the best backup PG in the league even if he is a headcase. Thanks, Otis.
Carter is older than Pierce...
He`ll be 33 in January.
How much athleticism does he till have?
Agree with Brick on Carter-Hedo analysis...
Also, the Celts are NOT the only team dealing with an “age factor”.
Next Spring….Shaq is 38, Ilgauskas is 35!
The C and Cavs are going to win a ton of games
but will the Cavs play the regular season witht he same intensity of last year? And what happens to them when the injury bug, which stayed away (besides Delonte early) last season?
If the Cs stay healthy, they will push 70 wins. If they can sign a real back up PG like Anthony Carter, they should be able to blow out a lot more teams this season, which will allow for more rest for the older guys.
Danny has one or two moves left in him. The Cs still need a backup point and a bigger SF who can defend and shoot the threeball. AC and Bowen?
boston will only be the 3 by choice...that is if they choose to rest players
heavy minutes down the stretch sacrificing some games
by celticinorlando on Aug 10, 2009 10:52 AM EDT reply actions
Yes
I think this was Hollinger’s point: The Cs will take some Ls this season with the idea that they will be well rested during playoff time. I hope he’s right.
Sort Of Disagree
Losing is not an option with the Celtics. They go out to win every game. Resting players during the season is not the equivelant of sacrificing some games. That’s why Sheed, Daniels and Williams were brought in, so that we can put in subs and at least keep even until the regulars come back in.
"I don't come to play, I come to WIN"--Larry Bird
"Criminally Negligent Officiating"--Tommy Heinsohn
There isn’t a coach in the business who “takes Ls” just to save anyone’s minutes. It won’t happen. Perhaps we lose some games late resting some beat-up vets, but we won’t go out to “take Ls.”
There are coaches that don’t go all out to win games either. I guess Pop is a bad coach since he has a habbit of resting his players, even giving them some games off to preserve them. I agree with the notion of not going out to take Ls, but the notion that we can’t rest AND win is has to stop at some point. They’re not mutually exclusive.
by BudweiserCeltic on Aug 10, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Yea
I’m not advocating pulling the starters when we are down by 10 with six minutes left. Statistically speaking, if you play the starters fewer minutes than they might otherwise play, you are going to score fewer points and/or give up more points, meaning that some of those games you might have won by two or three you will lose by two or three. It might only be a handful of games, but in a tight race, they make the difference between 1 and 3.
Hollinger's point
has nothing to do with basketball. It is simply to disrespect the Celtics and their organization. Nothing he ever writes has anything to do with basketball. It is only written to make the Celtics look 10 times worse than they are in order to take advantage of readers who aren’t that aware of the game and pursuade them to think against the Celtics. Hollinger is a fraud.
3 seed?!
How in the hell are we gonna be the 3 seed! We got basically I big 5 now that rondos skills have increased and sheed is an all star. There’s no way we are going to be third. The lowest I see us is 2nd!
by jfarias on Aug 10, 2009 12:05 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Compared to the 4-3 Orlano wijn in the playoff series playoff series,
Vince Carter, Brandon Bass, Matt Barnes, Ryan Anderson in, Jameer Nelson healthy, Hedo Turkoglu, Tony Battie, Rafer Alston, Courtney Lee out.
Rasheed Wallace, Marquis Daniels, Shelden Williams in, Kevin Garnett healthy, Stephon Marbury, Mikki Moore, Gabe Pruitt out.
I’d say the Celtic upgrades are much more impressive than the Magic ones. Bass is a major upgrade at the backup 4. Nelson’s back, but a bit over-ratefd IMO (see playoff perdormance) I’m not sold on VC being an upgrade on Hedo gbased on our experiences aghainst both of them. I liked Courtney Lee. Boston goes from a Perk-Davis-Scals rotation (with no one else!) at the 4/5 to KG-Rasheed Wallace-Perk with Davis-Scals-Williams avsailable for deep backup (including being able to hack away at Dwight Howard). Then we have Daiels as a definite upgrade over Tony Allen as the backup at the wing. There’s also a definite risk of a chemistry issue with VC by many accounts.
I’m more concerned about the Cavs. I have no idea how they will look/play with Shaq and James together, but Shaq is a major upgrade over Ben Wallace. Anthony Paker and Jamario Moon are nice additions on the wing with Wally World gone.
Actually Think The Cavs Are Worse
Shaq, Ilgauskas, Varajeo. They basically play the same position. Don’t think all will be happy. Shaq is an upgrade over Wallace, but I think Ilgauskas hurts us more than Shaq. Perk can defend Shaq. He has more trouble with Ilgauskas when he goes outside. Also, not sure how LeBron will play with Shaq. Shaq plays down low and will want the ball. He’ll clog the driving lane. I don’t think Shaq has made any team better since winning the Championships.
"I don't come to play, I come to WIN"--Larry Bird
"Criminally Negligent Officiating"--Tommy Heinsohn
The Magic are not the same team without Turkoglu
I’m amazed at how much Hollinger, et al are overrating the Magic just because they replaced Hedo Turkoglu with Vince Carter.
As the go-to playmaker, Turkoglu drove the Magic offense with his ability to drive, pass, and shoot (and his willingness to take and make big shots). Both Howard and Lewis are effective only once someone has created their shots for them. That’s where Turkoglu’s skill set came into play. Turkoglu’s ability to create his own shot opened up the court for Howard, who lacks a refined, Tim Duncan-esque post game; and Lewis, who oftentimes is nothing more than an oversized sharpshooter.
Hollinger and these supposed experts are operating under the notion that Vince Carter can somehow replace Turkoglu as the Magic’s big-shot-making offensive facilitator. That line of thinking is more delusion and less intellectual analysis.
But, in fairness, who knows what a motivated, injury free Vince Carter is capable of? Maybe I’m the short-sighted one.
by Walker,TexasCeltic on Aug 10, 2009 12:58 PM EDT reply actions
Heh...is Hollinger serious?
We win 62 games with KG out for a little less than 1/3 of the season and with a bench composed of Marbury, House, Scalabrine, Powe, and Moore; BBD started in KG’s place. Now, we have a bench consisting of Eddie House, Marquis Daniels, BBD, Scalabrine, Williams, Rasheed Wallace, and, to a much lesser extent Tony Allen. This assumes we don’t get that backup PG before the regular season starts, and if that’s the case, a mid-season trade for one is still possible.
We could win 70 games with the current lineup we have now and STILL get better, even if marginally, at mid-season. The fact we have such a solid bench will prevent the likelihood of injury. And, like BudweiserCeltic’s pleading about, we could get our starters that rest they’ll probably need in an 82 game season.
no he's not serious
He just writes the article to disrespect the Celtics, none of his writings have anything to do with basketball. Hollinger pretends to be a basketball expert so he can print lies and propaganda discrediting the C’s every chance he gets. This won’t be the first or last article you will see this year. There will be another one 1/3 through the season when the Celtics are #1 that will rank them as the 5th best team in the NBA. Then at the start of the playoffs when the Celtics, clearly a better team and healthy, functioning at all cylinders, are picked to lose to the Cavs in the ECF. Then after the Celtics crush some dormat of a team to win the title, Hollinger will write another article claiming the Lakers are the “better franchise” because of the Artest pick up even though they didn’t win the title. Then after Banner #19, there will be another article by Hollinger who will make up excuses that the C’s won 3 of 4 by coming up with some statistical jargon of how the opponents were weaker than the 2000-02 Lakers run. Its all nonsense.
I wouldn't go that far, star18
But clearly Hollinger’s delusional. He points out in the same article that the Celtics won more regular season games than the Magic despite KG being out the final two months, and then adds the Celtics took the Magic to seven games, and the Celtics didn’t have KG or Powe.
Now, he can only look at the team right now and say the Magic are the better team going into the regular season? Hey, I guess that’s for the Celtics to prove wrong. I already told you my assessment of our team; we look like we can win 70 games. At worst, maybe 65.
he always does it
I would go that far, because every time Hollinger writes an article that involves the Celtics he shorthands them and disrespects them every time. If they are 27-2, the schedule is weak. If they lose 7 of 9 they are the worst team in NBA history. If they are playing the Cavs, they have no chance. If they are playing the Lakers, the Lakers are clearly the better franchise. If there is a questionable call that went for the Celtics it is headline news, if there is a questionable call that went against the Celtics it was clearly the right cal. Every time he does it. I’ve never seen anything written by Hollinger that credits the Celtics organization for what they have acccomplished.
Game 6 NBA Finals 2008
It was the most important game in Professional Sports History hands down. It was the only game, ever in sports history, where the top two franchises went for the title with only 2 championships separating them from each other. It was the only game in sports history where the top 2 franchises were neck and neck with each other for all-time championships. It was the most lopsided NBA finals clinching game ever out of 60 games. It was the most lopsided NBA finals game in about 350 games, except for one the Bulls 42 point win over the Jazz in 1997. Even if you include football AND baseball it was the most lopsided final clinching game ever, except for the 49ers 55-10 win over the Broncos in 1989. Now that is over 230 title clinching games.
The Celtics set the record for most steals 18, Ray tied the record for most threes 8, and the Celtics scored 42 points in the final quarter.
What does Hollinger do? He ranks the Lakers as #1.
The Lakers got totally squashed by 39 points 131-92 in the most important NBA game ever. Nothing Hollinger writes should be published. It is all lies.
So wait
He did this at the end of the 2008 season, has his final rankings RIGHT AFTER the Celtics won the title?
Losers aren't #1
and Winners aren’t #2. The most important sports game of all-time becomes the biggest rout and washout in sports history except for two games(49ers 55-10, Bulls win by 42). The Celtics were the winners, the Lakers were the losers. Nothing in sports history was ever so clear. Never have two rivals gone at it, at their most important time in franchise history, and had such a blowout of epic decisive proportions as this one 131-92. Hollinger has no right to rank the Lakers #1 after a game like that. His article should not have even been published.
I guarantee you
Every time Hollinger writes an article the Lakers will be over the Celtics every single time. Every regular season game when they meet he will pick the Lakers every single game. Every time they meet in the playoffs he will pick the Lakers every single time. No matter what their records are, no matter who is on their team, Hollinger picks the Lakers every single time without fail. If there is a category where teams are ranked, even if it is rebounding, or scoring, or bench depth the Lakers will be over the Cetlics every single time in every single category by this guy. Writers like that belong on blogs, they do not deserve to get their writings published.
Hedo Fanboys???
ROFLCOPTER!!!!!!!!!
"Sold your body!! Oh Bender, I been down that road. I know it's glamorous, and the parties are great. But you'll end up spending every dollar you make on jewelery and skin-tight pants." -- Hubert J. Farnsworth
by Will Said Skills Pay the Billz? on Aug 10, 2009 11:42 PM EDT reply actions
I'd like to have homecourt...
Plus if we can avoid facing having to face the Magic or Cavs in the second round and face whoever the 4 seed (bound to be a team much weaker then us and the Magic and Cavs) it would greatly benefit… NOT THAT WE CAN’T BE THE CAVS OR MAGIC BECAUSE I FEEL WE CAN BEAT ANYONE… but if we can avoid facing them so we will have an easier second round series I would like that because it would mean we would have to play less games and save the vets legs.






















