I Guess He Really Is A Big Baby
First of all, let me say that I like Glen Davis. He seems like a fun guy and he's a pretty good basketball player. At his best he's a real asset to the team. However, I'm starting to get frustrated with his lack of maturity.
Yes, I'm a little frustrated over the losing streak, and I acknowledge that. I don't want to turn Glen into a scapegoat or anything. I can't stress this enough: Glen Davis is a very small part of the problems with the Celtics. It isn't his fault (alone) that we are losing games.
With that said, I can't help but react to yet another negative incident caused by his immaturity.
Let us review...
Dec. 5, 2008: Glen Davis breaks down into tears as a result of a tongue lashing tirade by KG where he appears to be addressing the whole team for lack of effort.
This Past Offseason: A twitter account claiming to be run by Big Baby starts posting frustrated tweets at the lack of progress in contract negotiations. After the tweets get national exposure Glen Davis denies anything to do with it and the twitter account abruptly signs off with a note saying it was a fake. Maybe it was a fake, but honestly, I don't think we can rule out the possibility that it wasn't.
Contract Signed: It is announced that Glen Davis has signed his contract and that there are clauses tied to his weight. He'll earn an extra $500,000 per season (2 years) if he can meet certain weight restrictions. You don't put clauses like that in if you are fully confident in a player's ability to stay in shape. (note: he showed up for preseason in fantastic shape but during his rehab, Doc made a number of comments about him needing to stay in shape)
Preseason: Glen Davis injures his hand in a fight just days before the season starts. He misses several weeks and is fined by the team (they elected not to suspend him). Wyc grows frustrated with Davis and proclaims: "I'm not going to call him 'Big Baby' anymore. He's Glen. He needs to act like Glen."
Jan. 20, 2010: Glen Davis allows himself to get frustrated by an opposing team's taunting fan and reacts with very strong (and embarrassing) language. Doc Rivers doesn't like it. Says "shame on Glen Davis."
Here's a quote from Davis from after the hand injury incident:
"This summer was a crucial summer for me just becoming a professional,'' said Davis, who was fined an undisclosed amount. "When this happened it was tough thinking about all the hard work this summer. And it just made me realize how I'm not where I need to be. I'm not where I need to be as a professional, because professionals make the right decisions at crucial moments, and at that time I didn't. So, I have a lot of work to do in order to be the player I need to be and also the man I need to be.''
Apparently he's still got some growing up to do.
Update: In case anyone thinks this isn't a big deal, Doc disagrees:
"It is a big deal," said Rivers. "Unfortunately, I didn't know it had transpired. I didn't know until after the game, talking to the press pool, it got brought up, and it was a big deal to the press. I still don't have the clear picture, but I'm assuming whoever watched the game heard it and it was very clear... That stuff can't happen.
"I don't think it's a huge step backwards [in Davis' maturity], but it is a step backwards. Glen Davis has to grow up."
Update 2: WEEI
Davis apparently apologized on a Twitter account labeled GlenDavisNBA. Via the Twitter feed: “I’m a tough competitor and I’m proud of the work I’ve done to get in shape and be at the top of my game.” “That said, I shouldn’t have said what I did. My apologies to the fans and my teammates.” It’s worth pointing out that the time stamp has both tweets coming in the hour or so after the game. In other words, Davis expressed his regret long before the incident became front-page news. It’s also worth pointing out that this is a different account then bigbabybball, which media outlets cited when the author voiced frustrations over Davis’ unsettled contract situation last summer. Later updates indicate the account might have been a fake.
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yah really?
move on… not a big deal. This is so far away from the root of our problems I don’t know what to say.
"Take it to the hoop, there's a dance involved." - DJ Tommy
Doc disagrees
“It is a big deal,” said Rivers. "Unfortunately, I didn’t know it had transpired. I didn’t know until after the game, talking to the press pool, it got brought up, and it was a big deal to the press. I still don’t have the clear picture, but I’m assuming whoever watched the game heard it and it was very clear… That stuff can’t happen.
“I don’t think it’s a huge step backwards [in Davis’ maturity], but it is a step backwards. Glen Davis has to grow up.”
"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers" Henry V
doc can say its a big deal
but in no way shape or form is glen davis cursing out a fan the reason for us playing with little to no effort in the 2nd half of the past 5 contests.
"Take it to the hoop, there's a dance involved." - DJ Tommy
Not my issue with Davis..
And doesnt seem like a big deal. If fans haven’t figured out that he’s immature by now then I don’t know what to say. I just don’t like his defense or lack of ability to finish around the rim.
He is who he is, and I found that I actually don’t dislike him. I just dislike when people here obscenely overvalue him. Odd to say, but I think he’s more expendable than Tony Allen at this point, so that’s saying something.
glen had a great season last year
where he got to start a bunch of games and even be a hero in the playoffs. along with rondo he was easily one of our best players in the playoffs. But this year he has repeatedly crapped the bed. The fact is that he is fat; he allowed himself to get out of shape after a senseless incident and he has hurt this team. I don’t know if he will ever get back ( this season) to where he was last season. Right now he’s giving us nothing- not rebounding, not defense, not shooting and no inside game. He can barely get off the floor and he routinely gets his shot blocked. He needs minutes to get in shape but he hasn’t earned those minutes with his play so it’s a dilemna for Doc. With all of the injuries and now with this funk we’re in it’s sure starting to look like our window is closing rapidly. Thank god we won a title with this group because we are close to starting over.
Davis has never been able to dunk. Although everyone said what good shape he came into the season with, I couldn’t tell, and because of his injury he never proved it…I miss Marquis so much I can’t believe it. As of now I feel that Marquis is four times the player Davis is, and Scal is more than equal to him. Marquis is smart and Scal is enthusiastic.
by thirstyboots18 on Jan 21, 2010 9:27 AM EST up reply actions
Wrong!
Davis can dunk. He even dunked in college when he was much bigger.
I should have said he has not been much of a dunker since he joined the Celtics. He is too short and the interior defense at the NBA level is higher. He gets stuffed a lot (no pun intended). I thought his jumper improved last year, but his biggest asset to the team was his ability to carve out space under the basket…both on offense and defense.
by thirstyboots18 on Jan 21, 2010 9:57 AM EST up reply actions
I agree that Davis has some growing up to do,
and I think that, more than any other player, his attitude is hurting the team. I know hat sounds very harsh. Glen has not provided the spark off the bench, that he provided last year. Glen did not “replace” kg last year, if he had, we would have gone further in the playoffs, but he did do his best, with exuberance, and we went further than we would have without him. This year he has not added much of anything to the bench. First, because he “didn’t think before he acted” he injured himself (thumb). Now that he has recovered he is whining about how hard he worked last summer. If he is expecting sympathy from me, he can look to Haiti and see what real misery and lack of fairness looks like. Thanks, Danny, for showing the intelligence in NOT giving Glen the contract he felt he deserved. He can still turn his year around, but it will take effort and he seems like a one and done type of player to me. I have wanted to warm up to him, but he makes it very difficult.
Completely non-issue. So he allowed a fan that kept calling him “fat boy” to get under his skin… big deal.
by BudweiserCeltic on Jan 21, 2010 9:24 AM EST reply actions
Infants have thin skin
it’s get tougher with age….but he is a baby…me thinks a big one
Is it Soup Yet?
you can see that davis, when on the bench, has no chemistry with the team… sometimes he’ll get excited but he never really participates in the goofing around activities that everyone else seems to… a perfect example was against the nets, bill walkers dunk, everyone stood up and started messing with one another while davis stayed on the bench and just kind of smirked… its that kind of stuff that shows you hes not into it on the team level… it definitely wouldnt be hard to imagine him as the player on the team that no one exactly hates, but everyone always criticizes when hes out on the court… theres always one of those guys
You can't see that he has no chemistry with the team. lol
He has plenty chemistry last year and when he first came back from injury and was playing well. I just think he’s not 100% yet and is still getting his feat under him.
He may not be 100% back
Which would mean his footwork, etc is out of sync, but there is no excuse for coming back out of shape. And he is out of shape.
by TomHamilton30 on Jan 21, 2010 10:51 AM EST up reply actions
Almost everyone here is unknowledgable about Glen
In your words, it’s obvious you haven’t watched him much. Two things, he has a great chemistry with the team and he hasn’t been able to fully get his legs back because of being limited in minutes.
Personally I wish he could leave the team now. I have done a full turnaround and am tired of the name calling and put downs (that are totally uninformed). I hope he can go with a team where his great playing will be appreciated. He is young, 23 yrs. old, and you expect him to act like the veterans on this team. Personally I don’t know how a guy his age can take all the put downs from places like this or from certain fans calling him ‘fat’. It’s so cruel and I am disgusted with this and I’m sure he is disgusted a whole lot more than I am.
I say, Big Baby, find a team who will appreciate you. Celtics are a big dissappointment.
And how are you so knowledgeable?
People are commenting on what they see. They see that whatever shape he got in over the summer was lost and he is out of shape. They see that underneath the hoop he can’t finish, and that his defense is poor. Glen Davis is not a victim. Davis doesn’t deserve the Celtics? Please.. the Celtics deserve better than what Davis is giving.
But in the end he gets paid a minimal amount (in nba terms) and is producing per that $ amount. The real problem is that Doc is forced to play him too many minutes. He’s not a starter in this league, and he should not be getting more than 8 minutes for any team.
On a side note, I think any fan that shows up to a game only to scream “fat boy” should be kicked out asap.
by TomHamilton30 on Jan 21, 2010 10:49 AM EST up reply actions
Uhhh, did you watch the playoffs last season?
He started in place of KG and we got pretty close. Review his game winning buzzer beater against orlando and review his points in all the games he started. Wow!
Anyone know what he said? Or at what point in the second quarter he said it, so I can go back and hear…
when we risk becoming part of the problem
Jeff, i appreciate greatly all the things you do for our community—and Ive never felt this way before about any of your offerings—but I think this article is dangerously close to committing one of the fundamental sins of sports journalism. I think of it as the Shaughnessy Zone—and it happens when a writer no longer so much covers a story as they do inject themselves into it by picking a fight with a player.
Of course I owe you the courtesy of explaining why I feel your article does this—because certainly its fair and important for journalists to express critical concern about a player. Here’s where its a bit tough, because the line is subtle. Its partly the title of course, which seems trite and excessively provocative in a personal way. But then its also the whoe argument of the article—hanging major claims about the long-term trend of BBD’s maturity on this incident of telling off a heckling fan courtside. Look at your own timeline. Since that stupid fight with his friend preseason, he’s been more or less a model citizen. And even going back in time from the stupid fight I think the article’s claims are excessive. Tears of frustration? Come on—Wes Welker cried in frustration recently and people called it a sign of his competitive spirit. And then the only other things you list surround contract negotiations, when everyone knows always involves posturing by both sides that are soon forgotten. Now Im not saying that his response to the heckling fan isnt news—and there might be a way to write this article without crossing into Curly-Haired Boyfriend territory, I just think its very close to that line.
Again Jeff, I respect your work and contribution greatly. And this is not a major criticism. i see that you state you like Davis in the first line of the article. im just wondering if all the facts you point to really amount to an article about Davis entitled “I Guess He Really Is A Big Baby”.
thanks for the kind words, and I understand where you are coming from, but I feel like my position is backed up by his own coach repeatedly saying that he needs to grow up
normally I wouldn’t care if a guy was immature or not as long as it didn’t effect performance on the court, but he’s cost his team several weeks with the injury and if he’s melting down on the court because a fan calls him fat, that’s an issue too – and devalues him as a member of the team
I knew this would be a touchy subject for some and there would be several that would tell me that I’m overreacting and picking nits that don’t matter, but I have an opinion on this and I am sharing that opinion, that’s all – take it (or leave it) for what it is worth
"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers" Henry V
I'm going to agree with mobanners on this
The provocative title is definitely injecting yourself into the story.
Putting a summary of widely dispersed factoids (either in time or in context) in a single article is a writing technique to create artificial proximity and thus the illusion of fact density. That can be used to illuminate correlations that are otherwise to thinly spread out to see – but it can also be used (i.e. ‘CHB-style’) to artificially illustrate something that isn’t necessarily there. This article treads dangerously into the latter territory.
I also agree with mobanners that your writing is almost always (99% of the time) way above this. So please take this as constructive criticism.
no worries
I’ll take the constructive criticism as it is intended
cheers
"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers" Henry V
I thought you would.
cheers back at ya! Now, get back to writing the next article!
My 2 cents
I think the article treads dangerously close to your “latter territory”, but it’s not there. The twitter account fiasco story may be misplaced. Everything else is accurate and appropriate, including the title. Davis really does appear to be a “Big Baby”, based on his behavior. Shouting an unprintable epithet at a fan, at the top of his lungs and in close proximity to the microphone feeding the whole world… that was beyond stupid.
And btw… was the fan lying?
I forgot something...
Even if he could be forgiven for forgetting about the microphones… what about all the KIDS sitting right there in front of him? He’s one of the players, one of the men they look up to. He couldn’t miss all the kids. And he shouts that, that loudly, in the open arena? Really, seriously inexcusable. He deserves every penny of that fine.
This is just wrong.
Jeff, sometimes I enjoy your articles. But this reads as if it were written by a bored writer, who is trying to find something that’s not there.
by KungPoweChicken on Jan 21, 2010 11:24 AM EST reply actions
Well, my two cents I guess
The “breaking down in tears” because of KG was overblown to me. I didn’t really get anything out of it, cause if that was the only thing he had done up to now, one would argue that it showed he cared, kinda like Wes Welker when he was injured.
The twitter account thing could’ve been BBD, but since it wasn’t proven outright, I can’t say I care now. I mean, at absolute worst, BBD covered his tracks well, cause anything that could’ve happened was washed away.
What really got to me was when BBD injured himself practically the day before the season. That was 200% dumb, because if he had actually started the season off well, everything he did within the last year would’ve probably been forgiven. Now, it’s like everyone was right about BBD being a real “Big Baby” all along, and now wanted him to be “Glen Davis” real quick.
The next guy to me (you know who you are if you’re reading, you won tickets too from CelticsBlog ; ) ) at the Mavs game on Monday was talking about Kidd being a wife beater. Kidd was booed heavily, so I imagine he wasn’t the only one. It didn’t seem to bother Kidd, so Glen Davis has to learn to just ignore it, too.
Oh my,
if that is our biggest problem, you can book the parade right now.
advice to bbaby
should NOT make eye contact with jeering fans. ok expection only look if the fan is a “babe”.
Let the fans say what he or she wants.
God gave you two ears… use them…..in one out the other
terrific saying!
“God gave you two ears…use them….in one out the other.” Mind if I steal it? lol
by thirstyboots18 on Jan 21, 2010 2:12 PM EST up reply actions
Both Davis and Perkins are Immature
The both need to grow up and fast. Perkins is like a junior Sheed now and both Davis and Perkins lose control of their emotions way too often.
ThanksJeff, worth the read...
I often wonder about these players lives, what goes thru their minds, etc. The total amount of media reporting on theC’s gives a sliver of a picture that does occasionally give a factual and also insightful perspective on such things, but not often. I appreciate your willingness to step out and say what youthink. Maybe Shaughnessy deserves his rep, maybe not, I still respect thetwist and turn of his perspective, though he oughta get points for anti-loyalty, a necessary ingredient in earning credibility.
So i finally got the gist of what happened...
And I’m not bothered by it. Now if it ended affecting his game I would see a problem but I didn’t watch the game so I can’t say. My biggest quarrel is with the idiotic fan who chants “fat boy” throughout the game, then when he is told to stop he continues to chant “chubs” (according to the Herald). Then to top things off, HE files a complaint with the NBA!
Hell I know I don’t react well people talk about my weight. If baby was immature that guy was far worse. These guys are not animals but even animals get better treatment at the zoo. Sure the fans say stuff and that’s part of the experience but the players should be able to give it right back.
2 apologies
this is the 2nd time that big baby has had to apologize for something involving a fan. 1st was the orlando incident with the kid on the sidelines and now this. as for last night, i would have done the same thing. if there was no court and this was just a back alley that fan would never have uttered those words.
by tommysgreenglasses on Jan 21, 2010 1:03 PM EST reply actions
disagree there
I specifically left out the incident with the kid in Orlando because I think he was completely innocent on that one
just a spoiled rich kid and his overreacting dad
"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers" Henry V
My initial reaction was "truth hurts"
My reaction now that I’ve had time to think is unchanged.
Davis has had a disconnected affect for a while now. Like he’s being forced to do something he doesn’t want to do. Like he’s angry about something. Here’s a theory: the kid didn’t make his contractual weight goals and is making less than he thought he would as a result. So he’s angry… at the team, at the universe… and feels disconnected. When the fan yelled “fat boy” at him, it of course rang that very sensitive bell in his head, and he went off.
This relatively small incident is probably the tip of a bad iceberg floating in the no-quite-fully-cooked soup of Baby’s brain.
Another point: If Perk, Sheed and Baby are so overemotional (as somebody said), where is all this emotion in their game? Why are they sleepwalking through 3rd quarters?
Thank you, Jeff.
You are one of the most positive people on this blog and I appreciate it. However, a time comes when calling them like you see them has its place and this is one of them. It reminds me of Antoine Walker standing around arguing with refs while the rest of the team was already involved in the next play. Davis just has to let go of his baggage and play the game the way he can and stop thinking about what should be or might have been. Play in the present, and play hard and the rest will take care of itself. I really does not look like he is (present tense) putting out the effort on a consistent basis. If someone saying this is affecting him negatively, he is paying attention to the wrong things. He should be so busy getting into shape and learning sets that he has no idea what is being said about him. He has had the time off (while he was injured), now work!
by thirstyboots18 on Jan 21, 2010 2:20 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Man, David Stern runs a tight ship. I can’t even find what the heck he said anywhere on the internet, and they’ve embargoed the League Pass Broadband archive so that the game has “technical difficulties.” I just want the amusement of reading what the heck he said.
If you have it recorded
It’s at 8:44 of Q2. Rhymes with truck by trick :)
Does anyone remember Perk getting attacked by his bed?
Noone called him stupid for that.
Funny
I don’t remember people saying he was particularly billiant, either. But, brilliant or not, Perkins always puts out the effort. And (except for the refs) he doesn’t whine or try to pass the blame.
I do think, though, that the arguing with the refs is getting a bit much because now they target him, even when it is quite obvious he has not said, or done, anything wrong. He has drawn attention to himself in the wrong way.
by thirstyboots18 on Jan 21, 2010 4:37 PM EST up reply actions
buying a ticket doesn't give you the right to verbally abuse an athlete
I didn’t hear what baby said but I’m ok with him sticking up for himself and I do think it’s f’d up that people think just because they buy a ticket to a sporting event they can name call. My issue with Glen goes back to the stupid act before the season that has essentially cost him the season so far and may wind up costing the celts a chance at another title. That and his current poor play are what’s on my radar right now as far as Glen Davis goes.
Baby is a competitor
One thing I like about Big Baby is that he’s a competitor. And you can tell that he hates to lose. I recognize his immaturity problems.
I recognize Sheed’s too. They are both frustrated. Sometimes, displaying emotion in tough times is an antidote to losing. I’m just concerned that these emotions are only compounding the problems and causing the Celtics to play even more brain dead in the second halves of games like they’ve been playing.
TPD 4 3333333
by TradeProposalDude on Jan 21, 2010 5:32 PM EST reply actions
I have been a Davis supporter
and I have no problem with what Jeff wrote here.
If the phrase used by Davis is what I have been led to believe it is, -then it is, in the very least, unprofessional. It is wrong in a number of ways and for a number of reasons.
You can raise the argument of what should be allowed to be said to players. My standards might be tighter than someone else’s. But the arena should be family friendly from both perspectives.
In a perfect world, before Davis over reacted, he should have let security do its work. At least, that is the way I see it.
More important, what will be allowed and what will Davis be willing to ignor going forward?
I forgot about that
Thanks for reminding. There were KIDS in that arena. Nice, Baby… real nice. Moron.




































