Starting Five - 3/15
by Jeff Clark on Mar 15, 2010 5:59 AM EDT
in News/Links
131 comments
Some depressing post-Cavs game links and quotes to start off your day. Enjoy, ...I guess.
Green Street " How close is that corner?
The Celtics have repeatedly mentioned "turning a corner" to get back on a winning track. But with 17 games left in the regular season, how far away is that corner? "I don’t know, maybe 17 blocks," Rajon Rondo guesstimated on Friday. "It should be the same zip code."
No getting around it: Celtics outclassed by Cavs again - ProBasketballTalk - Basketball - NBC Sports
The Celtics were outclassed again in Cleveland. They actually managed to tie the game with 5:00 to go in the third. Then the Cavs just... outclassed them. Outran, outworked, out-gunned, out-manned them. It's not that everything fell apart for the Celtics or that the effort wasn't there. There was a lot of effort. But whatever the Cavs needed to do, spread the floor, grab the offensive board, block down low, run the floor, run the floor, run the floor. The Celtics went 1-16 from the field during a 9:49 stretch between the 3rd and 4th quarters. 1 for 16. I don't know what the odds are for you getting hit by a bus tomorrow, but I'm pretty sure they're better than 1 for 16.
Lack of effort means trying times for Celtics - The Boston Globe
Yesterday, after the Celtics took their second loss to the Cavaliers in just three weeks, the dif ference between the teams wasn’t the monster-sized center Cleveland added in Shaquille O’Neal (at home nursing a surgically-repaired thumb), it wasn’t the shooting they added in Anthony Parker and Jamario Moon, and it wasn’t even James and his 30-point, 8-rebound, 7-assist performance. "The glaring difference,’’ said Boston’s Ray Allen, echoing everyone’s thoughts, "was just their effort.’’
These two Celtics must rescue Big Three - The Boston Globe
The Big Three are limited, and those limitations are glaring. If Pierce doesn’t score, how does he contribute? If Garnett isn’t grabbing rebounds or hitting jumpers, does he block shots or stop his power forward counterpart? What happens when Allen’s shot is misfiring, does he get steals or chase down a long rebound or distribute the ball? Those answers are no, no, and no.
Varejao’s a problem - BostonHerald.com
The Celtics [team stats] may be more anxious than Cleveland for the eventual return of Shaquille O’Neal and Zydrunas Ilgauskas to the Cavaliers lineup. The Cavs big man who really tears the C’s apart is Anderson Varejao, who for the second straight game had his way on back cuts and offensive rebounds, resulting in a 17-point, 10-rebound double-double that included six offensive boards in yesterday’s 104-93 Cleveland win.
Bonus link (this one really hurts):
Cavs’ Leon Powe back in a big way - BostonHerald.com
At the end of his time with the Celtics [team stats], Leon Powe was hurt. Yesterday, he hurt the Celtics. In just his seventh game back from major left knee surgery, the Cavaliers forward made his first appearance with 4:35 left in the third quarter. Over the next eight minutes, he collected six points (all from the free-throw line) and four rebounds.
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Lone Celtic highlight...
BBD plowing into Jamison at 3-pt. line
not too many things that can make me laugh when the C's are playing poorly
but that one sure did!
Why is it always a lack of effort?
They aren’t as good as the other teams anymore.
It’s over, can we move on. Time to rebuild.
Effort?
You guys are kidding right? Where did you see effort? Once or twice by BBD and a couple by Rondo. I didn’t see much else. How does Cleveland get 3 offensive rebounds on their own missed free throws. That is embarrassing. Or the fact that on another KG tried to face guard Verajao and was called for a foul, so they shot more free throws. BTW how many free throws did they shoot? 48!!!! That’s effort. Rather than moving their feet they just kept reaching and slapping. Or how about the time Varajoa rebounds the ball and just runs down the center of the court and they feed him for a layup. I guess that was more effort. How many times did we give solid help when Bron drove the lane – I can’t remember one time!!!! How many wide open 3 pter did Cleve shoot.
Think back, 2 years ago, it wasn’t that we were more talented than other teams. It was 2 things: We played as a team, call it ubuntu or whatever. The other thing, we outworked everyone. We didn’t givbe up uncontested shots or layups and we didn’t get destroyed every night on the boards. Defense and rebounding take effort. Often when we play good defense, we turn right around and the other team an offensive rebound ruining whatever defensive stand we made.
So When Did These Writers Actually Start Watching the Team?
What happened to the Celtics yesterday is old news. Time to move on and rebuild.
Nice game from Powe. So how much money did the Celtics save by not offering him a contract? But I guess it was important to keep a roster spot open for Scalabrine or Giddens.
What goes around, comes around.
agree on Powe
but the time to rebuild is after the season. Not much to be done now expect hope for the best.
What influence?
The guy just came back 7 games ago. The influence he would have is that Sheed would have played a lot more when KG was out.
Not to mention the guy is a walking liability with his surgeries in both of his knees.
And I’m still not sure Ainge didn’t want him back. He usually waits until the last minute to make a contract. He offered a deal to uno uno after other teams had made some interest in him. That’s simply his business tactic imo. Powe just didn’t wait enough. He got an offer from the Cavs and he immediately said yes after not getting an offer from the Cs.
Totally agree on Powe
Guys a class act and what a classless act on the Celtics front office and ownership to not bring him back.
add to that clueless....not forward thinking, cheap, and no loyalty.
malcontents....the lot of you
by dasandruler on Mar 15, 2010 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions
Um...
He was going to be injured through February… It was a smart move (signing Rasheed was the dumb one)
by funkstarrdeluxe on Mar 15, 2010 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions
rasheed is looking iffy
but powes contract was peanuts….pretend he’s bill walker or jr giddens and put em in purgatory until duty calls
malcontents....the lot of you
Thats Easy to Say
I think the biggest issue was roster spots. You can only have so many players -15. And with the injury to KG who knew what we’d get from him. If Danny had tied up 3 roster spots to 3 injured players he would have looked like a jerk – KG TA and Leon. Remember that KGs simple surgery was NOT simple. The minor spur was the size of a golf ball. It was very possible KG could have missed a month or 2 and maybe we’d be better off right now if he had, and spent that time completely rehabing his knee.
Everyone on this board was looking for Danny to sign a PF, SF and PG. And I think he tried, but you can’t sign them without a roster spot available, especially if you are way over the luxury tax. But he did sign Rashhed and Daniels. I think, the Daniels deal was the issue that cost us Powe as they tried to free up more $$$ for a multi year contract, and kept trying to work sign and trades that never worked out. As I remember they did finally offer him the same contract as Cleve but Powe took the Cleve deal because they offered ti first.
BTW, I wished Danny had signed Powe, but that’s wishful thinking on my part.
shame on Perk
for saying that the last two games against the cavs they didn’t really try hard enough.
Although they have proven to be a good team this season, if anyone told me at the beginning of the year that Oklahoma City and the Celtics would have the same record after 65 games, I would have laughed. Well, here we are after 65 games. At this point, I suggest we all sit back and just enjoy the ride, whatever that may be. If we expect the worst and something better happens, then all the better. If we expect the worse and it comes to pass, then we will not be disappointed. I cannot invest too much more emotion in the team after yesterday’s loss. So I am simply going to enjoy whatever I can from the rest of the season and hope they catch a spark somehow,
Amen
Can’t believe that stat! They’re still fun to watch on most nights.
"People don't understand, if you can't live the rest of your life off one year in the NBA, you can't live off 21." -- Keon Clark
OKC Thunder will be here in 2 weeks
It will bring back memories of the Grizzlies recent trip to Boston.
It ain't over
It’s just about to begin folks. The C’s didn’t play all that well and were still in the game. All these debbie downers around here (and the nation). The C’s didn’t get any love going to the rim, Cavs got all the love and the free throws reflected that (+18 in attempts, +8 in pts). Not to mention the extra point they got on the Mo 3 that was actually a 2 and the video replay showed that, for some reason the refs decided to gift them that point. The AV rebound when he was clearly out of bounds that lead to an open jumper (another +2). That’s the game right there. Not to mention the AV flops that the refs absolutely ate up, that guy is a flop machine. I wish somebody on the C’s would give him a real reason to flop. How many times does he tie a guy up with his arms and then when the guy tries to break free he throws his arms up to get a foul? happened at least 4-5 times in the game last night, got KG in foul trouble and it save a couple possesions for the cavs. Hats off to AV for being a flopper.
It was a poorly reffed game, especially down under where the Cav’s got everything handed to them. Let us not forget the goal tending non-call when LBJ ‘blocked’ PP’s shot at the rim. His freakin forearm hit the rim as he was blocking the shot, wouldn’t it then mean that a portion of the ball was above the cylinder since he hit the back side of the ball (relative to the motion direction)? Not to mention the bump he layed on PP during the drive to slow him down enough to get back in the play. If that was LBJ driving it’s a 3 point play, for the C’s it was a turn over. Most of the game went that way and they only lost by 11.
The world aint over and neither are the 2010 Boston Celtics!
You guys have got to stop blaming the refs and everything else under the sun
The team is just not good enough to win it all.
I really hope you're right
that it’s just about to begin. I’ve been waiting for it to begin again since about Game 30. The refs did not cost us this game though. The Cavs were just better yesterday. I watched that Mo 3 as many times as they showed the replay, and I never could tell if it was a 2 or a 3. That was a real close call. As for LeBron’s block, I also thought foul and then goaltending, but again I say the refs did not cost us this game!
The didn't cost us the game
but they gave momentum to the Cavs. That’s a game changer either way. The only way we’d know if they cost us the game is if we could get the delorean up to 88mph.
I think it's fair to blame the refs
for the botched replay of MW’s 3 which was actually a 2. You could clearly see his toe on the line. The botched AV rebound when he was out of bounds. Those are easy calls a highschool ref could call. Hell, the entire C’s bench saw AV out of bounds, how do they miss that? They have responsiblity to make calls and they didn’t. I can see them excaping blame on foul calls, those are ‘judgement calls’ but out of bounds and replays that are within the rules they have no business screwing up but they managed to do just that.
That won't be written
until the playoffs. Nothing it written unless I write it…
THANK YOU Vinnee
I hear everything fromt he rims were not kind, to the Refs, and AJ and his flopping. Those are excuses!!!!!! How do you continue to get beaten game after game on the boards. they know they have to rebound and still don’t. Is that the refs too!!! It’s called EFFORT. That is what’s wrong with this team.
For some reason, they don’t have the energy that they did when there were 20-5 or whatever. Check the numbers, they weren’t getting killed ont he boards. As for the offensive rebounds, I don’t have a big issue with that. They shoot a high percentage and they forego the offensive rebounds to get back on D. But they giving up 15 and more (17 Sunday) is purely a lack of effort. Put a body on someone and then go get the ball. Heck, Cleve got 3 offensive rebound off missed free throws, and they were Shaq bricks either. How many time this year have we stood around and watched not 1 Celtics go after a rebound. Milw the ball hit the floor between 3 Celt and 1 Buck with 50 second left and who got the ball the Buck. I watch that sky walker Matt Barnwes out jump 3 Celts for a board and put back – not 1 Celt jumped or went for the ball. This has happend all year!!!!!!!!!
I agree, IowaGuy
I was wondering if anyone was going to bring this up. Very good post.
And regardless of whether we win the championship or not, I still enjoy watching my team each and every game.
It’s over. Stop rationalizing, justifying, and excusing. That is just plain delusional.
by Celtico on Mar 15, 2010 12:19 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
just as delusional
as saying its over with 17 games left and not a single playoff game played. All sorts of things can happen in 17 games, that’s why they play the games afterall.
If the Celtics play consistent basketball in the playoffs
It will pretty much be the first time all year. It’s like the lot of you are pretending that none of these losses are happening or something. Amazing.
Celtico
My brain agrees with you, but my heart wants to see them come out with some fight and real effort. I still believe that the real problem is just a lack of effort. Yes KG is not completely healthy but most of the team is now. They need to decide if they are going to dig deep and fight. I remember Rudy T in Houston saying “Don’t ever under estimate the heart of a champion”. Unfortunately, it’s been a long time since I’ve seen that heart displayed by this team.
Please
Sorry but we didn’t show up and play. That’s the bottom line. They kicked out BUTT. I saw some bad calls (actually both ways), but the refs didn’t cost us the game. The fact that Cleve shot 48 free throws tells me that we don’t defend our rim. Perhaps we should knock some people down rather than allowing people to treat the lane like the Yellow Brick Road in the Wizard of Oz.
I wholeheartedly agree with you on AV, someone needs to run over him like freight train. We need to be physical with him first and get him to retaliate. Proably 90% of the time the guy that retaliates gets the call. That is not some earth shattering development.
Unfortunately, until we play with passion and REAL effort don’t expect any great results. I want them to win as much as anyone and have for more than 50 years, but this team just doesn’t play hard anymore.
defense
is it time to switch up the defense that Thibs runs? this rotating help d that they run is not as affective as it was. teams have seen it for almost 3 seasons now so they can plan accordingly, and the key to it all (KG) is still not 100%. that’s why we get killed on the boards every nite, guys are constantly rotating to help, so quick bigs like Hickson & Varejao crash, and nobady is there to box them out.
good point
evrock. Thibs deserves a lot of blame for the defense of late. I don’t understand why they changed the way they were defending LeBron in the second half yesterday. Completely idiotic. You want to make LeBron facilitate for those other guys. I’d rather have Jamison taking 22-footers than LeBron driving into the lane. In the first half, the defense encouraged the former, in the second half the latter. Stupid.
How discouraging
Playing the team with the best record in the NBA, and we still have to read quotes about the lack of effort. I think these quotes have sealed my decision to not spend $7,000 for the playoffs and season tickets for next year. These guys do not deserve my hard-earned money.
Glad to see Powe on the court and doing well
He deserves it……..
Hate LeBron
Hate Sheed (3 years???? – OMG no)
Hate Danny Ainge
I have to admit …..we got old and we got old quick…….quicker than I thought possible
I still have hope (always do) I still am not giving up …….but I am beginning to wonder if the Switch we are going to finally turn on is an energy light switch or the oxygen tent switch near our nursing home beds…..
Keep the faith….
Is it Soup Yet?
is that scal in there?
classic post & pic – good stuff cheap.
i’ll give up on the c’s this season when they’re oficially eliminated
.
Don't fake the funk on a nasty dunk
Who taught Po to photoshop, again?
The Big Three showed their sense of “team” by getting old in tandem.
"People don't understand, if you can't live the rest of your life off one year in the NBA, you can't live off 21." -- Keon Clark
Room for two more?
I think the Miniscule 3 should all be in there. Maybe with Nurse Rivers!
by Celtico on Mar 15, 2010 12:27 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Not depressed
No question the Cavs are playing better than the C’s right now, just like the C’s were playing better than the Cavs at the beginning of the season. There’s no reason the Celtics can’t reverse that equation between now and then. It doesn’t look likely now but “anything is possible” and the season isn’t over yet.
I have to agree with Brick’s sentiment on Leon though. The Celtics should have taken care of their own there. Good for Leon though. Looks like he landed right back in a winning situation.
the guy's had a history of injuries, right?
- and it took him forever to get back on the court
Don't fake the funk on a nasty dunk
it wouldn't have cost them much to keep him on
and he also had a history of helping embarrass the lakers in the playoffs.
yes it would have - it would have cost a roster spot
that they couldn’t afford.
It was never about the money with Leon. It was never about ‘not taking care of thier own’. It was about them needing a healthy big in that roster spot because they couldn’t afford not to have depth give KG’s knee.
And it proved to be critical because Baby ended up spending so much time on the sideline with his injury. If they had signed Powe, to fill take up another roster spot – they would have been screwed considering that Powe’s absence overlapped with absences by BBD, Daniels, KG, Pierce & Walker!
Gawd, I wish folks would remember how this really went down.
Yes, the JR Giddens Roster Spot Was Critical
To whom— Austin Ainge?
Then there is Scalabrine, who has mercifully been relegated to DNP-CD status.
right - i know
leon was fabulous – i’m just trying to, in retrospect, defend and understand danny’s decision to not keep leon -
Don't fake the funk on a nasty dunk
I dissagree
It was about a roster spot, and it paid off for the Celtics. Shelden helped out big time when Davis was out and KG was at 50%. If we had used that spot on Powe, that 23-5 start could have been 14-14 and we would be battling for the 8th seed right now.
One of my least favorite Celtics teams to watch
It’s like groundhog day with this team – pre-game confidence, moments of good play, second half collapse, post-game quotes of ‘boredom’, ‘disgust’ , ‘immediate change’ and ’we’re almost there’. Then, the next game day it’s the same exact thing. Cheers, 09-10 Celtics.
Yes, and the posts here about how they will snap out of in in the next few games are like Groundhog Day, too.
Many years ago I lived with a girl from Punxsutawney. She dumped me, but not before taking me to see Phil’s hole and the ground. That movie always makes me a little nostalgic, just like this year’s Celtics’ team takes me back to 1988.
This is the worst year ever to be a Celtic fan...
We can`t even root for a high draft pick!
The headline from AP in our paper today
said Cavs make Celtics look old. Uh, sorry, but I think that’s giving the Cavs far too much credit. We can look old all on our own no matter who we’re playing without any help at all from the Cavs.
Decline?
The three best Celtics yesterday, and over the last couple of weeks, were the three old guys, who have obviously declined but are still great players in this league. The problem is elsewhere: Perk, Rondo, Sheed, and Finley all suck, and Daniels is too inconsistent.
That’s why I don’t believe the crap line Brickowski and others peddle about the team being done. It’s the young guys who are letting the team down, along with Doc’s refusal to play his best guys off the bench (Davis and Robinson) for significant minutes. If we got even decent play out of the rest of the team, we’d still be contenders. Right now, we’re not.
Pierce was one of the best Celtics over the past couple of weeks?
Then boy-o-boy are they in trouble!
Pierce's problem
of late is that he’s not being aggressive enough offensively, which gives him the appearance of being uninvolved and slow. He’s trying really hard to set up his teammates, especially Perk, KG, and Ray. Given that Perk and Sheed are wastes of space, he should just never pass to them again. Ever.
But Ersatz is correct
Last fall, when Pierce was playing great, he was talking about 18 shots per game.
During Jan-Feb he dropped down to about 10 shots per game. Clearly not feeling healthy and comfortable with his shot.
Lately he has just started to pick it up, but even last night he only took 14. He did make 6, which is about average for him – but he could not get to the free throw line despite numerous layups and shots taken under contention. The lack of FTs was basically the difference between his 18 pts last night and a more typical ‘24-ish’ pt stat line.
I would take the number of shots that Pierce takes as a pretty good barometer for how well he is feeling. When he’s taking 18+ again, that will be a good sign.
Oh, and double Pierce's influence while taking away Perk's right now--
and the opposition would be averaging 120 points per game.
Rondo and Fin in the same boat with Perk and Sheed?
I don’t think so. Not even close.
different boat
Rondo’s not as bad as Sheed and Perk, but he’s seriously underperforming. And I don’t understand going away from Tony in favor of Finley; the latter provided energy and hustle and excellent defense.
Not much there to understand
that’s just how Doc rolls. I knew when we got Finley that TA’s minutes would be shot and we’d only see him in blowouts or end of quarter situations (which have proved to be Tony’s weakness). I agree though, we need more TA. He has a way of making things happen, for better or worse. Plus, you can always tell he’s going 100% (not that Finley isn’t, he’s been a pleasant surprise on offense). I just think we need TA’s hustle out there but I wouldn’t expect it with Doc running the show.
Because they have had only a couple of practice days
Doc made it clear he’d have to play Finley a lot just to see how he fits in.
So why doesn't the same strategy apply to Nate?
He played 8 minutes yesterday. That is ridiculous.
That was weird
It might have been because Nate screwed up on his D on Mo, leaving him wide open for a 3 from center. Doc pulled Nate right after that.
If I were Doc, I’d also be making sure Fin’s ready to go, or as ready as possible. He could end up being extremely useful in the playoffs.
Rondo...underperforming...
He has more than 30 double-doubles. How’s that underperforming? He’s the only starter who’s not or wasn’t disappointing at any given part of this season. What is it he didn’t do but he should have? Score triple-double every night?
Second question is simpler
Doc needs Fin to get acclimated post haste. No time to lose. TA’s ready already. In general, now is the time to GET THE TEAM READY FOR THE PLAYOFFS, not necessarily win games. So yeah, he’ll play Fin till he’s satisfied Fin’s ready. I like Finley, btw. Smart, excellent shooter, in great shape, big enough.
Rondo is probably not playing at his HIGHEST level right now. I’m good with that. It means he has one more gear to go to in the playoffs. Like he did last year, remember? He was awesome, game in game out. AVERAGED almost a triple-dub. Now that his FT% is SO much better than it was earlier in the season – he’s getting close to 80% – he might actually be successful taking over certain games, should the need arise.
Getting the team ready for the playoffs - getting the new guys ready?
DRJ1 – this is a good point and something that crossed my mind for a second yesterday. Compared to the opening night win at Cleveland, the bench seemed to have more playing time. And if memory serves, Doc’s rotations in our Cleveland win always had at least one starter on the floor at all times (could be wrong about this).
On Oct 27, the bench played a total of 66.9 minutes spread amongst 4 players (Sheed/Daniels/House/Williams). Yesterday the bench played at total of 70.1 minutes spread amongst 7 players (Sheed/Finley/Davis/Daniels/Robinson/Williams/TA). It’s possible that resting the starters and getting the new/injured guys back in the rotation was more important to Doc than winning the game.
Paul Pierce is a really good three-point shooter right now
That pretty much sums up his entire game, with an occasional drive to the basket. I have no problem with Pierce, but he is far from playing well.
Lack of effort?
when will that be set aside as an excuse like the injury one, the bored one etc. Let’s try this one on for size, The Cavs are just better. I watched the game and not once, even when it was tied for that brief moment, did it feel like the celts, even with a superhuman effort, could be the Cavs. it was FAR FAR FAR FAR too easy for the Cavs to repeatedly press the “ON” switch and respond.
I understand the “lack of effort” psychology as it suggests that with a nice pep talk and some Red Bull, maybe the title is around the corner, but that is folly. The other teams in the NBA have gotten BETTER and the celts have not. there are far too many teams that easily compete with the Celts this year.
by lakersbluedevil on Mar 15, 2010 11:01 AM EDT reply actions
lack of effort is the new punch line
like waiting for the playoffs…..play for 48 minutes……its a long season, we know what we gotta do. It sounds just as believable if it were indiana saying it. this team is a reflection of the coach, and that’s a scary as heck.
malcontents....the lot of you
by dasandruler on Mar 15, 2010 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions
I kind of believe the coach no longer believes and is just playing out the string,
so if he’s influencing the team that may not be good.
fts
And if the Cavaliers hadn’t missed a whopping 17 free throws, this one would have been a lot uglier, especially considering Cleveland was on top by 17 (89-72) with 7:16 to play.
by lakersbluedevil on Mar 15, 2010 11:05 AM EDT reply actions
those kinda 'what ifs' work both ways
if our bench hadn’t shot a truly miserable 5 for 25 from the field …
If the free throw disparity wasn’t so extreme (48 to 30) ….
Both teams took 80 shots from the field. We made 32. They made 33 – so aside from the free throw disparity, the difference in the game was one 3 pt shot that they made that we didn’t.
Yes, they beat us. But it wasn’t the *ss-wupping that some are making it out to be.
I still say...
…it is a mental problem. We have the tools to win. I can see it on their faces and the way they carry themselves. Go back and watch a game from their champion season then watch how they are this year. Watch how they are on the bench and when not in play (time outs, free throws, ect) It is just not the same at all. KG doesn’t seem to be the cheerleader when on the bench, some bench players pay not attention when Doc is talking, when they get behind you can read the disappointment on their face. 2 years ago they always believed they could win no matter how down they where (not this year) They are in the wrong mental state and are plagued with doubt. I’m sure all the injuries trigged the mental change. They were fine to start the season. The real problem with all this is you can’t “talk yourself” out of it. It is kind of like saying don’t think of the color green. The more you try to consciously push through a bad mental state the worse it becomes. I think they should bring in a NLP coach to help re-focus them as a team. IMO
we got the banner in year 1, and not year 3. perk talks the right game- haven’t seen him play it in a long time. doc- get the bench into their roles. the defense isn’t working maybe, play with that but it’s late. get shelden in for boards. get sheed to a fat farm.
Put sheed out to pasture
or just send him to the glue factory, he’s done. I’d rather see Sheldon get those minutes. what he lacks in talent & height he makes up with hussle…something sheed never has done (in green anyways).
That was one of the worst officiated games I’ve ever seen. It’s pretty clear the officiating in the NBA is biased. If someone can bet successfully 80% of the time based on officiating bias, that should tell you something – David Sternleone!
All year we’ve been screwed by a consistency unbalanced officiating. It’s every game… How many times have the refs taken a point away from us on 3 point shots this year? Was Mo’s foot clearly on the line? There was a succession of like 10 to 15 consecutive calls against us in the second quarter. You can’t even watch these games anymore. It ruins the flow of the game and it’s just not a fair call of the game anymore… we don’t pay to watch the officials decide games, but that’s what I keep watching over and over again in the NBA.
It was also the worst announced NBA game I’ve ever watched.
All time stupidest comment ever by announcer Mark Jackson: Maybe the Celtics should watch a film of Anderson Varejao….. Dude maybe the Cavs should watch films of all 17 Celtics championship teams.
Mark Jackson (no rings) and Jeff Van Gundy (no rings) talking about how great Lebron (no rings) and the Cavs (no rings) are….. I got news for the Cavs they ain’t gonna win a title this year either. The talent level on that team falls off a cliff after No Ring No King Lamebron. Can’t wait to watch him storm off the court again this year after he gets elimoed – no handshakes no interviews no class. Why is it that no one ever calls him on his lame unsportsman behavior.
Ask yourself… would Lamebron ever make the Bird steals the ball play against Detroit. No freakin way… his head would be down as he storms off the court in defeat…
Another brilliant statement from this crew. Lebron is the best non-point-guard passer of all time. Really, Lebron is better passer than Larry Bird?
Even mid 80’s Tom Heinsohn was never as much of homer as the ESPN and ABC announcing teams have become for Kobe and Lebron. It’s just sicking to watch. Almost too sickening to watch…
by David Henderson on Mar 15, 2010 12:11 PM EDT reply actions
Amen,
Sing it brother. That’s all too true. The" LeBron is the greatest to play the game " stuff is getting old and there just getting started. Larry Bird was a 3 time mvp of a league not watered down and not cleaned up for the kids. Larry took hard fouls every night, bumps on every shot, bumps and hacks on every rebound, with no fouls called. LeBron is protected on high. You can’t even compare the two. They don’t even count assists the same way they used to so that too is a squed stat.
agree but
Ref’s did not cost us that game….poorly officiated or not…..
but Breen, Jackson and Van Gundy are absolutely so Celtic biased it is sickening
Breen is nothing but a Knicks announcer – so that says something right there…love the part about “no rings” – hahahaha – true…
does Breen hold the record for kissing Lebron’s butt the most in a single game…my goodness it is so nauseating….
Lebron is a great player but I hate him – simple as that…
Is it Soup Yet?
Lebron is easily better than Bird. In fact, Magic himself was better than Bird, as were Jordan and Russell.
The announcers are insufferable when it comes to superstars and you might not like Lebron’s act. But he does more than Bird ever did and will also win a title or two (he’s certainly never had a surrounding cast equal to Bird’s).
by BouncingBuckeye on Mar 15, 2010 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions
easily better than Bird?
you may want to try actually watching some of Bird’s games and what he did for the team before making such bold comments. Also, try reading a book or two about Bird and Magic. Lebron’s got it easy with today’s rules, especially the way they are interpreted when it comes to him.
And 1
Lebron may eventually be considered better than Bird – but he’s got about a zillion miles to go before he belongs in that conversation.
LBJ has the talent
…the body (which is incomparable, really), and the smarts. Does he have the heart? The pedal-to-the-metal manic drive? Maybe. To be determined.
Insignificant Scrimmages
and on LeBron’s final basket, they automatically called a foul on Boston, making it +1 when there was no foul at all. Icing on the cake.
Guys, the Celtics played well last night. It was NOT lack of effort.
It was part Doc, part refs, and mostly
it was because the C’s just are still not 100% yet
nor should they play like their lives depend on it now to go all-out for a win at Cavaliers
during the regular season. I was actually worried Paul and KG may have been trying too hard, the last thing we can handle is if one of them gets injured MORE for a meaningless game.
Let’s support this team as they prepare for the playoffs
and recognize the fact that the remaining games are insignificant scrimmages.
I agree with that too!
The Cavs have had great regular seasons like 3 years in a row and have won zero games in the finals to show for it.
agreed. Did people forget about the Kobe-Lebron puppet ads during the playoffs last year?
the cavs have a lot to worry about in the playoffs, they can go down to boston, orlando, atlanta, and even the bucks. They were far from impressive yesterday.
Please stop with the meaningless game crap
This stuff is just ridiculous. If all of the games are meaningless, then why even bother to play them? “Prepare for the playoffs,” is another new phrase I guess we all have to adopt as we watch loss after loss against any team with any talent. Sometimes I wonder if this team was 0-63, the same people would be here talking about how they are just preparing for next year or two years after.
it aint crap
Doc stated many times that they haven’t practiced much together due to injuries, and that the new guys haven’t really practiced at all, so he sees these games as practices for the team. Sure they would like to win, but they also have to get guys some action together so they get used to each other and the plays, that’s just the way it is. It doesn’t mean they will suddenly turn it on by the playoffs, it just means they have a long way to go to get to where they should be at this time of year, and are trying to catch up. Do you really think that if yesterday’s game was a playoff game that Doc would have gone with the bench from the end of the 3rd to half way through the fourth while the game went from tie score to down 17? He wanted to get some meaningful burn for the bench, because well, half the bench just arrived a few weeks ago, and Davis is just getting back to shape (or whatever he considers as being in shape for him)
Look... they ARE meaningless
…whether you personally agree or not, they don’t mean anything anymore. HCA in the ECF is gone anyway. Who we play is irrelevant. We ARE going to the playoffs… given that, the next 17 games don’t mean anything in terms of won/lost… though of course, they do mean something in terms of player progress, readiness, health, etc.
2 weeks ago
I already said all of this doc sucks should have been fired 2 weeks ago the guy is clueless Perkins completely sucks and don’t even. Get me started with keeping bbd over powe what a joke wow!!!!!
by celtsfan1 on Mar 15, 2010 12:34 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Iowa Guy
I love your enthusiasm and I will always, always root for the C’s. But this spring won’t be any different, I fear, than right now. I still trust Ainge for the rebuild. maybe I shouldn’t nut I do.
Celts now have 549 Offensive Rebounds this year...
They are now within 67 of catching Golden State for the 2nd worst total in the league!
Does. Not. Matter.
They’ve also had the fewest offensive rebounding CHANCES by far.
They have one of the highest FG% in the NBA.
With their pace of play, they take fewer total shots (they also allow far fewer shots) than other teams.
Therefore they have the FEWEST MISSED SHOTS.
Given those simple facts, OF COURSE they won’t have a lot of offensive rebounds.
Further – they don’t put a premium on fetching offensive rebounds for a reason. Neither have our last two NBA championship teams (both 2008 and 1986 teams were well below average at grabbing offensive rebounds).
Being a league leader in offensive rebounds has pretty much zero correlation with winning.
He said for the 17849321489th time
Agree, of course :)
I`ve only said it 17,849,300 times
The Lakers lead the league in rebounds last year…AND they won the title!
Of course…Dr. Naismith {aka DRJ1} is also the one who keeps telling us that the Celtics are a lock to win the 2009-2020 championship!
I deny that!
If I said it once, I must have said it a MILLION TIMES: I never exaggerate!
The Cs will NOT win the championship 11 years in a row.
The 2009 Lakers also were 4th in the NBA in field goal attempts
and 7th in opponent Field Goal attempts. That’s a lot of shots in the air! Of course they lead in total rebounds.
The prior year, the Celtics were dead LAST in field goal attempts and 28th in opponent field goal attempts. They did generate a lot of misses by their opponents, though – holding them to 41.9% shooting – thus they managed to be a mediocre 12th in Total Rebounds. (Only 23rd in offensive rebounds).
The point is – its a stupid comparison. Different teams play at different paces and with different strategies.
Yes, rebounds are important. No, the rebound total rankings are not useful. Yes, the Celtics are a pretty decent, above average rebounding team when you look at their defensive rebounding efficiency.
Take it up with a few of Hall Of Fame coaches...
Jackson & Riley : “No rebounds, no rings”
Auerbach : “The object of the game is to put the ball in the basket. Thus, you need guys who will get you the ball….guys who can REBOUND!”
Sure It Does
And they suck on the defensive glass too. Our 20 million dollar power forward had exactly zero rebounds of any kind in the first half of yesterday’s game. Meanwhile, Anerson Varejao was creating extra possession after extra possession for the Cavs.
A rebound is an extra possession after a missed shot, period. It doesn’t matter if it is offensive or defensive.
Oh no
Now you’re in for it.
Let me save you the trouble, m. Here:
http://www.celticsblog.com/2010/3/11/1368765/understanding-rebounds-and-the
To Quote the Zen Master
“No rebounds, no ring.”
Or Pat Summitt: “Offense sells tickets, defense wins games, rebounds win championships.”
Where has mmmmm ever coached? This year NBA teams are shooting between 49% (Utah) and 43% (New Jersey) from the field. That means more than half of all shots are missed.
It was Dick Harter’s philosophy also that you should get back on defense and forget about offensive rebounds. It drove me crazy then and it drives me crazy now.
So .... you have proved my points wrong ... how?
I see nothing here that disputes the points of the article.
The fact that teams miss ~50% of shots is irrelevant. I never dispute that anywhere. The more important fact is to realize that roughly 70-75% of those misses will be grabbed by the defense, no matter what teams are playing.
Realizing that leads directly to the strategy employed by most good teams, including our own championship teams. Whether that drives you crazy or not.
And your point?
If you took the time to read the article, you’d know that I am not saying that rebounds aren’t important. They ARE important.
But as my article points out – you can’t just look at each team’s different rebound totals and compare them. If a team averages 110 possessions per game and everybody shoots a miserable 30% in those games then there are going to be a hell of a lot more rebounds than for a team that averages only 90 possessions per game in which everybody shoots 50%.
If a team misses their first shot on every possession but grabs half those (a HUGE percentage) and puts them back at about a 80% clip, they still will have only scored on 40% of their possessions while a team that simply shoots 48% will score on more – without grabbing a single offensive rebound.
The article points out 3 basic things:
1) That comparing rebound totals across teams is comparing apples to spaghetti.
2) That OFFENSIVE rebounds are less important than DEFENSIVE rebounds.
3) That the Celtics actually are a perfectly fine, above average rebounding team at grabbing defensive rebounds.
we not only got old quick
the league caught up with us.
would the 08 Celtic team beaten the orlando’s or Clevelands of today?
not sure about that.
To quote GW Bush
you misunderestimate the 2008 team. Look at their scoring margin, defensive FG% and efficiency, etc. That team was way better than the Magic and Cavs are this year. I don’t think a lot of people, including many fans, realize how dominating that team was. Miles better than every other team from beginning to end. But a lot of that got erased because the Hawks and the Cavs took us to seven games.
Actually I'm even more proud of that team
BECAUSE they earned in like nobody else ever did by going through all those playoff games.
No one could say that they were just handed the championship because of sub-par competition.
just a theory
they were pretty awesome… no arguing that… just feel those team have improved
and we have not.
Turning The Corner
That corner is a million miles away right now and the Celtics are quickly running out of time.
It doesn’t look like they’re going to be able to get this done.
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