Doc: "Either you’re on the bandwagon or you’re off"
Doc Rivers derides bandwagon - BostonHerald.com
"You don’t have to be (optimistic) because I am," he said. "I look at our team, and we played one bad night. We were playing great up until two games ago. Were you optimists three games ago? "Either you’re on the bandwagon or you’re off," Rivers continued. "I tell guys that all the time. That’s the way I think, and that’s how our team should think. I’m not going to spend time trying to convince you to dislike us or like us. Our team just has to keep working. "Should I worry about a team where you guys don’t think we can win anymore?"
I understand why a coach that is constantly being asked the same questions over and over might say this. And to be fair, I'm not sure he's using the term "bandwagon" in the best way here - because it implies the type of fans that literally give up on their team when things are going poorly. I don't think that applies to too many people who read this site regularly.
However, I don't think he "gets it" in terms of seeing this team from a fan's perspective. I'm all for being optimistic if that is your personality, but I'm not about to tell someone how to root for their team. Should we blindly believe that this team is going to win it all until the final horn sounds on the elimination game? If not, then when is it "ok" to doubt the team?
We're all fans here, but not everyone here is optimistic. I don't think that makes them "bandwagon" fans in the least. If I want to change my mind another 100 times about this team's chances, that's my right as a fan.
So with all due respect Doc, perhaps you don't have to convince me to like or dislike you with your words, but your team has to prove it on the court.
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Good Call Doc!
You’re either in or out. Either be a fan or stay home.
I don’t think he meant we should blindly believe our team can win. Any team can win it all. It’s a fan’s job to support the team and cheer them on as far as they go. There’s a difference between being optimistic and thinking your team can’t lose.
True!
You cheer your team through ups and downs. We could win it all but we also just make a good run in the playoffs. I think we at least make a run. That’s something to be excited about. The Spurs are probaby going to start in 8th seed and have had problems all too, but they could still win it all! We could also win it all. That’s all a fan or a team wants is a chance!
Go Celtics!!
I don't think Doc meant fans should accept the team as perfect
I think what he meant is that he can’t worry what the fans are thinking, that he is optimistic and has to see to it that his players are optimistic and believe they can win.
I do happen to agree with liamail, though, that all that can be asked of a team is that they put themselves in a position to win it all (which they do by making the playoffs) and hope skill and luck blow them across the finish line in first place.
by thirstyboots18 on Apr 1, 2010 9:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Doc's point is stupid
Being a fan doesn’t mean blindly following the team. This has been been a very up and down this season – they played over two months at a .500 pace. And yes they had a few nice wins recently, but they also had bad losses at Utah and at home to San Antonio, and then a loss at home to a young team that was able to outplay the C’s in the game’s final minutes. This was a team built to win a title – if fans want to question if this team is capable of that, there is nothing wrong with that. And when the Celtics have only one or two real quality wins since January, Doc should be a little less worried about the fans, and more worried about why the team doesn’t appear able to compete and win against the top teams in the league. Bandwagon would imply you only care when things are going good – that is not the case at all just because you want to see this team play better. Questioning, criticizing, and wanting to see more doesn’t mean you still don’t root and still don’t want to see the team do well. We all do. We just all may have different ways to express that.
That's not what Doc was saying at all.
He was directly addressing the media members present about THEM and how he and the team can’t think the same way. The team can never get off the bandwagon.
im just so fed up with what doc had to say after one loss after another
we will see how it plays out in the playoffs
by friedgreentomatoes on Apr 1, 2010 2:54 PM EDT reply actions
Doc : "I look at our team, and we played one bad night"
What about the other 21 “bad nights” since Christmas?
They don`t count?
man u guys....just nit picking...
47-27 is still a good record….the regular season is just there so we can make it to the playoffs…now that we have…just let it play out…speculating on it and going over it again and again is not gonna make a shred of difference…i think what doc means is if your a believer then ur gonna believe in the team..they made it to the playoffs…all teams start at 0 in the playoffs.. (homecourt issues notwithstanding) and from there its up to the team..for the whole season they have been claiming they will show up when it matters..and i believe they will…atleast they will give their all…banner 18 is on the way…just stick behind the big 3….no use adding to the doubters (everyone else in the league) who dont give this team a shred of a chance..i think thats what getting on or off the bandwagon means…so leave it at that!
Wow....just, wow
Doc was not talking to or about the fans. He is talking to and about the media.
by DRJ1 on Apr 1, 2010 3:32 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
That is true also, but it fits for the fans to and a lot of the fans it seems have jumped off the bandwagon
which I find ridiculous, if your a celtics fan you should be a fan through thick and thin.
exactly
AND he is illustrating the distinction between what the outside world might think and what he and the team HAVE to think.
Yes, fans have he right to waffle & doubt and cheer and cry and jump on and off the bandwagon all they want.
But the team HAS to believe they are going to succeed. Or they won’t.
I just don’t get the ridiculous self-righteous anger some fans on this blog exhibit towards Doc & the players whenever they say something that indicates that, despite whatever most recent setback may have occurred, they still believe they are going to right the ship and succeed. Sheesh! What the heck do these fans expect them to say? “We suck!” “Lets pack it in and go golfing!”
Have they ever admitted that they didn’t need to continue to work on improving? No. They aren’t blind to the issues that have troubled the team.
But there is no way I want any pro athlete or coach doubting their ability to get the job done. That would be putting a great big “Fire Me” sign on their back.
DOC is correct
as usual -
many fans (on this site and off) are fairweather -
i fine it’s more fun to stick with a team thru thick and thin (18 game losing streak anyone)
in the end, it makes things like BANNER 18 that much more satisfying
i’m on the bandwagon and won’t ever get off
Don't fake the funk on a nasty dunk
Celtic Bandwagon Picture taken three minutes after we won Banner 17

Right at ths moment it feels like this (room for my luggage and booze)
Is it Soup Yet?
by Master Po on Apr 1, 2010 3:49 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Just say no to bandwagons . . .
I certainly hope Doc is a bandwagon fan of this team, as he uses the word. If so, little wonder the team has shown so little improvement/consistency/adaptability throughout the season, and from quarter to quarter. One (non-bandwagon) fan can only hope that seeing the same team (at least) four games in a row will enable Doc and the team to adjust to what they are trying to do. I mean, you didn’t see KD, or DWade, or LBJ coming?
Doc should have other worries
Since when does Doc care what other people think? He needs to quit listening to the doubters and get back to the drawing board because this team’s margin of error is razor thin, something that magnifies his iffy in-game adjustment skills.
by SalmonAndMashedPotatoes on Apr 1, 2010 3:58 PM EDT reply actions
One thing is certain about this team . . .
they can beat anybody in this league, and they can lose to anybody in this league. It has nothing to do with being on a bandwagon. The question is whether or not this team can sustain great play for four out of every seven games once the playoffs begin. If not, then bring on football.
well said
optimism and bandwagons and the like are just rhetoric and pointless mental models.
a lot of real celtic fans (who desperately want their team to succeed) and journalists (who might not care one way or another) are using past performance to make evaluations and forecast future performance.
it’s not a question of optimism – it’s how the human brain performs analyses.
If those are the only two choices ...
Then I guess that I am off the band wagon because it needs to go into the garage for repairs. Its got a couple flat tires, a leaky radiator, a clogged fuel line and there is something wrong with the turbo.
The stupidest argument of all time
Centers around positive fans vs. negative fans and bandwagon jumpers and so on.
I think it’s safe to say ANYONE who posts here all the time, watches all the games, gets angry and argues on a regular basis and gets up and down with the fortunes of the team etc is ANYTHING BUT a bandwagon fan.
Can we please agree not to accuse people of being bandwagon fans on this site?
(And yes – I realize Doc was talking about the media)
I understand Doc's point...
A little history lesson called the “Memorial Day Massacre”. In the 1985 championship series against the Lakers the Celtics started off with a huge victory, 148-114. Everyone, except the Lakers, thought it was over. However, the Lakers went on to defeat the Celtics in 6 games, the first time the Lakers every beat the Celtics in a championship series. The lesson…one game, whether it is the Celtics crushing the Lakers or the Spurs embarrassing the Celtics, is not the final indication of what a team is capable of.
As much as the Celtics have me concerned I am still on the same “bandwagon” I have been on for the last 50 years.
Go Celtics!!!!
Go Celtics!!!!
I like this bandwagon :+)
And damn it – we really need the playoffs to start – the regular season has worn out its welcome.
by TheOutletPass on Apr 1, 2010 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Look at the above picture of Doc...
Regardless of what he says…Even he`s off the bandwagon!
what!
Doc, spend more time coaching and getting your team to be consistent and live up to their ability and less time throwing out the material you use when you give your motivational speeches. This team is under achieving PERIOD and you have a hand in that. The true fans still have faith but are pissed with the team’s urgency and performances. How about getting some statement wins under your belt this year! Wins that matter! We have a right to question the team’s status because there is alot to question……….sounds like a man that knows his time is not guaranteed.
The most frustrating thing for me, as a fan, is that the Celtics never admit that there is something wrong. They keep saying it was injuries, or come playoffs they will be ready. It would be nice if they could say we have too many turnovers, commit too many fouls, our bench is inconsistent, and our defense is not what it should be, but we are working on fixing these issues. The first step to rehab is admitting you have a problem.
YES
you nailed it! they are in total denial and if I have to hear Doc say “I like our team” one more time I’m going to lose it! let’s be honest…..this team as it stands right now….is not as good as we all expected and wanted……and there are various reasons for that.
They say this stuff after every single game they lose
How are you missing it?
by TheOutletPass on Apr 1, 2010 6:29 PM EDT up reply actions
I said it before... and I'll say it again
Doc needs to follow Al Skinner ……….out the door….
As much as I like Doc and defended Doc…..time has run his course and it’s time for some new fresh blood…. He’s certainly no Jerry Sloan
Great game. But great teams win games like that
Somehow, someway the great teams can play a lesser team even for 45 mins but find the way to win in the end. This is no longer one of those teams. I’ve called Rasheed lazy etc here but I have to give the old dog props. He came to play last night.
I was in my great seats, loving a great game. Rondo vs Westbrook was the best. That kid has jets. Jeff Greene…totally impressive. Durant….amazing. What a stroke. Krystic….does a good job keeping ball alive. Sefolosha….nice player. And all young.
Doc & Thibs, why didn’t you try Tony on Durant? Please don’t give me the conventional “Daniels is 2” taller". He was eating Ray and Daniels up. Tony should have gotten some minutes to see if he could deny Durant the ball or hawk his dribble.
That was a really fun game to watch. The call on Pierce was truly atrocious. But great teams win games like that. Somehow.
Ancient Red, Doc is still good at the player ubuntu and all that. He should get a new technician for D or challenge Thibs to be more creative. Teams have adjusted to what we do and we haven’t adjusted back. Unless they are saving such up for the playoffs (and my hope is eternal on that) they aren’t going far. Champion teams, at home, in full health puts down upstarts like Oklahoma.
My son was born in 1986
I put a celtics Jersey on him and we’ve rooted for the Cs ever since…through all the bad times and we watched them beat the Lakers in game 6 to win it all ! In a Boston bar in LA!
Through thick and thin! Just because you criticize them doesn’t mean youre not a fan… But you always need to hope they win!
I remember watching the sox the year they won the world series… Playoff game #4 against the yankies …down 3 games to 0 … late innings..I had no hope…been kicked in the teeth too many times by the Yankies…the camera zoomed to a young girl about 14 …she had a sox hat on and both fingers crossed… I thought if she still has hope I should too…then Roberts steals 2nd base…
A fan should never give up rooting…
But Doc was talking to the media…a different group…their job is to be critical and not necessarily care whether the team wins or not!
by Daveonthecape on Apr 1, 2010 7:35 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
When the Sox won that series.....
I cried. I grew up my whole life waiting for that. I was born in 1963. Red Sox fans are a loyal bunch. They always had hope and they hadn’t won in over 80 years.
I hope we can win but don't think we can with how we have been playing
I hope we can get it together and have trouble understanding why we’ve been so muddled
Because I think we won’t win doesn’t mean I won’t be crushed…I am already crushed thinking we just can’t do it.
I will root for them and not give up hope until the end. I’ll watch nearly every minute. Am I a bad fan??
No you are not.
I think they can win it all and I’ll be crushed if they lose. The doubters and the green glasses wearers/kool aid drinkers will all be crushed if they lose.
Doc
Needs to go, sorry. He continues to feed us BS excuses after every game on what went wrong. I live in Florida and get to watch some of the Magic game and SVG is one hell of a coach. And when he loses, he tells it to you straight on what happened. Doesn’t blow smoke up your tail pipe.
Doc seems like he is clueless at times on what is happening. How many times has the other team gone on a massive run and he won’t even bother to call a timeout to stop the bleeding and regroup? or The many times he goes full bench so we can get slaughter by the other teams’ starters. I don’t even want to get started on him pulling a player off the court that is playing great just to sub in a starter to get those minutes???
I will always be a celtic for life. I don’t mind losing, can’t win them all but to play with no heart or hussle is disheartening to watch. This team looks beautiful on paper but has the chemistry of a pickup group at the YMCA.
We need to get back on track and I believe change will start at the top, the coach.
Many here lack perspective
This season and the upcoming playoffs has been and will be a one game and one series at a time kind of year. The team has a lot of moving parts, so to speak, to get in sync and they have a chance in any series they play. I think Doc is really trying to say, let’s talk about the game and the team, but let’s not assess their chances to win the whole thing after every game, with the tone of the questioning depending on how the team did that night. That is the way many react here and on other blogs.
The team did a lot of things right last night, but could not stop Durant and could not keep Oklahoma off the glass for second chances that probably kept the Thunder in it and probably killed them more than Durant. A bad call or two in key moments also hurt their chance to win. It’s a scary game not to win, but Oklahoma’s a young team that can be scary good on some nights.
Ideally you have the main pieces of your team together, gaining consistent and confidence through the bulk of the season. Not the case for this team, so it will take a degree of belief by the players in themselves and their supporters in them, coaches and fans, to keep them positive, which is the best chance they have for working to come together to pull off series wins and hopefully enough of them to get the championship.
Do I think the team has as good a chance to win it all as I did at the start of the season? No. Do I think they can and hope they will? Yes and yes. I think that that is about as much as a fan can ask for, with health circumstances and some breaks having a big say in the ultimate outcome in most years, aside from those rare seasons that are seemingly seasons of destiny.
by SteveZ from Edgemont on Apr 1, 2010 10:03 PM EDT reply actions
"Many here lack perspective" says StevZ......
and some here lack tact and humbleness …..and might I add your perspective SteveZ won’t make headlines anytime soon ….although I might lack some insight you think I don’t have….
He was like a cock who thought the sun had risen to hear him crow.
………
Is it Soup Yet?
And a fair number in this set of comments have actually shown some perspective
Didn’t think I was writing anything that would ever make headlines, nevermind make them soon. I am sorry if you felt my remarks lack tact and humbleness (although not sure that was aimed at me). I’m not sure which of the groups you fall into, the with or the without perspective, but it is clear you fall into the humble group (except for the name which could be construed as a little self aggrandizing).
By the way, I can’t tell for sure, but I think you’re agreeing with me, but saying that it’s hardly newsworthy. I agree it’s not exactly news.
by SteveZ from Edgemont on Apr 2, 2010 12:00 AM EDT up reply actions
reality check
the celtics play this year is attrocious and next year needs to be a complete housecleaning—-bad atitudes should be a ticket to another team—-and fans should leave at halftime as a statement to the celtics poor 2nd half play throughout the season—-i guarentee the celtiocs will be in a funk come playoff time—-they practiced real hard for that!!!11
fans live and die with each game
players on the other hand have to get ready for the next game and can’t dwell on losses. COaches are the same; if they dwelled on losses they would go crazy. I get what Doc is saying but his approach is too simplistic and is unrealistic when it comes to sports fans who are emotional by nature. I don’t think Doc is placing enough weight on how demoralizing these home losses have been to fans. Each loss strips away a little hope and the losses to Cleveland,NJ,Milwaukee,Memphis, Cleveland ( again), Utah and the SPurs ( 4 of those being at home) tore away at the fan’s belief that this team could win a title. THis team has done very little this year to inspire and instill the loyalty that Doc thinks the fans should give. It’s hard to believe when every time there’s an opportunity to beat they good team, they blow it.
Finally Some Sense
I have been saying it forever. You root for your team to win or you don’t. Period. If you want your team to win, support them all the way. If you don’t, leave this team and never come back. Root for the Lakers or something, we don’t need bandwageners. I could say the same about Bruins fans, maybe moreso…
No more Cowbells!
by bestbostonsports on Apr 2, 2010 12:49 PM EDT reply actions
Glad to see that Doc agrees with
what I wrote yesterday, that among numerous culprits (refs, the Pope, daylight saving times, but certainly not Doc or the players) it’s the fans who must bear responsibility for the Celts lousy play. Maybe if they divvied up their millions—which apparently does not provide inspiration enough—with the hoi polloi, then the same hoi polloi might prove faithful until death do us part.
Well, Doc
You are sounding more and more like Rick Pitino in 2000. We know how this story turns out. Better start negotiating that severence package, buddy.
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