Let's See How Far We've Come...Or Not
by Greg Payne on Mar 11, 2010 2:32 PM EST
in Boston Celtics Articles
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PrintExactly two weeks have passed since the Celtics collapsed in the second half at home against the Cleveland Cavaliers on February 25. Unfortunately for the C's - with the glaring loss to the Memphis Grizzlies last night still clear in our minds - they have not seemed to improve at all since that loss to the Cavs. Unfortunately, that same lackluster and uninspired play that defined that second half against Cleveland has been present in nearly every game since then, with the possible exception being the March 3 win against the Charlotte Bobcats.
He found himself uttering that all too familiar 'we need to play 48 minutes' tune that he and his teammates have been talking about oh, all season."I know you guys are tired of writing it in your columns; I apologize for that," Garnett said. "At some point there has to be some action."
"I'm not going to sit up here and give a bunch of excuses, that's not my style," said Garnett. "You lose, you lose. They kicked our [butts] tonight. Period. Point blank. Players have to do more, including myself, we all have to dig deep and see what we're made of as a team. Seriously.""We're a team that takes a lot of pride in getting stops, we have to get back to that. Hearing it is starting to make my ears ring, but that's what it is, and we will, we have no choice."
"It's not about coming in here and talking to (the media) about it. It's about actually going out there and doing it.""You've got to come out here and put an effort out that's worthy. That's just what it is. I'm not going to come out and give a whole bunch of excuses about it. It's about not talking and doing."
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This is not a good team. They are a middle of the pack older team that can’t keep up when a young team comes to play. Rondo is now their best player, yet he is surrounded by a roster that is not geared to his abilities. That is why the offense can look out of whack for long stretches. Rasheed Wallace’s attitude of “we will be fine when the games count,” that he brought with him from detroit has infected this team. That attitide has replaced the desire, the fire, that this team showed last year as they fought to 60 wins and game 7 against orlando even without KG. Instead, this team piles up bad loss after bad loss, without getting angry, without changing, without doing anything. What is shocking is how quick it happened – how quickly this team turned from a team that always played hard, that always fought, to suddenly, they are content to roll over. wait for the playoffs because in their warped minds, things will be fine then. well, at least we see it coming. it is going to be quite a shock for the players when there season ends in the first round, because right now, they are not a very good basketball team.
why wait?
Greg,
Why wait another 3 weeks to determine if there’s a problem? Why not decide now? What’s magical about another 3 week mark?
Not looking to cause an argument or debate. Just trying to understand why you picked 3 weeks.
Oh no
There’s definitely a problem now, slamtheking…You’re right…I’m just saying if three weeks from now we’re still talking about these same issues, we’ll be in some serious trouble, you know?
But Greg
Didn’t we all say this a few weeks back? And then before that a few weeks earlier?
We’ve been giving this team time excuses since December. The one thing I do know for a fact is this team cannot turn it on when they want to. They are a mess.
And what’s got me more confused is that if they win a couple games in a row, most of the fans here will think everything is alright.
These guys are not playing smart basketball. They are making stupid mistakes continually which tells me this is mainly mental. I know Tommy said the opposite, but when guys are not playing defense, and no one is attacking the basket when shots aren’t falling, and people aren’t running up and down the court, then that is attitude. I’d rather watch the 2006/07 team than this one.
Yeah
That’s what I tried to convey with the various quotes…We’ve been talking about the same issues for weeks and weeks now…And since it doesn’t seem like we’ve improved at all over the past two weeks (and even before that), with the playoffs continuing to creep up on us, if two weeks from now we’re still talking about all of this, we could be in trouble heading into the post season.
and to nitpick some...
shoud read: “even the LATEST bird gets the worm sometimes.” Or maybe in the C’s case: “even the LAZIEST bird gets the worm sometimes.”
by milt palacio's shot on Mar 11, 2010 3:18 PM EST reply actions
as the season comes to an end
so will the misery of us fans thinking we have / had an contender.
I hope they prove me wrong but this team is getting older & worse each and every day. funny thing is i wanted a blow out so finley could play the 4th …well i got my wish.
but more seriously
The Celtics’ offense, which is to say Doc’s offense is terrible. Maybe it fit the team 3 years ago but it is broken now. You’ve got Perk at the top of the key forcing passes to Pierce or KG as they post up too far away from the basket. You’ve got Rondo waiting at the top of the key for Ray Allen to go through picks and that is the only thing happening – Ray is the only guy moving and everyone knows where the ball is headed. Or else you’ve got Rondo dumping the ball of and lazily running through, a threat to nobody.
It’s like the players can’t think of anything else than the set plays where they isolate a player and take a bad shot. Ball hits the rim? EVERYONE turns and runs on defense. Well the C’s aren’t losing games because of fast break points so why not let 2 guys crash the boards every time? There’s no creativity to the offense. The only guy who is a threat is the guy who has the ball (and maybe Ray if he’s cutting). How easy on the defense is that?
by milt palacio's shot on Mar 11, 2010 3:23 PM EST reply actions
How much is system, and how much is how the players are executing the system? I mean, the C’s offense has looked brilliant at times under Doc Rivers, when guys are moving without the ball and the ball’s zipping from player to player. Too often now, it’s very Rondo-centric, you don’t see the same movement, it seems stagnant. Rondo racks up the assists, but the offense is… meh. Kinda like how Starbury used to rack up huge assist numbers by dominating the ball.
So, is the “system” messed up, or are players being lazy/selfish?
How much of it would be
that the league has adjusted to our defense that we’ve been using for soooo long now and that is why we’re not as dominant as 07-08 season where we shocked the league with out stifling D?
And like Milt said, the offensive plays we had yrs ago doesn’t work with the team we have now? It’s gotten old. Maybe Doc needs to change it up a bit?
AND It IS frustrating when a player shoots, ball hits the rim, and instead of trying to get an offensive rebound, they run over back onto D. Why do they do that?
Me? I'm just a girl who loves the Celtics...
Doesn't seem likely that "the league has adjusted to our defense"
Our team defensive efficiency (points scored per possession) is still tops in the NBA at a miserly 1.021 pts per possession.
The problem is that our offensive efficiency is not very impressive. At 1.067 pts per possession, its 16th in the NBA.
So if they’ve adjusted – its to the offense, not the defense.
My thoughts are more inclined to what theBird is saying – its simple execution. We commit a lot more turnovers per possession than most ‘elite’ teams. And when you break them down, you find that an inordinate portion of them are offensive fouls such as moving picks, traveling, lane violations and shot clock violations. These aren’t so much being ‘figured out’ by our opponents. These are just lousy execution.
And the same poor execution shows up elsewhere such as improper shifts and poor timing of when to set/release a pick, when to slash and look for a pass, etc. etc.
Part of this can probably be blamed on unstable rotations. We’ve only played – what? Four games or so all year with the final rotation? Having the same guys working in the stable 5-man units does help a ton. But I don’t think that covers all of the problem.
I don’t want to single out individuals, but the “problem lapses” have most always occurred when the starting 5 are on the floor. Yes, the bench has been outplayed sometimes. But they have not been responsible for the wholesale 12-minute collapses that have been killing us. It is in the starting 5. And it has occurred out of the blue and inexplicably even in games where just minutes before the same players have looked dominant. This clearly makes it a mental, concentration issue.
The ball needs to move more on offense. Guys have to set solid picks without happy feet. They need to take high percentage shots. And when they miss, they need to get their butts back on defense.
Why is this so hard?
What is stopping them from playing with effort? I know they are an older team, but even against teams that are not that much athletic, they play so lackluster as if they don’t even want to be there. I hate Sheed’s “we’re waiting for the playoffs” talk, because its just an excuse. This is ridiculous, and can’t continue anymore. I wish I can say there would be a sudden fire lit up their butts to make them go on some 16-3 record for the finals games, but I don’t know.
We can blame it on old age, and injuries, but old age and injuries doesn’t cause lack of effort and determination to win games. If I was a first time NBA fan, who never heard of the Celtics and watched them play for the past month, I would have said they were a team who didn’t want to be at any of the games they played. Seriously. All this talk is pointless, they’re just repeating the same but with different words like Greg said.
Go out and play with some effort and heart!
Me? I'm just a girl who loves the Celtics...
Attitude
bigperm33 at the top of the comments nails it—the “it” being the mental aspect of this team’s decline. Blame it on ‘Sheed, blame it on two years of fatigue from being so mentally tough through a championship and a long playoff run without KG, or blame it on age and injuries, but whatever the cause, this team has lost its mental edge. Once they discovered that teams didn’t fear them anymore, and could beat them by simply playing harder and smarter, they lost the confidence, lost the swagger that they once had, and in the process, lost that anger that come with losing.
Shocking loss? Terrible performance? We’re seeing a lot of it lately, but the anger that should go along with it is NOT in evidence. They almost look resigned at this point. That’s the most glaring thing about their recent poor play and record—they don’t look like they have the mental toughness to challenge themselves and one another to change it.
by McHaleinthepost on Mar 11, 2010 3:59 PM EST reply actions
it's a marathon
there are 82 games
they’re 17 games above .500
all these debbie downers and pessimists are just that -
yes, they have issues – sure, they might not win the title this season, but they’re certainly a contender -
i prefer to sit back, watch and hope for the best rather than come on here and complain and cry boo-hoo cuz they lost by 20 last night -
tomorrow is another day, and my favorite team will take the floor again -
sure, they’re old(er), but this squad has TOO much experience to simply fold up and go home -
i still believe, but if the % of posters on this day have anything to say about it, they’re going to lose 70% of the rest of their games, grab the 7th or 8th spot, and get whacked by Orlando -
CHEER UP everyone!
Don't fake the funk on a nasty dunk
but why cheer up if you just forked over $200 to see the team mail it in during the first quarter?
at least the 24-58 Celtics weren’t accused of not caring enough.
by milt palacio's shot on Mar 11, 2010 8:23 PM EST up reply actions
that's the risk you take when buying a ticket - sorry you had a bad time
i’d never fork over $200 to see them play -
Don't fake the funk on a nasty dunk
I believe you can do interesting things with the line up of players we have
I am however very leery of doc rivers ability to make adjustments, and be creative. While some players are underwhelming, I totally believe with the right coaching this team can be waaaay better.
malcontents....the lot of you
by dasandruler on Mar 12, 2010 11:32 AM EST up reply actions
All the effort in the world won't make up for a half speed Paul Pierce.
if he’s still playing in slow motion come playoff time, we don’t stand much of a chance no matter how well we rotate on D and rebound.
paul pierce being the truth is a game changer....I totally agree
malcontents....the lot of you
by dasandruler on Mar 12, 2010 11:36 AM EST up reply actions
Ainge's player decisions since the championship have been bad
1) Letting James Posey go. What I wouldn’t give to have him coming off the bench now. I watched the recent Spurs-Hornets game and there was Posey in crunch time taking two charges, hitting a couple threes and playing strong defense.
2) Signing an obviously finished Stephon Marbury and Mikki Moore, who every big in the league pushes around, to help for the playoff push last year.
3) Bringing in an obviously disinterested Rasheed Wallace this year.
4) Bringing in Marquis Daniels (who, remember, was supposed to be the back-up point guard) when this team needs someone to make an outside shot.
5) Letting Leon Powe go in favor of Big Baby, who has hit I think one, maybe two shots outside of layups all year. Leon would be a great energy guy on the second unit now, someone who can score down low, draw fouls and rebounds.
6) Not buying a draft pick in the first round when there were a couple for sale.
7) The Nate Robinson trade. He can’t guard anybody, isn’t really a point guard, and is terminally inconsistent. Keeping Eddie House would have been smarter.
8) Not trading Ray Allen for some help, then bringing him back like Ilgauskas with the Cavs. It is hard to believe they could not have gotten something worthwhile for Allen’s huge expiring salary.
9) Not allowing Bill Walker to get some time. It’s not like the veterans on the team aren’t throwing the ball away and making rotation mistakes at an alarming rate.
10) Not replacing Doc Rivers as coach when it is obvious he has lost the team.
1. More often than not, the decision to let Pose walk has looked good. Having Pose today wouldn’t help the issue of being old and unathletic.
2. Neither Marbury or Mikki really hurt our chances last year; they didn’t bring us over the top, but guys you sign at that point in the season rarely help much. Had we been able to bring in Joe Smith instead of Mikki, we still weren’t getting by Orlando, not without KG.
3. Rasheed… I loved the signing, but yeah, makes me feel like an idiot now. Thought he just needed a chance of scenery.
4. Daniels has been fine. Wouldn’t be an issue had Eddie House not gone stone-cold all season; they were a pretty good combo when Eddie’s shot was falling.
5. Agree; I miss Leon, lapsed assignments on D and everything. At least we’d get a few more rebounds and have a low-post game.
6. Yup, although if it was just to get another JR Gidden/Billy Walker type, not much value. All depends on who you pick.
7. Too early to tell on Nate; at least he looks like he enjoys playing basketball
8. Seems like the desire for Ray’s contract wasn’t as great as we wanted, Sac-town got a good young player in Landry for Kevin Martin, not sure they would have rather dealt with us (assuming we would have took Nooch). If that deal would have worked for them, then absolutely – should have traded Ray. Ray’s not the reason we suck right now, though.
9. Meh. Walker didn’t look that great in summer league or preseason or when he was on the court; a few good scoring games in Knicks losses doens’t prove anything.
10. We’ll see. I like Doc, but maybe it is time for a swap. Bird may be right; coaches not named “Sloan” or “Pops” seem to have a three-year expiration date.
oh come on
Not signing Pose was the right move. He is getting paid way too much money for what he’s doing on the floor. He would NOT be the answer to this team’s issues.
Rasheed was and is a great addition. I"m sorry that too many folks on this blog just don’t have a clue as to how valuable he has been to this team. He’s especially been able to up his game with KG back because now he only comes in at PF against second string PFs and otherwise subs for Perk at C more – which has kept him in the post more.
Daniels has been fine. ’Can’t blame him for the thumb injury that kept him out so long.
Leon Powe has played 5 games for a total of 52 minutes this entire freakin’ season! Can people just give that a rest? Ainge made the only possible choice there by signing BBD instead of Powe. It is just silly to even argue over that.
Its still too early to judge Nate. But our season certainly never has and shouldn’t hinge on the play of the backup PG who only gets 12 minutes per game or so.
It takes two to make a trade. No one was going to give adequate value in return for Ray. Many of us knew that well in advance of the trade deadline and weren’t surprised when he was kept.
Its still too early to judge Walker.
Your comment on Doc is just not worth bothering with.
they need a blowout of their own.
really not sure if this team can blowout anyone
maybe tomorrow vs Pacers.
can’t help but get the feeling that the majority of the team
just don’t feel like playing basketball.
that includes the “young” guys like Perk and Rondo.
it's been TWO WEEKS
since they played the Cavs, on 2/25
.
three weeks ago, they were
WINNING at SACRAMENTO
WINNING at LAKERS
WINNING at PORTLAND
Don't fake the funk on a nasty dunk
I had my dates screwed up
Read the wrong game on the schedule. My bad. I made the adjustments. And I wouldn’t label this site as a pity party…It’s just that, in light of recent events, what exactly can we brag about that’s been positive, you know? I mean, I would love to write something about how the C’s have been playing awesome lately, but how can I? Part of our job here is to report what’s happening. I write when things are going well, and when they’re not so well. We really can’t ignore it when things aren’t going well though, you know?
how 'bout the 4 game win streak
march 2, 3, 5 & 7 when everyone was slobbering all over ray allen – fairweather isn’t my style – hang in during good & bad – endure an 18-game losing streak – stick with – makes things like a banner 17 that much more enjoyable
Don't fake the funk on a nasty dunk
Well yeah
Ray was playing well, why wouldn’t we give him his due then? And look right now…He hasn’t been getting shots lately…Yet we’re not jumping all over him…We recognize that the C’s need better ball movement as a team so that he gets more shots…When we criticize, we tend to do it fairly and rightfully.
This isn’t a “give up” post…I specifically write: Optimism is typically a good thing, and believe it or not, in the wake of everything, I still have plenty of it.
All I did in this post was acknowledge that the Celtics, as a unit, did not seem to improve over the past 2 weeks.
when i say pity party -
i meant the posters – mostly, and jeff – it seems has become a negative nancy – even master po pointed that out
.
everyone has a right to their opinions, it’s just a fairweather rollercoaster on this site it seems -
.
your article was good -
Don't fake the funk on a nasty dunk
Some people
Have definitely steered towards the negative side of late, I agree with you there. I’m not sold on Jeff, though, and I’m not just saying that because he runs the site…I just honestly haven’t seen him say anything like, “It’s over.” “Blow it up.” “The Celtics suck.” Etc. I really haven’t.
I don't wanna budge in really,
but I don’t feel as if the mood of this blog is of fair weather fans. Yes, there may be some who don’t come here at all when the C’s win, yet come here everyday and point out all the wrong things.
But I know for me personally, its not a pity party, but merely fans who really really care about this team, and seeing how bad they are playing really hurts, and so we try to find and pinpoint everything that can be causing this lack of effort in the games. Talking about it and being able to discuss the problems, (though its not like Doc or Ainge is going to stumble on this and read our comments) helps us to hope that things WILL change somehow, soon.
We’re not trying to make it a pity party, but its kinda hard to talk about the good stuff when there is none, and almost for a looong time now.
Me? I'm just a girl who loves the Celtics...
Exactly
“But I know for me personally, its not a pity party, but merely fans who really really care about this team, and seeing how bad they are playing really hurts”
Thanks you for getting that out there.
Why is it negative to point out the facts?
Do you even watch this team play?
6 in a row from previous thread -
celtics suck
we need to move the ball more as soon as it gets tp pierce the ball stops moving and he try take over he sucks lets give the ball to allen or garnett
by FranciscoO on Mar 11, 2010 11:01 AM EST reply 0 recs
pierce needs to go
trade pierce at the end of the season an sign david lee at least he rebounds
by FranciscoO on Mar 11, 2010 11:03 AM EST reply 0 recs
they needed some spark off the bench to get the starters ass’es in gear.
oh yea, we let that spark go.. Cough cough eddie house, leon powe ** cough cough(((
by tmyvon on Mar 11, 2010 11:12 AM EST reply 0 recs
Plain and simple they are just not that good anymore.
They need to just admit to themselves. This thing is over. 3 year window shut.
Time to blow it up. Thanks for the magical season of 2007.
by Steal by Bird on Mar 11, 2010 11:21 AM EST reply 0 recs
Sadly, I agree.
by bigjohnson34st on Mar 11, 2010 11:50 AM EST up reply 0 recs
I agree too
Don't fake the funk on a nasty dunk
missed one, the 7th
i say it again and again
FIRE DOC RIVERS he sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by celtsfan1 on Mar 11, 2010 8:41 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Don't fake the funk on a nasty dunk
I agree with you mcpu40
that those types of posts are what you would call posts from possible fair weather fans. The ones that mention, “Celtics suck” or “Just blow up the team” “Fire Doc” “They’re gone” etc… posts like that are the pity party ones that for me when I read them, makes me sad because I like the feeling of having fans around me who will stick around through thick and thin…
That is all I was trying to say, because Greg and Jeff, and the other real fans, really just want to talk about the problems in hopes that we can discover what it is. Not to say things like, “Celtics suck so bad! I give up!”
I think maybe next time it would be nicer to not give out the names? And just post the comments? Now they’re all out in public who said what… :(
Me? I'm just a girl who loves the Celtics...
Thanks, but none of those posts were mine
I usually try to throw a few facts in with most of my posts
What a revolting situtation this has turned out to be!!!
Any coach that has lost control of his team has to be fired. Every game Doc does something real dumb. If Danny wont fire Doc lets get rid of both of them.
Clearly, they sucked last night
And clearly, the fans are going to ABANDON them if they play that badly… and give up so easily.
But I don’t care what y’all will think or say – this was still a regular season game, and it still does not matter much at all, just like every other game now.
Yes, it was disgusting to see them give up. But look, the Griz were hitting EVERYTHING in sight. One guy heaved a prayer shot in Q1 from deep center court, and hit it off the glass. It just wasn’t the Cs’ night. They saw that, they recognized that… and yes, they gave up. I GUARANTEE they would not have given up if it had been a playoff game. See game 4, Finals 08.
So let’s just back off, shall we? Just wait for the playoffs. That’s when all excuses go out the window, and we’ll see what they’re made of. Until then, let’s not prepare too many nooses.
I don't know, KG said this after the game last night
“We’re not looking down to May and April right now. Right now we need to be taking care of March. And that’s the mindset.”
I mean, I would love to think that the playoffs are going to solve everything. I really do. But when KG and the other guys and Doc say things like that, I can’t help but believe they are trying to get better right now…And they just aren’t doing that. That’s what concerns me right now. You know?
They definitely are trying to get better now
And succeeding… only spottily. Here’s my point though: they GAVE UP last night. Pretty early. And then again, when their comeback efforts in Q3 were answered forcefully and effectively by the Griz. The worst thing about last night was the giving up – because otherwise, they’re allowed to lose games. It’s the giving up that would not happen in the playoffs, imo.
And then also, the level of effort to get better is likely to be maximized in the playoffs. Rondo, hopefully, will NOT be throwing those lazy bad passes, or failing to stay in front of his guy. And Perk would NOT just stand there and watch Young shoot the 3, he would jump. So while they’re trying now, they’ll try even harder then.
But the key point was about the giving up.
Let me give you another example, from the playoffs
Remember the Lakers in the 08 Finals, game 6. Blown out. Embarrassed. In a do-or-die FINALS playoff game, no less. Teams lose games. Teams get blown out, even in games that REALLY matter. So what? It happens. That, alone, does not make it noose time.
But you didn’t see Kobe giving up in that game 6. Not even when they were down 20+. Not until the 4th quarter, when it was truly hopeless.
No, it was the GIVING UP that was the problem last night, the only real problem. And THAT… is not going to happen in the playoffs.
The only issue
With mentioning the Game 4 comeback in ‘08…Is that three of the key guys who helped make that comeback happen…P.J. Brown, James Posey, and Eddie House…aren’t here anymore. P.J. had that great dunk to give us momentum going into the fourth, and obviously Posey and Eddie were teamed with Pierce, Garnett, and Allen down the stretch…I mean, Perk and Rondo virtually had no significant roles amidst that comeback, you know?
I completely get your point, I just don’t think we can use that ’08 example as a credible source for what this team can potentially do in the playoffs.
Nah... you're just in a bad mood :)
…which is certainly understandable in these circumstances. Most of us are.
Here’s what I mean: Yes, the 3 guys you mentioned were key to the game 4’s amazing comeback… but they were key PHYSICALLY, with their on-court contributions. That’s NOT what I’m talking about here, at all. I’m talking about the HEART of the team, the fire that won’t extinguish, won’t let them quit. THAT… has not changed, because it never belonged to the 3 guys you mentioned. It belonged, and still belongs, to KG, Paul, and Ray. They are still the heart of this team.
Rondo is young, and is subject to giving up, unfortunately. He did last night, big time. You could see it happening even in his body language, to say nothing of his play. And Rondo plays a huge role on this team, obviously. So he could ruin things… he alone could throw the team down the toilet, if he gives up.
I guess I’m saying I just don’t think even Rondo would ever give up in a playoff game, like he did last night. The Big 3 won’t let him. And historically, Rondo has stepped up in the playoffs… last year, for example, when he was the star of practically every game. Even in the last one, when they were finally eliminated by the Magic, he kept fighting and fighting, even as their 3s were raining down on them.
That’s why hope abides. That’s why we need to wait and see what happens in the playoffs. After all… bad as it was, last night’s game was still a regular season game, and still doesn’t mean much in the grand scheme of things.
Posey had heart
Please don’t say “heart” never belonged to James Posey or P.J. Brown or Eddie House. I understand that KG, PP, and Ray might have been the driving force at times…But if you want to talk about not quitting, you can’t not mention James Posey. I know his name is like forbidden here these days, but he was sooooooo important to that team. I don’t really want to get into a Posey argument…I’m just saying he definitely had heart.
Completely agree
I loved Posey, and his heart. Very, very sorry to see him go. He wanted a lot of $, and he got it…. so he did what he had to do. There’s more to life than basketball. But yes, for sure, he had a lot of heart. Didn’t own the TEAM’S heart, but he had it.
Personally
And this is strictly my interpretation of his role on that specific team…I always saw him, aside from KG, as the real heart of that team, or at least the glue, in some ways. I mean, you had to respect him because of his play and I think both his demeanor and production took an incredible amount of pressure off of KG, Paul, and Ray. It was never just The Big Three with Posey around. I always saw him, in terms of team leadership, as important as any one of the Big Three. Sure, he had championship experience, but he played that season as if it was his first go-around all over again. Again, strictly my interpretation.
I wouldn't argue that
Major glue, major heart. How about we agree that even in Posey’s absence, there’s enough heart left in this team to never give up in the playoffs.
He's "snakebit" as they say
Just a little off his shooting, clearly not healthy yet.
He’s been a key to this .500 portion of the season, due to health IMO
by nba is the worst on Mar 11, 2010 8:05 PM EST up reply actions
i'm old/47
much older than the C’s… i think they are trying but it’s very hard to hold back mother nature…
there are days i feel high on energy but day i can’t move move the way i use to…
on a much higher level these athlete go through the same thing we all do as we age… some day we got it and some days not.
the young guys make our team look old… the CAVS were not beating us until shaq went down..
so we are still though against the old warriors but stopping the youth is not exactly our forte.
DOC should have play the likes of billy (now a knick) even if we were to loose a few so the current team would be a a combo of old & young…like 08.
now all we are is old and unless DOC starts giving his players viagra i don,t see PP, KG Wallace looking sharp on a consitent basis.
such is life when age catches up with you.
but i'm / 49
I agree that age plays is one of the major reason of the team’s recent noticeable decline. But I also feel the team has lost the mental toughness. Some of them really don’t take games seriously anymore.
by getthat18now on Mar 12, 2010 2:51 AM EST up reply actions
Find me a team that has played this badly in the second half of the season
and won the championship? There may be one or two — I know, the 69 Celtics, blah blah blah. But please list all of the teams that have had records since January as bad as the Celtics have this year that then went on to win the championship. There is some value to looking at history and using it as a lesson/guide to the future.
How about a team that played that badly in a Finals game?
…And still won the championship. Would that do?
If yes, then remember the Celtics in game 4, 08 Finals. Played so badly in the first half, they were down 24 to the Lakers. And they won the championship.
The end is not written yet. They will not give up, like they did last night, in a playoff game. For the rest, see my notes just above.
That has nothing to do with my question
And I noticed there are no answers, which likely means that no team has played as poorly as this team has played in the second half of an NBA season and won the championship. Can it happen, of course. Is it likely, absolutely not.
"no answers, which likely means" ???
It means none of us think digging through the history to answer your question is worth the effort. You are welcome to dig yourself.
Personally, I think its irrelevant.
Basketball is a game of runs. Within games. Spanning multiple games. Hot. Cold. The key is to play hot more often than cold (so you get to the playoffs) and then to finish hot.
Irrelevant - "It's not over 'til it's over"
The chances are slim and none, there’s just too many better teams, but “that’s why they play the games” – and there’s still 18 or so more games for other potential situations to develop with the other teams.
by nba is the worst on Mar 11, 2010 8:10 PM EST up reply actions
Wow. I totally agree with you.
Who are you and what have you done with nba is the worst?
Pacers beat the Celtics early -
One of the 5 in 23-5…
by nba is the worst on Mar 11, 2010 8:11 PM EST up reply actions
What Are We Playing For
the season is over we don’t come to play night in and night out… it’s not doc’s fault we suck… let’s start biulding around rondo.. in notice it did not say perk he’s not a starter in this league must get more athletic make free throws and learn to finish in the post… let’s start over with rondo
I belive in rondo and his erratic play
but doc does not escape criticism. he’s the coach, he runs the show. he doesnt get a pass when he controls the product on the floor. players need effective management.
malcontents....the lot of you
by dasandruler on Mar 12, 2010 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
Celts need to salvage what they can this year
Problems lie mostly with the first unit. Cut the big 3 minutes the rest of the reg. season and make sure they have fresh legs for the playoffs. What starters need to do:
- Pierce- he has to get to the line. He went from 9-10+ free throws to less than 7. Make sure he isn’t dinged up. He needs to be option #1, not the kick out pass for Ray to shoot a 3. Isolate Pierce, run pick and rolls, etc.
- Ray is only 34% from 3 point land this year. He still needs his 8-10+ shots a game but we have to get better opportunities than praying the 3 ball goes in (right Sheed?). The past 2 years after the playoffs were over, Ray has confessed to playing injured in the playoffs. It can’t happen this year we don’t have the margin of error.
- Rondo- needs to get into the lane and create the contact getting the foul call. Yeah he hits the tear drop fairly effectively but I’d much rather him shoot 63% from the line, get the Celts into the bonus much earlier each quarter, and get the other bigs in foul trouble. Way too often Rondo beats his man and kicks it back out for a long 3 or shoots the running floater. Take the hit, get to the line, get the bonus, sit the bigs with 2 quick fouls.
-KG as well as all other starters are down in the rebounds. KG can take that outside shot because he’s so effective but he also needs to mix it up inside, crash the glass and get us some easy buckets. We get very little 2nd chances, that needs to change.
-Perk appears to be a little burnt out. Give him a game off or two off to recharge the batteries. Sheed, Baby, Williams can get his min. Perk needs to be a rejuvenated “beast”.
Pierce and Ray are playing 35-36 min. each, need to cut that way back down the stretch. Even KG is over 30 min. per game. Give the 2nd unit all the minutes they can handle. With Baby, Tony, Daniels missing much of the year, plus 2 new guys in Nate and Finley, these guys need all the playing time together they can get.
This is looking like the last hurrah- play it hard and play it smart. Last but not least, the offense has been in a crunch time funk for a long time. Even privately, bring in an offensive minded “assistant” to help Doc right the ship as much as possible.
This I think gives us the best opportunity. How far that can take us, who knows. Doing the same ole, same ole isn’t going to get it done.
by bostoncelts fan on Mar 11, 2010 6:43 PM EST reply actions
All very good suggestions.
I do think that getting the ball to Ray needs to be stepped up in priority. Even though his 3P% is down a bit, his overall FG% is way up. Especially over this last 2 months – he’s over 50% for both Feb and March. He’s hot and we need to do a better job of getting the ball in his hands.
Funny thing is, most of your suggestions aren’t really different from the ‘same ol, same ol’. They are the things that they are supposed to be doing and have done in the past when they have been successful.
fair enough, but I doubt the starters can stay fresh throughout a single playoff series not including Rondo. Hope I’m wrong but the writing on the wall suggests otherwise
by jurrasicearl on Mar 11, 2010 7:02 PM EST via mobile reply actions
they are a MEDIOCRE team right now, period.
what’s not clear to me is whether they’re underachieving, or they just don’t have it.
either way, there’s no consistency, and i just can’t see this celtics team beating a quality team 4 out of 7 games.
The END is near
If Celtics keep playing the same way then it’s see you next year ….
Mid Season Funk
The C’s seem lack any kind of hunger. If they’re up in a game, they ease up, and more often than not, see the lead (and win) slip away. You almost have to taunt them into trying to win, as the Wizards did the other night.
I don’t doubt they have enough talent to win it all again, but they haven’t shown any consistency since December. Sure, injuries have been a factor, but I actually thought last season’s team was more impressive in the face of KG’s injury. They had more pride and grit and toughed out more games.
This season’s team is playing like the late Shaq-era Lakers. Jaded, just waiting for the playoffs to start, thinking it will all come together once the money rounds start.
I do think they have it in them to turn things around. I guess we’ll see…
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