Why we can win.
This offseason has been full of reasons why other teams have gotten better. How the window maybe closing for the Cs. How we still need to add this or that. Basically, discounting our Celtics. This post is an attempt to define why I think the Celtics are in great position to bring home Banner 18 in 2010.
Bill Simmons makes the point that all of the contenders (BOS, SA, LA, ORL, CLE) got worse except for the Spurs. He and other media types have given a thumbs down to the Celtics offseason moves: Rasheed and Daniels. Criticism has been leveled over not signing Baby yet. Not getting a backup point gaurd for Rondo. Alienating Rondo. Not being able to go small. Not having a backup at the 3. Making an old team, older. They say the Celtic season is dependent on the knees of KG, the ankles of Ray Allen, and the stamina of Paul Pierce. I will not argue that these factors are not important. However, the analysis has been pessimistic and underestimates a hobbled team that won 62 games last year. It is not the first time the boys in green have been underestimated. It appears that it won’t be the last time.
Let’s start with the Rasheed deal. Indeed, the full mid-level for 2 to 3 years was a steep price to play for Sheed. He did have a seemingly awful year, and he is obviously on the decline. He shoots more 3 pointers and posts up less. He has problems with authority and has been known to mail it in (most notably in the 2009 playoffs). This is not the Sheed of 04 and 05 who helped the Pistons play championship ball.
However, do you doubt that if Sheed was plugged into Mikki Moore’s minutes, the celtics get by Orlando? Doesn’t Sheed do better job gaurding Rashard Lewis than Baby or Scal? Is orlando leaving him to clog the lane, like the did with Perk? Doesn’t he post up Lewis or Hedo if they match up with him? Isn’t he the best KG sub available? He’s not a poor man’s PJ Brown. He is the crazy man’s PJ Brown. Talented, dedicated, loved by teammates, and a bit of a loose cannon. He’s got a championship ring, and in my opinion, plays some of the best post defense this side of Perk and KG. He’s got grit and persona. He’s not afraid to shoot (stephon) and he does all the things Posey did to get under the skin of the other team. Does he have to carry this team? No. If he plays good defense, posts up occasionally, and knocks down 35% of his 3s, the celtics will be hard to beat.
Daniels is criticized mostly for the fact that he is not James Posey. His inablity to shoot the three does limit his game and he is not known for his defense. But he’s the atheletic 2-3 that we were missing last year. He can be the slasher/scorer that Tony Allen was supposed to be, with the court intelligence and basketball IQ that TA never had. He’s the first wing off the bench and will hopefully bring both Ray’s and PP minutes down. He has got enough handle to bring the ball up in some situations, and he has all the ability to be a good defender. This in its most basic sense is going from TA to Daniels. This makes us better, no matter how you slice it.
No backup PG is an issue. But this was a job held by Stephon and Sam Cassel in the past, both of whom, I would’ve liked to seen less of. While I’d like to sign a good backup PG, the likes of Tyronne Lue, Anthony Carter leave me wanting. I rather go with the 2008 version PG rotation: House playing point. If someone puts pressure on the ball, PP or Daniels brings it up. If it’s really tight pressure, Rondo comes back in. Just cause a PG can bring the ball up better than Eddie, doesn’t mean he should be playing night in and night out. As far as I’m concerned, Lester Hudson can be the backup to bring the ball up.
It looks like Baby will be back, and him and/or Shelden Williams give us 4-5 guy big man rotation. Can we go small? Daniels or PP at the 4 might be a stretch. But a lineup with KG and Sheed against a small ball lineup plays good enough defense, and should dominate on offense. Salmons may get some points if KG is on him in that bull series, but I like that matchup overall.
Rondo is a goofball. The most frustrating thing about last year, was that when he played his best, when he went full speed, the celtics were unstoppable. We didn’t need KG if Rondo played well. But he is young, and a knucklehead. Danny took a risk calling him out. Maybe he will shut down and have a bad year because of the criticism. Or, more likely, he’ll feed off of it. He may have his best year yet, trying to prove Danny wrong and get paid. It’s a risk, but it could pay off huge. If its a bust, we aren’t on the hook for a max contract for a guy who can’t hack it.
Finally the health of the big three. This has been harped on and is probably the number one reason that the Cs won’t repeat. While I think we can survive if Ray is not the Ray of old, if KG is not KG, we can’t win. I’m not talking the 22.0 pts, 14 rebound guy. I’m talking about the defensive anchor, the intensity machine, the intimidator. The guy who hold everyone accountable and gives it his all every play, every night. I remember one play, I can’t remeber against who (Denver maybe), but the opposing team got a steal, and had a fast break and an easy layup. I remember KG sprinting back with his big white sleeve on his knee to contest the layup. I remember the missed shot caused by KG and the rebound picked up by the trailer. I remember no other celtic made it to the other end of the floor. And I remember the stare. I remember KG not saying a word, staring down Rondo and Perk and the rest of his teammates. Not a word was said, but it was understood. The Celts went on a run after that. The intensity picked up, and the best defense in the NBA came alive. A health KG shifts the balance of power. People forget how good the celtics are when he’s on the floor. His impact was overshadowed by last years determination and grit. The celtics without a talent like Garnett, should probably not have made it out of the first round. Instead, they battled Orlando to 7 games. They didn’t roll over and were in that series. If KG, among the best PF in the history of the league plays, is there any doubt the C’s win? Even if he doesn’t score a point, his intensity and defense would have been enough.
This team will go as far as KG and PP’s health takes them. Without either of them, we do not have a reasonable shot. Is this team without flaws? No. But I would argue the 2008 champs were not perfect either. In Rasheed, we’ve added a big with length and shooting, a guy who’s a good defender and got championship grit. He can play cruch time minutes and if he melts down, he won’t be any worse than what we had last year. Daniels is a 2-3 that we can trust, can get his own shot, and probably play good defense. We can still sign Baby, and a backup PG, but this team could have won it all last year if KG was healthy. Now we’ve added Sheed and Daniels.
We’ve already been overlooked. Underestimated. Forgotten.
I could think of no better position for this Celtics team to be in.
Be respectful and keep it clean. Thanks.
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52 comments
Comments
Best post I have read
Great job! Well said! Its up to Garnett and Paul to be heathy. Ray is the third guy,and I think Doc will be great with his minutes this year. With Garnett you get the intensity,and defense that carries your team.With Paul you get a player who takes over a 4th quarter and wins for you.With Ray you get a clutch shot 80-90% of the time. Again good post.
by green20 on Aug 7, 2009 3:29 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
realy bill simmons is the only media guy that iv heard that havnt put the c’s in top 1 or 2 teams in the nba
by celtics94 on Aug 7, 2009 4:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The age of the Big 3 is a concern the same with Sheeds but then Bill Simmons’ choice, the Spurs has also two of it’s own version of the Big 3, TD 33 and Manu 32, in that same bracket. And if you take into consideration their bench Finley, a regular bench player, is 36 and their new bigs McDyess and Ratliff are also old but they’re certainly not as talented as Sheed. The Spurs has been a perennial contender but the fact that they’re cornerstones are also aging doesn’t seem to matter a lot to Simmons.
And so what if we can’t play small ball? Are we the Warriors? Is Don Nelson Boston’s coach? Boston with Rondo leading the way has shown that they can and they are willing to run. As long as Rondo manages the offense Boston can play the running game without going literally small.
Regardless of Simmons’ professional opinions if we remain healthy just like the other teams we can win it all next season.
by Wilbert on Aug 7, 2009 5:10 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
have u really ever seen paul pierces conditioning ever be a concern becuase lately he has looked better than his conditioning has in past years. i dont see that as a concern at all if anything paul is our one player that nevr gets hurt, n plays threw any injury he can
by celtics94 on Aug 7, 2009 9:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’ll admit here that I’m a Spurs fan first, Celtics fan a very close second (I grew up in the days of Larry Bird, Kevin McHale and Robert Parish, so the Celtics will always be special to me). I find it humorous that age is an issue for teams like the Spurs or Celtics and nobody else. Kobe Bryant is 31 and his team consist of Pau Gasol and a bunch of 2nd rate talent (I would bring up Derek Fisher’s age but, he’s completely irrelevant). Kobe goes down, and the Lakers chance of repeating is over. Any team in contention that loses their #1 option isn’t going to win, the top teams are just too competitive for that to happen.
I get a big kick out of articles that talk about how the Lakers have no weaknesses. Take one look at their PG position and you can see a big one. Derek Fisher? Jordan Farmar? And I’m not sold at all on Ron Artest being on their team. Personally, if it comes down to Lakers vs. Celtics again in the finals, I’m liking the Celtics’ chances.
by gyrmnix on Aug 8, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
lol u are letting your bias get the best of you man. The lakers avg age is younger then the celtics, and WAY younger than the Spurs. I really doubt you have ever read an article that says the Lakers have no holes. It’s widely accepted knowledge that the Lakers need help at the point, so what you said is nothing new. Like you said they do have a “weakness” at the point, but they definately could be worse off. Derek fisher has time and again proven his worth in post season basketball with his timely shooting. Its the same reason the Spurs kept an aged Robert Horry on their roster. So to say Derek Fisher is irrelevant, is just ignorant. I would think the spurs would have more respect for Fisher after the .4 shot.
You point out Kobe getting injured. Sure it can happen, but its definately not as likely as Duncan, Parker, or Ginobli. The Celtics aren’t nearly close to the spurs in terms of likely injuries. Sure I could see Rondo having a 2-3 week ankle injury, but aside from that, these Celtics arent in your Spurs boat.
The Spurs are the only team in the Big 5 teams that have their superstar already on the decline. And I’d sure rather have Derek Fisher/Farmer/Brown over whatever guy the spurs have coming off the bench when Parker inevitably gets injured. As for Artest, all the Laker haters love to point to him, but dont tell me you wouldnt love to have him on your team. His twitter talks about how he hears the Laker haters. If you ask me that guy is gonna come back focused as heck. He has something to prove, and the Lakers are his dream team.
by robi s on Aug 8, 2009 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That’s very possible. I try to leave my personal preference out of it when talking about things like this but, when talking about the Lakers, it’s not always easy.
I agree that the Lakers are a young team but, the player that their entire franchise hinges on is not young. And especially with his style of play, I wouldn’t be surprised to see Kobe start slowing down withing the next 2-3 seasons. And what I meant about Fisher being irrelevant is that he isn’t integral to winning a championship. Fisher being out might make it more difficult but, it’s hardly at the level of losing Kobe Bryant.
The biggest problem I see with Artest is something I like say about Kobe. Basketball is a team game. They have Kobe, then they add another player who demands to take the shot at every opportunity. Who knows, maybe Phil Jackson can knock some sense into him? I suppose there’s no way to tell until the season starts. If I were a Laker fan, I would be wondering why Houston didn’t try to resign him, considering they just lost Yao Ming for the season. Either way, it should be interesting.
Would I want him on the Spurs? Well, I’d prefer a player that takes a better shot selection, that is willing to make the extra pass.
by gyrmnix on Aug 9, 2009 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not a 100% sure but,
I think LA was going for Artest anyways. I think they wanted him over Ariza. I think Houston didn’t wanted him anymore. Which I don’t think the Lakers cared about that. The Artest question is one we have to wait until the start of the year. I don’t think during the regular season will see it right away. I think when the playoffs come around.Will see how Artest will play.A team player?Maybe a problem? Just have to wait and see. I hope he doesn’t work out. LOL
by green20 on Aug 9, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
meh, im not really concerned about him demanding the ball, considering there are 4 other guys that have been their longer that also would love to have the ball, but they make the sacrifice anyway. LO took a spot on the bench for crying out loud.
Kobe has sucha domineering personality, and that in combo with Phil’szen master powers, will keep ron in check. If rodman was held in check, anyone can.
by robi s on Aug 9, 2009 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it’s not just that he demands the ball, he also takes horrible shots with the ball. Artest isn’t effective without it. Kobe also demands the ball as well. I don’t see those two going together well at all. I think Odom does deserve credit for accepting the off-the-bench role. If the situation warranted it, would Kobe accept the role? If that meant his team would win, I’d imagine he would. Artest wouldn’t, and that’s the problem.
Also, there’s a huge difference between Dennis Rodman and Ron Artest.
by gyrmnix on Aug 9, 2009 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
we’ll justhaveto wait and see now wont we
by robi s on Aug 9, 2009 10:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed. Artest may work out just fine in their system. Or he may be a cancer. Either way, should make for some wild entertainment.
by gyrmnix on Aug 9, 2009 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
im not sure if i rather have him over ariza hes a better shooter and better at goin to the rim if he was to put up the number of shots artest does i think he wuld have better averages. but hes a low volume shooter, and very efficient. the lakers only have room for one high volume shooter, kobe. i think it will work out its not like all of a sudden the lakers r gonna drop off the map becuase artest is there but i think there easier to match up with. artest doesnt scare me late in games either, i wuldnt be afraid to double off him to kobe hes not a big time shooter. not clutch
of course i wuld want him on my team but i wuldnt give up a single person on our starting five for him
by celtics94 on Aug 9, 2009 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
….. lol you kinda contradicted yourself…. his % avgs are higher then Ariza. 40% is 40% regardless of taking 5 shots or 20 shots.
He isnt a scorer and he knows it, he only shot so much because the teams he was on didnt have anybody else to score. The Kings? the Rockets w/o yao?
If anything his % are gonna go up since he will not be guarded as often, nor will the other teams best defender be playing against him. Artest will be very dangerous for the Lakers, and his main job wont be on the offensive end, it will to expend most of his energy guarding the other teams best player, which Artest can do considerably better than Ariza. Artest and Kobe on the wings are the best 1-2 defensive combo in the league, put that in combo with the Lakers 2 twin towers down low, the Lakers will be quite the defensive force.
by robi s on Aug 9, 2009 11:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ur rite the team he was on didnt have any scorers in mcgrady n yao. his percents r similar but that can be decieving. ron scores alot when hes taking alot of shots which wont be available in LA for him becasue of all there weapons, hes a very streaky 40% shooter hes always up or down. ariza was a consistent 40% guy almost every night, so r they gonna have to rely on ron to be playin well to win casue thats not sumthing i wuld want to risk in the playoffs
and no i didnt contradict myself hes a good player but not a guy i wuld want to rely on, and the lakers did rely on ariza alot last year havin several big steals down the stretch of games. givin him up for an inconsistent gunner is not sumthing a team like the lakers needed they did need defense but i personally dont consider artest a great defender anymore, u say urself wut kobe did 2 him in the finals, n when u were watching that i bet u were like artest overrated but now hes urs hes great all of a sudden
plus ariza shot 47% career artest shoots 41% so there not the same bro
by celtics94 on Aug 9, 2009 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
basketball is a game of runs n ron isnt a guy id want on my team when he gets stuck in a stretch where he goes 4-15 shooting every nite
by celtics94 on Aug 9, 2009 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
lol im guessing you didnt watch alot of laker games last year that weren’t in the playoffs….
Ariza didnt play anything like he did in the playoffs during the regular season. I’ll be the first one to say he did a great job in the playoffs, but when it came to the regular season, he was just as “inconsistent” as ron.
we’re not looking at fg percentage…. as you said he wont be taking alot of those. we are looking at 3pt percentage. If you know anything about the lakers, the SF’s job is to stand at the arc, waiting for kobe/pau to pass out of the double team. And going back to fg%, the only reason ariza has sucha fg% is because a) he was wide open due to his defender doubling kobe/pau and b) the defender is trying to recover, and trevor easily just slashed to the basket. It doesnt take a skilled shooter to dunk the ball.
The fact remains that Artest is a much better 3pt shooter than ariza. 40% to 32 “so there not the same bro”
by robi s on Aug 10, 2009 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
but ron shoots 40 percent from three and 41 percent career so basically hes not a weapon goin to the basket and finishing, n he takes lots of threes which fits into that spot perfectly, but im jus sayin its gonna be easy to defend exspecially for teams like denver with quick perimeter defenders to defend him casue all u gotta do is over play the jump shot casue he doesnt go 2 the basket
by celtics94 on Aug 10, 2009 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ron shoots 34% from three do u jus make up numbers to try n prove a point
by celtics94 on Aug 10, 2009 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
look at his stats from last year…. career stats are misleading, he obviously was bad at 3pt shooting early in his carerr. His 3pt % has gone up every year for the last 4 years..
As for driving to the basket, you obviously didnt play basketball in hs. It’s not that hard to incorporate a pump fake and slash into your game. Taking it to the next level, its ALOT easier when your defender has to quickly run over from a double team, where the guy wont be able to slow his momentum down enough to stop on a dime. So to say it will be easy to defend Ron, is a gross UNDERSTATEMENT. All of ariza’s numbers came from easy baskets (wide open shot, nice pass from LO, pump fake slash), not exactly shot thats require skills. If you don’t trust me, we’ll just have to wait and see it happen.
You’re also missing the biggest factor. The Lakers didnt get Artest for the offensive upgrade he provides. He is there for Defense. Don’t even try to argue that Artest isnt a HUGE improvement defensively.
I’m not gonna go into this argument anymore, we’re just going to have to wait and see.
by robi s on Aug 10, 2009 6:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
r u sayin ariza three point shooting didnt improve id give the three ball a wash between the two of them ariza is better goin to the hoop n artest is better at D, so yea of course its a good move just becasue ariza wanted the MLE and artest is a better player n he only got the MLE. I do think the lakers got better but i think artest can be sum1 that hurts chemistry, which the lakers rely on heavily.
n yes i did play highschool basketball i led varsity in scoring three years in a row
by celtics94 on Aug 10, 2009 7:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Artest got a lot worse defensively last year
How good you were 3 years ago and how good you are now are not the same thing.
Poster for next year? I'm thinking My Little Pony.
by Zaig on Aug 11, 2009 7:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just wanted to chime in...
and say GREAT post. Just wanted to add about how ironic it is that Celtics fans were up in arms about trading for a 30+ guy coming off double ankle surgery and he’s at the bottom of the ‘injury-worry’ totem pole these days. Ray takes great care of himself and his strength (shooter) will degrade a lot slower than a leaper or slasher-type player.
There is no doubt that Paul was running on fumes in the playoffs. It was tough to watch. He exerted so much at the end of the regular season to hold off Orlando (guess homecourt wasn’t worth what we thought it’d be), that he only looked like himself through stretches.
Rasheed? I was a big proponent of saving part of the MLE and getting McDyess instead. That obviously wouldn’t have worked since he got the full MLE from SAS, so that was a moot point. I’m still a little skeptical after watching Sheed’s lack of effort last year, but if this atmosphere doesn’t rejuvenate him, then nothing will. I just don’t want to hear any more about the Lakers’ three big men and how dominating they are anymore. The Perk/KG/Wallace defensive combo would be deadly to close out games. As for a backup PG, I think it would be silly to just grab someone now, considering what is out there. We can always wait till mid-season and see what comes along or look to trade some of our assets. I think Doc is pretty comfortable with what we have going into the start of the season.
by djLaysItIn on Aug 7, 2009 5:22 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
with perk kg, and wallace in to close games, and most likely paul, and ray, u think rondo is gonna be benched for the end of close games. becuase im sure doc will put rondo in over rasheed at the end of a game, but with little time left we could go offense defense, plus docs great ability to draw up plays will make us exspecially more dominate
by celtics94 on Aug 7, 2009 9:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It all depends on the matchup. I was referring to the Lakers’ big men in my post. Doc would obviously be up to benching Rondo in the 4th as seen when we won the ship by playing – Paul-Ray-KG-House-Posey to close games. With that lineup, switching ‘Sheed for Posey, who do you leave open on offense? Switch out Rondo for house on the defensive end during timeouts and your top 3 in that category in the league as well. This Celtics team has the ’possibility’ of being special.
by djLaysItIn on Aug 8, 2009 12:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
but u can pnly do that with very maybe 2 minutes left cause house is a liability on d and u cant burn all ur time outs
by celtics94 on Aug 8, 2009 3:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rondo is going to have to learn how to play well in the finals minutes of games. If he plays like he did vs orlando, the Celts are better off without him on the court, since Orl pretty much didnt even guard him
by robi s on Aug 8, 2009 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
rondo scares me
all i can remember about him is during the playoffs game 7 when we started makin a run against orlando, n we were on a fast break n he fired the ball off ray allens legs 4 a wide open three i dnt trust him late in games, and even kno his assist to turnover ratio is great his turnovers r the kind that kill ya. there not passes into the crowd but steals and bad passes that lead to lay up and transition threes
by celtics94 on Aug 10, 2009 7:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rondo will be on the floor at the end if....
he learns how to hit an friggin’ free-throw. I mean come on! I like Rondo’s game as much as the next (celtic’s fan) guy, but a PG who can’t shoot the rock at the line is not going to get the chance to play late. Forget the 3pointer Rajon, worry about that foul line
9 + 20 + 34 + 5 + 43 = 17
by Rondo'd on Aug 8, 2009 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lol arent you just repeating the obvious? Boston has a great team, they have just as much chance as the other 4 super teams.
the key is injuries for all teams. If any of the “super” teams get injured you can kiss their chances goodbye.
I feel aside from SA, Boston has to be most cogniscent of the age of their players, and MUST make sure their big 3 get rest. I feel that is way more important than getting the number one seed. However at the same time given the competition in the East, getting a seed that isnt number 1 is asking for disaster since you will have to play both the cavs and the magic undoubtedly.
by robi s on Aug 7, 2009 6:33 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The minutes game
The goal for the Big 3’s minutes should be around 32-33 minutes per game,and maybe Ray Allen around 30. When you have a Wallace and a Baby you can have Garnett on the bench,and not lose a lead.Then the back up point guard.Eddie does a great job,but to use him as a Point hurts his game a little,and makes us use Paul more to bring the ball up. If we add Bruce Bowen then EDDIE maybe ok as the point. If any of you have games on tape.Look at the overtime game last year against the Pacers.DANIELS had 25 points,and took care of the basketball. Basically if we have a 5 man bench we can play heavy minutes that’s huge for this team. If House is at the point,and Daniels shooting guard,and Bowen small forward,Baby at Power forward,Center Wallace. That team can hurt you inside and out,and not lose a lead. Then you can relax the big3.If we have that bench.I think Doc will stop keeping one of the big3 in the game at all times.They can even rest Rondo and perk more.Paul will be okay if the injury factor doesn’t take anyone,and Ray is in good shape.I like the point brought up that he wasn’t a slasher,and that’s true.He can still get to the basket,and take people off the dribble. Wallace came here to win. Not to mess around.
by green20 on Aug 7, 2009 7:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
why hasnt the daniels deal gotten done yet?
by robi s on Aug 7, 2009 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The trade
He’s commited to the Celtics for the 1.9 million.The Celtics are trying to get rid of Tony Allen,and get rid of his contract,and at the same time give Daniels a few more million.Pacers don’t want Tony,and so that’s why there trying to get the third team.To take Tony Allen. The trade could also get Baby involved to. .Baby is still up in the air,but I still think he will sign a one year deal,and test the market next year. Daniels will be here for sure. Also I think Danny wants to keep Billy Walker.
by green20 on Aug 7, 2009 7:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
looks like its gonna have with the biannual exception
by robi s on Aug 8, 2009 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the "minutes game" is why Rasheed is such a huge deal
Just adding Rasheed, you can go with any of the following 5 at any point in the game:
KG, Perk, Pierce, Allen, Rondo
Rasheed, Perk, Pierce, Allen, Rondo
KG, Rasheed, Pierce, Allen, Rondo
KG, Perk, Rasheed, Allen, Rondo
KG, Perk, Rasheed, Pierce, Rondo
KG, Perk, Rasheed, Allen, Pierce (i.e. Pierce brings up the ball)
So just adding this ONE player, gives you 6 ‘starting’ quality combinations and gets all starters rest. I.E. I really think that ‘Sheed becomes their 6th starter and now you’ve got 6 starters playing 4/5 of 48 minutes – already you’ve reduced everyone’s minutes to 39 without going to ‘second string’ quality.
Naturally, you insert Baby, House, etc. marginally within all that to reduce everybody’s minutes further, to ~30, but overall, you have very few situations where you have a mostly 2nd string lineup on the floor. In fact they should be able to have at least 3 of the ‘Big Six’ on the floor at all times.
As others have questioned earlier in the thread, it will be interesting to see how Rondo develops to see if he earns ‘final’ minute in close games. I think right now, if they are ahead, I want Rasheed on the court over Rondo because of defense and the ability to shoot free throws. If they are behind, I also have to say right now I want Rasheed and House on the court over Perkins & Rondo because of the ability to shoot the three without a huge loss of defense in the paint. Having Rasheed, House, Allen & Pierce on the floor means SOMEONE has an open three. But then there’s Rondo’s ability to create steals … god if he could just become a reliable shooter …
by mmmmm on Aug 10, 2009 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
not having enough minutes becasue u have too much talent is a problem any coach in the league would want
by celtics94 on Aug 10, 2009 6:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why we can win--Finally
Vineet,
Finally, I have read an accurate picture of the Celtics. I have been a fan for over 25 years, and get tired of the negativity and jealousy towards this team. KG-is a star for more than his ability, and the core groups will, took them as far as possible last year. Forgotten, underestimated——-I 100% agree THAT IS exactly where we want to be.
by 18ontheway on Aug 7, 2009 7:06 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Great post, really
Now get that 18th banner ready!
"Winning is a habit. Unfortunately, so is losing." - Vince Lombardi
by wild-a on Aug 8, 2009 1:24 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
REASONS WHY THE CELTICS WON'T WIN
The Celtics will probably not get the best record in the league, or even the East. They are too old to play their hearts out all season, so Doc will probably opt to rest the Big 3 as much as possible and keep this team fresh for the playoffs. If they don’t have the best record in the East this means they will have to play Orlando, Cleveland, and either the Lakers or the Spurs having homecourt advantage most likely having homecourt advantage in only one of these series. Would you bet your money that the Celtics will run the table and beat the other top 3 contenders? i doubt it.
by lakersnic0824 on Aug 8, 2009 3:58 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
?
The celtics won 62 games last season, many of them without Garnett. Please. They would have had the best record if it wasn’t for that injury.
by stevenfuzz on Aug 8, 2009 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think your right. Whoever gets the number one seed in the east will have a huge advantage. Considering they wont have to play BOTH of the great teams in the east. If the Celts dont get it done in the regular season, Im afraid the Celts will be way to tired to win the championship. 3 incredibly tough series in a row? thats alot to ask.
by robi s on Aug 8, 2009 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What about the West?I do remember the 2008 west playoffs. 1-8 seeds sperated by only seven games.
1.Lakers 57-25
2.Hornets 56-26
3.Spurs 56-26
4.Utah 54-28
5.Houston 55-27
6.Suns 55-27
7.Dallas 51-31
8.Denver 50-32
It was made out to be by the media,and I thought to. It was going to be this great battle in the West.It wasn’t at all. Out of seven series in the West.
We had 3 5 game series,and one sweep,and 2 six game series,and one 7 game series. The build for that was every series was going to be seven games and so tough. It was not even like that. I do think the number one seed is key for a easy go of the East.Do you think the West will be harder then let on by the Media? I think so. The reason the East is let on to be so hard,and deservingly so is do to the fact you have a Magic team go to the Finals.The Cavs won 66 games the year before,and the defending 2008 champs won 62 with a injury plauged team.Then got KG coming back.With a improved bench. With the West.We have more question marks about there teams,or contenders. The Spurs heath,and did the Nuggets learn from last year?The Blazers have the talent,and depth,but are they ready to take it to the next level.The MAVS added some talent,but can it get them back to elite status in the West again?The Hornets almost got the number one seed in 2008,and went to a seventh game in the semi-finals in 08. They had injuries last year,and will they get back to the top. The Suns,and Jazz faded the past season from what they were working on. I think the West will be as hard as the East this year. The Blazers and Mavs will be better then most think. A healthy Spurs team can win the West. The Nuggets I think are not going to be as good as they played in 2009.
by green20 on Aug 8, 2009 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you have a point about the media hype. But I still think the road to the championship is alot tougher in the east.
Lets face it, the lakers had no one to challenge them in west that year. Alot of people actually believe the lack of a challenge during the playoffs is the reason why the lakers came into 08 finals so soft, since they had yet to be challenged.
The 08 west standings were not in the least bit representative of what was going on. The lakers had Kwame brown half of that season (no gasol). The spurs were injured. The hornets were playing way above their expectations. Meanwhile ironically there was no D in Dallas or Denver.
The easts best teams are alot more competitive with eachother than the best teams with the west. I still dont think the Spurs have enough to keep up with the lakers, let alone the fact that I would bet almost anything that the spurs will not remain healhty this year. Meawhile we saw the jazz, houston, and phoenix just jump off the playoff ship. Sure the mavs got better, but thy didnt get that much better to make up for the 4 times the lakers destroyed them
by robi s on Aug 8, 2009 9:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
checkout my youtube
I put the entire short short game from 2007 against the Lakers. lol
by green20 on Aug 9, 2009 12:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
"Alot of people actually believe the lack of a challenge during the playoffs is the reason why the lakers came into 08 finals so soft"
Those people are wrong. The Celtics were simply a better team. It’s not like the Lakers fell behind 3-0 and had to try and make an epic comeback. They survived long enough to “get tough” and instead got absolutely massacred in the final game. “Analysts” just like to spew myths because it’s what they are paid to do.
Poster for next year? I'm thinking My Little Pony.
by Zaig on Aug 10, 2009 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don’t try to act like you have all the answers. In football, and every other sport, the team that played in the gritty games going into the finals, usually always ends up winning look at the steelers and giants.
The same thing goes for basketball. The Lakers were not challenged period during the 08 finals. They ran through every team, hence they didnt ever feel the pressure of playoff basketball on them. Aside from Kobe and Fish, that was the first time any of those guys had even made it out of the first round. In every interview with players/coaches, they talk about the learning curve, and the importance of playoff experience. While the lakers were breezing through denver, utah, and SA. The Celts were in 7 game series after 7 game series. The Celts had to play at a high level of play the whole playoffs, while the Lakers didnt even have to break a sweat until the finals.
Last year the lakers were challenged, with the rockets and nuggets, and they came in well prepared. It would be naive to think that having those tough two round prior to the finals didnt help the lakers.
by robi s on Aug 10, 2009 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Umm
The 2002 Lakers were not challenged going to the finals. They won the finals 4-1 with an overtime loss and 4 easy wins.
If the Lakers had won the 2008 finals, the analysts would have said it was because they were rested and the Celtics had to play 7 games. But, the Lakers lost the finals so the analysts said that it was because the Celtics were tested and the Lakers were not.
Also, the number 1 overall seed wins the NBA finals 40% of the time. The 2-16 teams win it a combined 60%. So no, the gritty tested team doesn’t usually win. The best team does. Next you’re going to argue that it’s better to be an 8 seed in the NCAA tourney than a 1 seed because the 8 seeded team gets a tougher draw in round 1.
Poster for next year? I'm thinking My Little Pony.
by Zaig on Aug 11, 2009 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Those standings mean nothing
22-5 with Gasol
35-20 without him.
35-20 isn’t bad, but that’s only on pace to win 52 games, giving the Lakers a 6 seed instead of a 1 seed. That was 2 seperate teams for the Lakers
Team 1: First, maybe 2nd round playoff bust. (Pre Gasol)
Team 2: NBA finalists. (Post Gasol)
Poster for next year? I'm thinking My Little Pony.
by Zaig on Aug 10, 2009 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
well the spurs will be doing the same resting there veterans so we would prob have home court over them but the other i dnt see as a problem except for cleveland, there crazy good on there home floor
by celtics94 on Aug 9, 2009 2:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
staying fresh
please see my post up above under ‘the minutes game’ on why the Celtics are very well setup to keep everybody’s minutes down yet stil keep the pressure on constantly in every game. They are no longer just a ‘Big 3’. Rondo and Perk are both legitimate stud players on their own merits and getting better each year. Rasheed comes with plenty of cred – last year’s Detroit debacle is not a measure of how good a player he still is. The Celts are very much a ‘Big Six’ team now.
by mmmmm on Aug 10, 2009 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There’s no question in my mind that IF Perkins & Garnett remain healthy all season long, the Celtics will come out champs again.. They have a solid back up in Wallace, Daniels & Davis.. However, they have to add a dependable, pass first PG who can really handle the ball, great peripheral vision, great touch from the outside if need be as back up for Rondo.. Just don’t like the signing of Williams, they should have instead taken in Robert Swift.. My Boston Celtics should have been this:
Pierce-Daniels-Walker
Garnett-Wallace-Davis
Perkins-Swift-Scal
R. Allen-House-Giddens
Rondo-PG
Note: 15th slot: Williams, T. Allen & Hudson.. Your pick..
by BOOMBOOM on Aug 10, 2009 7:45 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Wow Mr mmmmmm
Thanks for sharing your insights.
You iz sooooo smart yo self.
’ The Celtics are the Big Six team now’?
The writers for ESPN have nothing on you!
Don’t forget Scal…He would make them ‘The Big Seven Team’ by your standards.
Definition of Basketball: Boston Celtics
by MyCeltics on Aug 16, 2009 3:12 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

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