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Enjoy Next Season - We're On The Road To Lockout

We've been pretty spoiled thus far this offseason.  It has been one exciting news story after the next.  What that means on the court will have to wait until the games begin.  But imagine if the games didn't begin.  The next couple of months should be pretty quiet.  Imagine that quiet continuing on indefinitely.  That's what's going to happen next summer if things don't change drastically.

Owners, players have "amicable" meeting on a new CBA, but that is different than progress - ProBasketballTalk

The owners are pushing for a radical change in how the NBA's financial structure -- a hard salary cap, shorter contracts with not all of them guaranteed, some restrictions on player movement and more. The players basically like things the way they are now. Whatever they talked about for more than three hours in Manhattan, neither side was moving off those basic principles, which are so diametrically opposed. The current CBA can run for another couple years but the owners can -- and will -- opt out of it by the end of this year and force a new CBA for next season. I'll say again -- we are headed to a lockout next summer. This is not a maybe thing if you talk to people in NBA front offices. Everybody on both sides privately expects it. The only question is will it cost regular season games and if so how many. 

Man, I'm going to have to get REALLY creative if that happens.  I might have to start blogging about college basketball and some Euro leagues.

By the way, I found a cartoonist's depiction of the "negotiations" between the two sides.  I think that looks about right.

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NOOOOOO!

Personally, I am a basketball, Celtics, and celticsblog.com junkie! If this really happens (I really hope it doesn’t), we can only hope a resolution is resolved immediately or in as timely a fashion as possible. Damn, right when things couldn’t get more interesting in the NBA (at least from a Celtics, Heat or Lakers fan point of view), we have to deal with this non-sense. My biggest beef with this is I want as many games as possible of Shaq in green before he retires. I hope if this is truly so, it adds that extra bit of motivation to an already tremendously motivated Celtics team. I want to spoil Kobe’s possible 3peat, I want our big 3 and Shaq to get another ring, and most importantly, I want the Heat to take their “super team” and shove it up their asses!

by Mikey Bizzle on Aug 12, 2010 6:13 PM EDT reply actions  

Hehehe

I so agree with you.
And I’m an addict too.

by mmbaby on Aug 13, 2010 12:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

+1

You’re my hero. Love this posting.

by 1sport1team on Aug 13, 2010 8:48 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

I'll take this opportunity to thank you for all you do!

I’ve been reading here for a couple of years but didn’t sign up for an account until last month. But I have to say that it is one of the best and most well run blogs I have ever read/visited. I get almost all of my Celtic info on this board (I live in L.A.).

Your posts are timely, honest and easy to read. If there is a lockout, I hope you find other topics to write about on a daily basis.

by 17wasEZ on Aug 12, 2010 6:16 PM EDT reply actions  

ridiculous

so much money to go around for everyone. no excuse not to get something worked out by then unless one (or both) sides are just out to break the will of the other.

I’ll go nuts if this happens. I have a hard enough time dealing with the slow summer months here between the draft and training camp. I don’t think I can deal with a lockout.

by slamtheking on Aug 12, 2010 6:17 PM EDT reply actions  

If the owners get what they want......

Do you think they will lower ticket prices? How about parking? Concessions? If not, then I don’t care if everything stays as is.

And yes, I already know the answer to my rhetorical questions.

by 17wasEZ on Aug 12, 2010 6:22 PM EDT reply actions  

owners/NBA are wrong

I have to side with the players here. The NBA already has the most restrictions on player contracts. If teams are losing money (which I don’t believe for one second), it is their own fault. Look at the max contracts – 6 year deals for more than reasonable money. Are the top players in the game overpaid? Absolutely not. If teams overspend because they give max contracts to undeserving players, it is their own fault. If the league right now has a dollar for dollar penalty for teams that go over the cap, how does not having a hard cap hurt the league (from a financial standpoint). The NBA also has put in an age limit, a rookie wage scale. What else do they want? And i know no one dares criticize Stern, but if things are so bad for the league and the owners, isn;t it Stern’s fault? The current set up is entirely his doing.

by bigperm33 on Aug 12, 2010 6:34 PM EDT reply actions  

If you think they are not overpaid, you should think again. Believe me I think they shouldbepaid appropriately considering the league exists because of them, but the current state is a bit rediculous.

by Warrior Spirit on Aug 12, 2010 7:16 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

If you think they are not overpaid, you should think again. Believe me I think they shouldbepaid appropriately considering the league exists because of them, but the current state is a bit rediculous.

by Warrior Spirit on Aug 12, 2010 7:16 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

they may be overpaid in the general scheme of things, but the top players in the nba make reasonable amounts when compared to the top players in other sports. the problem in the nba, if there is one with the contracts, isn’t the size of them, but owners who can;t control themselves.

by bigperm33 on Aug 12, 2010 8:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

"The NBA already has the most restrictions on player contracts."

I have little expertise in such matters, but surely the NBA doesn’t have the most restrictions on player contracts.

For instance, no player’s multi-year contract in the NFL is guaranteed. The team can cancel the remaining years of any player’s contract. Try to imagine how that one revision would change things in the NBA.

by no kidding on Aug 12, 2010 9:56 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I would LOVE THIS in the NBA

It would make teams and games 100x more competitive, you wouldn’t have guys like Arenas killing the Wizards for 6 years or guys like Vince Carter who have one good, get max money and then sleep for the next 4

by D-Funnk on Aug 13, 2010 8:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

Well, in the NFL - they get their 'guaranteed' money up front

in enormous signing bonuses.

That means if a player got a 3 year, 9M contract plus a 3M signing bonus, if you cut him after 1 year, you already spent 6M of that 12M contract on him.

The the current NBA CBA has more restrictions in terms of what teams can do to hire players and in player salaries than most of the other big pro sports. They have specific bands within which each class of players can be paid, in different scenarios, and they have strict rules about how many years a player’s contract can extend and by how much it can change in salary from year to year (up OR down).

The NFL has a bit more leverage over non-star players, who don’t command as huge signing bonuses.

The NHL and Baseball are probably the worse structured. Both those leagues are a mess, in regards to their player contract structures.

by mmmmm on Aug 13, 2010 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Disagree

The NFL has non-guaranteed contracts. That alone makes it more restrictive then anything the NBA has. MLB typically has shorter deals.

I understand both sides of the NBA here likeing what they have. The players have guaranteed contracts, and no hard salary cap. On the flip side, the owners probably want to reign things in a bit. They’ll meet somewhere in the middle.

by Stanley1 on Aug 13, 2010 9:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

The NFL has gigantic signing bonuses.

That balances out the lack of guaranteed contracts.

by mmmmm on Aug 13, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Follow the Red Claws

During MLB strikes MiLB kept going. It wouldn’t surprise me if the same thing happened with the NBA and D-League.

The Euroleague itself is excellent. Go Barca!

"People don't understand, if you can't live the rest of your life off one year in the NBA, you can't live off 21." -- Keon Clark

by Eeyore III on Aug 12, 2010 6:42 PM EDT reply actions  

oh well..

More time to diss the Lakers and the Heat. ;)

by Papatrichs on Aug 12, 2010 6:53 PM EDT reply actions  

it seems inevitable

the contract structure is kind of insane. you basically have max contracts, mid levels, lower levels, and rookie contracts. not much else. not that i like the owners, but there is something to be said about good players getting max contracts. its a problem. though the owners are the ones offering the contracts in the first place. anyway, there is little doubt the CBA will change a bit, becoming more restrictive. teams spending like crazy this offseason will almost certainly regret it. ainge has been smart about the 2 year deals. he knows things are gonna change, and when they do, we’ll be in prime position to benefit. we’ll only have 2 big money deals, pierce and rondo.

by guy incognito on Aug 12, 2010 7:07 PM EDT reply actions  

Executive of the Year

It should go to Danny and not Riley for all the moves he made this offseason.

by Papatrichs on Aug 13, 2010 4:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

Agree

Riley’s pick ups connived to go to him. He didn’t chase after them. Danny had to find people and between he and Doc (especially in Shaq’s case) he went after them.

"I don't come to play, I come to WIN"--Larry Bird
"Criminally Negligent Officiating"--Tommy Heinsohn

by TrueGreen on Aug 13, 2010 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

well on a bright side

hoping and praying we win banner 18 we miss a few nba games more rest for the already old big 3 which will be even older if we make a long push 2 the finals and win it

think TITLE

by stylo617617 on Aug 12, 2010 7:21 PM EDT reply actions  

players/owners meeting in NY today

At the Team USA scrimmage tonight (lebron was there)…they annoounced that the meeting went very well today…and fourteen player reps were in attendance. They are going to have another meeting before training camp.

by thirstyboots18 on Aug 12, 2010 8:08 PM EDT reply actions  

I all for owners demands

Not rooting for a lockout, but the NBA’s rules, as they currently stand are an absolute joke. The salary cap rules are > 9 pages long and teams need hired “capologists” just to navigate them. Let’s be more like the NFL with a hard cap, and some non-guaranteed contracts – so we don’t have players like Eddie Curry just taking a paycheck and giving nothing back.

by libermaniac on Aug 12, 2010 10:31 PM EDT reply actions  

sure

pay scrubs top dollar but then cry for a bailout from the union-Stern is useless

by calc on Aug 13, 2010 12:16 AM EDT reply actions  

hard cap

the funniest thing about it would be the break up of the super friends. would be interesting to see how good they get along if they knew someone had to go.
besides that, as long as they pay guys like joe johnson almost 130mio$ the owners can’t talk about losing money

by jolly_roger on Aug 13, 2010 4:58 AM EDT reply actions  

I don’t know how it works in the other pro-sport leagues and I’m not even American but isn’t hard salary caps are better for big market teams? And for low-tax land teams? Small market teams have to overpay to lure top-free agents. I don’t want a hard salary cap if it just means more Lakers titles.
I don’t know how the NFL does it but they are more unpredictable than the NBA. There are surprise winners there AFAIK while you can pick 3 or 4 teams in the NBA for winner at the beginning of season and you can’t miss.

I’m all for non-guaranteed contracts though except for rookies.

by dexter11 on Aug 13, 2010 4:59 AM EDT reply actions  

It is hard to evaluate

1) What is the current and proposed revenue sharing arrangement. This will determine how well small market vs large market teams will do (of course you still have to have competent people running the franchise: I am looking at you Knickerbockers and Clippers)

2) The NBA has a more pronounced problem than other leagues because one or two players can be so game changing. It tends to drive up the bidding. At the same time, the results often don’t come, and then you have a payroll higher than your ability to draw. In football these screw ups are masked because such a large portion of revenue comes from league wide sharing, and the ability to reset each year since most contracts aren’t guaranteed.

3) Some sanity could be developed if they expand the concept of the minor leagues, and the ability to develop players cost effectively as baseball does (the only part of baseball finances that makes sense). Part of the problem is the limited talent pool is further reduced by lack of skill development because college stays are shortened.

4) We really have no idea of the finances of the owners: this could be crucial to the survival of a number of franchises, or it could be the perfect storm of opportunity to squeeze the players. I can’t tell you.

5) While free markets are good for most things, one of their virtues is inefficient participants go out of business. Having franchises fail would not be an outcome with which most fans would be happy. The question is what set of rules make it a level playing field

by Silverlock on Aug 13, 2010 5:32 AM EDT reply actions   1 recs

it's all about who has the most staying power

some of these teams lose money every year so for them the lockout may be beneficial financailly. there’s no question that the system has to change

by Red2 on Aug 13, 2010 8:18 AM EDT reply actions  

It's about reality...

These players all think they are entitled to huge contracts when their production doesn’t justify it or they just dog it once they get the contract so they don’t get injured before they sign their next one. They need to cut out the gaurantee like the NFL does. The NFL gets it right, everybody plays their hardest, or they get cut. The NBA would do better overall because you would have a more competitive product on the floor an no team would be perennially bad due to bloated contracts of losers (Hello, Mr. Arenas) on their cap. That is one of the reason why college ball is so enjoyable to watch, the players are all playing their hardest. Until they stop over paying players with long term gauranteed deals, the league will remain less competitive and less interesting than it can be.

by D-Funnk on Aug 13, 2010 8:58 AM EDT reply actions  

Owners are complaining about the players that signed contracts they offered?

Let’s put this the walmart way. If I’m a walmart manager and I offer Larry 50,000 a year for 4 years to work me, he accepts. Then after a year I don’t want to pay him anymore so now I’m going to have a lockout. I’m a dumbass right? Yup. Why do these owners sign these pampered athletes to these contracts in the first place? I dunno.. The only thing I can think of is there’s always going to be someone willing to pay them that much more money, so it escalates into a bidding contrest until the salary is way out of porpotion to the talent. I think they’ll meet in the middle. No hard cap, but more performance and team success incentives in contracts. And making 2nd, 3rd, 4th, ect years of a contract less and less percentage garaunteed. Anyway, I’m on the players side, all they did was sign on the
 dotted line.

the few, the proud, the boston celtics

by bleedgreen34 on Aug 13, 2010 10:27 AM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Dan Gilbert seems to be the most popular guy in Cleveland these days...

…now that LeBron has left. It’s almost as if Mark Cuban lost Dirk Nowitzki; there is just no qucik-fix to a franchise that has lost its star player. Just look at the SuperSonics, or the Timberwolves (to be fair, the T-Wolves were quite mediocre until the Kevin Garnett era).

I’m sure that next season will be alot rougher on Cavs fans than Raptors fans because of the fact that the Cavs helped to eliminate the Raptors’ chances of landing the 8th seed in the East, as well as injuring Chris Bosh. The Cavaliers had led the league in wins for the second consecutive year, and were within two wins of getting into the Eastern Conference Finals.

by Witch-King on Aug 14, 2010 8:32 PM EDT reply actions  

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